Here we go again-Ukraine once again pt2

[mapuc]

It is said he who is asking for a ceasefire is the one who's in trouble on the battlefield



Markus

[mapuc]

Markus

[Dargo]

[Dargo]

[mapuc]

Markus

[Rockstar]

Shoigu’s removal, generals being arrested, counter strikes on Russian soil. Here I was told all this was supposed to be impossible without U.S. F16’s and ATACMS.

Russia is slowly withering away.

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Shoigu’s removal, generals being arrested, counter strikes on Russian soil. Here I was told all this was supposed to be impossible without U.S. F16’s and ATACMS.

Russia is slowly withering away.

Yes the Ukrainians are using their suicide drones in Russia.

With F16's and ATACMS the attack would be a lot easier and harder for Russia to stop. This is if the rockets and missiles are equip with anti-Jammer

Markus

[mapuc]

If you take the accuracy of the Russian shelling into account-The different isn't 3 to 1. but more likely ½ to 1.
(I could be wrong)



Edit
Is this number of dead and wounded Russian soldiers correct ?


End edit

Markus

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Yes the Ukrainians are using their suicide drones in Russia.

With F16's and ATACMS the attack would be a lot easier and harder for Russia to stop. This is if the rockets and missiles are equip with anti-Jammer

Markus

There are no such things as game changing weapons. ATACMS are good but they’re not that good. If Ukraine started lobbing US delivered rockets it’s not very likely it would escalate into a nuclear war. But it could ignite a patriotic fervor in Russian ranks. As it is morale and determination is low so why ruin a good thing?

As for F16’s I wouldn’t expect very many because finding reliable pilots may be difficult. How many East German pilots did you see integrate into Federal Defence Forces of Germany? ZERO

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

There are no such things as game changing weapons. ATACMS are good but they’re not that good. If Ukraine started lobbing US delivered rockets it’s not very likely it would escalate into a nuclear war. But it could ignite a patriotic fervor in Russian ranks. As it is morale and determination is low so why ruin a good thing?

As for F16’s I wouldn’t expect very many because finding reliable pilots may be difficult. How many East German pilots did you see integrate into Federal Defence Forces of Germany? ZERO

No not counted as gamechanger no. This was not what I meant by my post

They will be a huge assess to the Ukrainian groundforces.

The F16's will make life a little easier for the groundforces who has to deal with Glide bombs dropped from Russian fighter jets far behind the frontline. The Ukrainian pilot who is being trained is/has showing exceptionel skills in flying the F16(heard this from a Danish fighter pilot trainer)

The other weapons could make a different when attacking Russian soil.

Maybe it is due to fear among the NATO members, that a conflict between Russia and NATO could come very close, if NATO give Ukraine the green light.

Markus

[Rockstar]

I don’t think reluctance to allow our weapons to be used on Russian soil is driven by fear. More to instilling in the Russian mind the fight is with Ukraine not the US or NATO as Lavrov keeps insisting, intent is to demoralize Russian soldiers. Step on Ukrainian soil you die, stay on your side you live.

Who knows Im just guessing


Also a lot of Ukraine’s inventory of fighter jets are in the process or have been improved to carry a lot of different western payloads that F16s carry.

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

I don’t think reluctance to allow our weapons to be used on Russian soil is driven by fear. More to instilling in the Russian mind the fight is with Ukraine not the US or NATO as Lavrov keeps insisting, with intent to demoralize Russian soldiers. Step on Ukrainian soil you die, stay on your side you live.

Who knows Im just guessing


Also a lot of Ukraine’s inventory of fighter jets are in the process or have been improved to carry a lot of different western payloads that F16s carry.

We are all somehow guessing and most of us use different experts to strengthen this.

True, many of their MIG29's pylonton have been altered so they can carry weapon produced in the west. Only thing they haven't improved is the radar on the MIG29's and they is lacking medium to longrange air to air missiles, which will be part of the weapons on the F16.

