[REL] Thomsen's Ships V3.1 is out! All credits to H.SIE (10/12/2008)

[Fishers of Men]

This test results imply that, on the average, it took five additional minutes for your u-boat to detect the merchant ship with hydrophones, with 10% merchant ship engine reduction(less noise). That suggests that the merchant ship needed to be closer for the u-boat to pick up the propeller sounds. It might cause a u-boat on patrol to miss a number of potential targets.

Does this make any difference to the historical accuracy of the distance the hydrophone was suppose to reach? If not, the mod is not the problem I thought it was. Does anyone from the GWX team know the historical accuracy in SHIII?

FoM

[Jimbuna]

In RL if a submarine speed was 4 knots, the submarine's underwater sound detector average distance of detecting another object was:

- for a destroyer- 5 to 10 nautical miles,
- for a cargo ship- 3.5 to 7.5 nautical miles,
- for a convoy- up to 50 nautical miles.

The detection range however was also dependant on sea conditions.

[Sag75]

Hi to all, as I had already discussed with Thomsen, we may play with the mass ships instead of engines power.

This gives to ships a higher inertia, so not only the acceleration is lower, but the stop too! and probably the turning ability, also.
I know in .dat files there are the real ship mass values.. but are we sure SH3 engine computes 1 kg as a real 1 kg ?

[h.sie]

(deleted because of wrong information)

[Sag75]

Hi, no.. we won't get more points because they are linked to ship type and not to ship mass, ....at least, it's what I know!

So, yes.. we can have a try.. in my opinion it should be better than modify the engines power.

At that time, I increased my U-boat mass 10 fold to have an experiment, and I got a complete stop only after 10km after I turned off the engines! Moreover I was able to get a full speed only after 10-15 minutes! I don't remember the turning ability..
So, it should works...

[h.sie]

I have deleted my last posts above and I apologize for my wrong information and irritation. Newer tests show that the reduced eng_power-value DOES NOT affect the sound a ship produces and so does not affect the sonar range.


sorry, sorry!

[Fishers of Men]

Thanks for your honesty, h.sie. I was more upset about this mod not working correctly than the Swine flu panic. I will continue to use this mod with confidence. Any new development would be appreciated.

FoM

[Pvt. Public]

i found a problem, the type XXI u-boat speed is roughly 6 knots too slow in every config. surfaced, submerged, and submerged w/snorkel. submerged without snorkel gets 16 knots flank but that only lasts a few minutes as it will creep down to 13.

didnt notice this being mentioned on any of the last 3 pages or in the OP so i thought i would let you know.

[h.sie]

yes, I also found out, that reducing eng_power for submarines does not only reduce acceleration, it unfortunately also reduces max. speed, while for surface ships, eng_power does NOT affect max. speed, only acceleration, as desired.

for my private use, I plan to raise the max speed value of the submarines sim-files in order to compensate that effect. if there is any interest, I could share it with others, but I do not guarantee anything. use on your own risk.

h.sie

[Pvt. Public]

if it makes the subs behave like they should then by all means release it! what matters is how they perform ingame right?

now i have a question..
You'll never again see a ship sinking on it's own, no matter how hard the storm is.

is this because they were intentionally changed so that wouldnt happen or was it an unintended side effect? i will miss that happening, it was pretty funny to see.

[Fishers of Men]

I would be interested in the u-boat speed correction, if you please. Thanks for your research.

FoM

Originally Posted by Pvt. Public

You'll never again see a ship sinking on it's own, no matter how hard the storm is.

A Ship sinking in a storm is a result of the Damage zones
being flooded in Game.

This is something that happened,
and still happens,
in real life.

SH3 has a somewhat real approach to this.
To totally remove this is paramount to
changeing the physics of the real world.

No Ships will ever sink in a Storm henceforth!

[h.sie]

if I remember correctly, there was a special mod created called SinkingShipFix from SubTypeZero, which prevents ships from sinking by high waves. I guess, it has been done by lowering the gc_height value. Thomsens mod also lowers gc_height. That might be the reason, that ships don't sink by waves.

In a few days I'll make a private version of that mod with gc_height not so drastically reduced, so that ships are not so very stable as in Thomsens mod.

Originally Posted by Pvt. Public

if it makes the subs behave like they should then by all means release it! what matters is how they perform ingame right?

now i have a question..
You'll never again see a ship sinking on it's own, no matter how hard the storm is.

is this because they were intentionally changed so that wouldnt happen or was it an unintended side effect? i will miss that happening, it was pretty funny to see.

[h.sie]

...as one easily can find out, reducing eng_power for Submarines also drastically reduces their maximum speed for stormy weather. The max. Speed for Surface Ships is NOT affected by eng_power.

So I suggest not to mod the Submarines, because otherwise they would have a big disadvantage in heavy seas.

People who want to follow my suggestions can do the following:

1. Disable the Thomsen Mod using JSGME
2. Delete the Submarine Subfolder of the Thomsen Mod.
3. Enable the Mod.


But if desired, I also could make a new downloadable Mod with Submarine folder already deleted.

[Fishers of Men]

I think making a new download file with the submarine folders removed would be the best choice. Too many new captains coming on board would not know about the u-boat speed problem and leave the folders in believing they belong. I would probably, if reinstalling the mod, forget to remove the folders and question why all u-boats were moving so much slower in heavy seas. I do forget things, sometimes.

Thanks for asking for our opinions.

FoM