Oscar II subs for who???

[Type941]

it'll go to India - the US would not make a big stink about it. You know, after they reversed on nuclear proliferation treaty themselves, making an exception for them.

Russia might give China fighter planes, but I doubt it's too eager to give China nuke platforms...

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by SUBMAN1

China. Does Russia know that it could be sealing its own fate with all these sales?

-S

It is between that and completely freezing their military-industrial complex, which in the long run will be even more harmful for their security.

[Kapitan]

China relys on russia for alot of things should russia pull the plug on that then china would fall apart in a matter of months, china isnt 100% self sufficent.

[Mike 'Red Ocktober' Hense]

don't let the point that the growth of Chinese economy is reshaping the very dynamics of the region escape you...

they've exhibited a demonstrated proficiency in all technical fields that constitutes the range of knowledge from which weapons systems and counter weapons systems would be built...

they have one of the largest populations in the world...

they have ethnic populations in every country in the world...

the collision of economic and industrial interests in the Korean penninsula, in Honk Kong, and the uncontrolled military build up of the last few years... tied along with the mindless western adventures in the middle east reducing the response capabilities of the US, UK, and even the Russians...

these factors make it a certainty that the future confrontation will be between China and someone... and current trends indicate it will eventually go nuclear...

and in the end, if anyone is left, they will undoubtedly bespeaking mandarin...


but getting back to the Oscar and India... the effectiveness of any weapons system today is measured by the total system it is integrated with... without such a system, all you have is a potential risk, and a unwarranted drain on your economy...

--Mike

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by Mike 'Red Ocktober' Hense

but getting back to the Oscar and India... the effectiveness of any weapons system today is measured by the total system it is integrated with... without such a system, all you have is a potential risk, and a unwarranted drain on your economy...--Mike

On the other hand, a system starts with its individual pieces, so if you are ever going to get a good system you have to start by writing up a doctrine, then buying the best pieces in the correct proportions (read the doctrine) to build your system.

[Vinay]

India has operated a nuclear sub leased from USSR. That was returned and now it is again speculated of nuclear subs in IN. It is also speculated that the India is building N-subs with Russian assistance.

[Kapitan]

its not speculated its true both akulas are near ready to go.

[Rav3n]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

its not speculated its true both akulas are near ready to go.

What akulas? Earlier reports said the newly launched Nerpa was to be leased for 10 years to India, but now Russian officials denies the reports. The Nerpa will join Russia's Pacific Fleet in 2007.

[Kapitan]

I can assure you its not fitting out is now and she will be leased soon very soon !

[Rav3n]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

I can assure you its not fitting out is now and she will be leased soon very soon !

Any news on this?

[baggygreen]

Originally Posted by Mike 'Red Ocktober' Hense

question...

1- who is India preparing for war against... all this military procurement lately

Oooo goody, something i wrote at uni actually comes in handy. India are threatened by China on one side, and Muslim states on the other. For people saying "why china?" it is two-fold - one because they are the 2 biggest nations in the world, they both have rapidly growing economies that cannot be sustained independently, and hell, they share a common border. A lot of it is to balance against the perceived chinese threat (who i might add, are extending their loose, unofficial alliances right down to border India on the east as well as north). The second chinese threat is well, "mummy johnny has one, i want one too". balance.

As far as the muslim nations threat bit goes, well hey we've got a lot of extremists calling for a global islamic state. Probably never happen. But, if they were to unite at least all the muslim nations of the world, well hey, you got a stretch from the ME and North Africa across to Indonesia. And look, smack bang in the middle you got a democratic society, modernising and so getting close ties to the west, and hey, majority Hindu - Hindu and Muslim = tension. add in extremists on either side, n you got more than 15% of the worlds population fighting in 1 country alone! that would be bad.

Originally Posted by Mike 'Red Ocktober' Hense

2- why would they think that having nuclear weapons makes them more secure... it didn't make the US or USSR any more secure during the cold war...

All about MAD, mate. and seeing as the Pakistanis have them, there ain't no way India's giving em up! plus, following on from above, if you got a billion crazy, not-afraid-of-death-as-a-perceived-martyr soldiers coming knocking at your door, you need a pretty big can of fly spray to knock em down....

Originally Posted by Mike 'Red Ocktober' Hense

3- why would the Russians supply the Indians with a long range nuclear delivery capability... one that will definitely be harder to target should the need arise...

Russia fighting India is a hell of a lot less likely than Russia fighting china, or china fighting India. India and russia are getting very cosy lately, i wouldnt be surprised to find a pact or alliance between them in the near future (next decade or so). China will of course, feel threatened by it (it is aimed at them after all..). Suppose china and india go to war - its in Russias interests to help the indians to destroy their most likely rival. And suppose russia and china go to war. "Hey mr india, we gave you all these lovely weapons, come help us or you'll be next in line!" "ok mr russia, i'll help you with these lovely submarines you gave me"

Originally Posted by Mike 'Red Ocktober' Hense

4- do the Indians think that they can financially sustain the infrastructure required by these new resources...

You'd be surprised. Everyone focusses on China being the great economic powerhouse, and india gets left behind. Granted, half (i think less, but hey) of the population is below the poverty line. that still leaves oh let me think.. about 3/4 of a billion people to drive the indian market. big numbers. couple with the number of foreign companies investing literally billions of dollars there, plus the Indian economy reaping the benefits of intergration into a globalised world.. yes, they think they can afford it.


go me.


(pick it to pieces if you dare... i mean like... )

[Oberon]

Hate to break it to you Baggygreen...but Mike left ages ago

You may be waiting a while for any reply from him....

[baggygreen]

:rotfl:


Nah i did know that, he's been a conspicuous absence! But i figured that it was a question that hadnt been answered on the thread, and so it wasnt directed at him exactly - more just throwing some answers out into the general interwebness of the net...