Markus

[Skybird]

China is no doubt getting info on how Russia jams out Western intelligent ammunitions. This is worrying since the West and the US depend a lot on maintaining a technological suoeriroity adavantge to compensate for their inferior numbers. When I read that HIMARS now is being described as practically unusable anymore and the super-expensive Excalibur self-guiding shells for artillery are down to a hit rate of 10% and less, then this is a kind fo warfare that is economically not only extremely expensive, but also doe snot rais eoto miuch trust. I read also that ATACMS already saw their hit probability jammed down to less than 40%. And they are not that long is use alrerady. It also means that Ukraione miust increase the number of missile s used in a swarm attacks suffciently to see chnaces ot get some pof its ammous gettign nthorhgh the defences. And these ammos then get expleted faster and Ukraine runs out of them earlier.



We always only hear about the successes of Ukraine, if it has them. We never hear of how much the successes costed in investment, and how high Ukraine's losses were.



China really must learn a very lot from this war.



I also reayl wpudl like to know abotuz the abltiy of US forces to wage robust war in case of its hgih techn advanatge and stalleite dpeendecy turnign against it. I mean if all that networking ans high tech wizardy gets taken out of the equation. It would affect global logistics maintenance as well, of course, not just fighting ability.


Dumb ammuntiion in jigh numbers, and platforms not meant to be super complex in maintenance, have their ownc harms in war. I am a bit sceptical about these Western high tech primadonna systems.



In fact I am quite sceptical. In war you dont want exentric race horses. But robust farming work horses. It seems of the Western system delivered, the Bradley gets the balance very right. Robust amd fast like the German Marders, but delivering a significantly higher punch. But also beign reatively simple to maintaion, it seems, easier at least than the Abrams and Leopards-2. Soemtimes I red news on the Leopard-2s that gave the impression that maintaining the logistics network for spare parts for them is a nightmare for, Ukraine. Also, the wear and tear on them and the Abrams is much higher than was expected, both tanks do not like the terrain in Ukraine, were not designed for it, it kills their lower wheels and their gears quite fast, it gets reported. Especially the Germans find it difficult to keep up with the delivery of spare parts. The German industry is no longer set up to produce and deliver at this pace. - Lessons to be learned for the Eurppean NATO tank fleet. Amongst Europeans, the Lropards are the most used MBTs. And then this low rate of supply deliveries? Maybe the Polish anticipated this when they ordered tanks in Korea instead. Some months ago I red an analysis of a German insider somewhere who projected that as a concsequence of the ukriane war the German defence industry will lose shares on the global market due to customers becoming hesitent to buy certain german heavy weapons anymore. The German ability to guarantee supply with spare parts is in doubt. And this is during a situation when international deliveries of critical raw materials to Germany and its industry are not even seriously challenged or disrupted. How then would it be if their would be a crisis limting these dpeveries to and formGermany? The German navy in no way is able to protect shipping supply lines. Its overstretched, while havign dropped so low in numbers that it cannot even guarantee control, of the Baltic sea anymore where its main responmsibility should focus, in my opinion. But they just send another lonely frigate to the Chinese Sea for some stupid political symbolism...? Last time they did that, not long ago, they did not even dare to go through the Taiwan Strait. Them Ger,na navy's playground cannot be the other side of the plaent. It must not even be the North Atlantic, but it must mostly be the Baltic. Too low numbers for playing on a bigger playfield.

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by mapuc

We are all somehow guessing and most of us use different experts to strengthen this.

True, many of their MIG29's pylonton have been altered so they can carry weapon produced in the west. Only thing they haven't improved is the radar on the MIG29's and they is lacking medium to longrange air to air missiles, which will be part of the weapons on the F16.

Markus

Sucks being them I guess, they had thirty years to improve the RADAR and their national defense. Also, like I said earlier I wouldn’t expect many, if any, F16’s because they most likely have very few qualified pilots. They will have to be very young men and women dedicated to defending the sovereignty of Ukraine and not take a shiny new F16 to the nearest Russian airbase. Hope they find them and get them trained.

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Sucks being them I guess, they had thirty years to improve the RADAR and their national defense. Also, like I said earlier I wouldn’t expect many, if any, F16’s because they most likely have very few qualified pilots. They will have to be very young men and women dedicated to defending the sovereignty of Ukraine and not take a shiny new F16 to the nearest Russian airbase. Hope they find them and get them trained.

Neither do I know the exact number of Ukrainians pilot who's being trained in flying the F16

More on this green light to use weapon and ammo against targets in Russia.
Each day yes even each hour Russia is sending artillery, rockets and missile from their side into Ukraine.

So I say Ukraine should have the right to destroy these weapons.

Markus