Present: 1 ; Medieval: 0

[August]

A couple points:

First, philosophy isn't taught in K thru 12 public schools, neither is religious education/studies/whatever you want to call it. There is however some greek and other pagan mythology taught in history class, but other than that it's either darwinism or nothing.

Second Darwinism and ID are not mutually exclusive, "if you believe in one you have to reject the other", theories. It is possible that evolution was the means used by an ID to create the world.

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by August

First, philosophy isn't taught in K thru 12 public schools, neither is religious education/studies/whatever you want to call it. There is however some greek and other pagan mythology taught in history class, but other than that it's either darwinism or nothing.

Well in history class we covered not just Greek and Pagan Mythology but Christian and Islam beliefs as well, and in my earth science class on the subject of the formation of the earth/universe the teacher gave a little verbal disclaimer saying she wasn't trying to contradict anyone's religious beliefs she is just stating the facts as science knows them and 7 days to humans maybe not be 7 days to God etc.

Also I would bet my Participation in Government class is debating this subject right now since its getting so big in the media. Back when I was there it was mainly the War in Afghanistan that was the subject of debate.

[Hitman]

It is impossible to either prove or disprove the existence of god

I already argued long about that in another topic, and I believe that statement is not right. We can prove the existance of God at least to the same degree we can prove the former existance of ancient cultures -today dissapeared- through the evidences they left visible.

That's only my opinion, of course, but I have read way to many philosphers trenched in the eternal doubt debate and unwilling to accept different reasons even if they can't argue against them except with the "Oh but you can't be sure, it could as well be or not be, nothing is for sure" :hmm:

[bradclark1]

Originally Posted by donw

Something was once told to me, that I have never forgotten...

"When my last day on earth is before me, and the end is in sight, I would much rather have lived a life believing in God, and find out I was wrong....then NOT believing...and be wrong

Don't eat peanuts because you might get cancer.
Don't cross the street because you might get run over by a bus.
Don't....................... because you might ....................
Don't....................... because you might ....................

Gotcha. Better safe than sorry.

[Skybird]

Prove or disaprove the existence of Gods? Is that even needed...? What use could it even have to have a final answer? It still would be your life, your burden, your pain, your joy, your potential, your faults, your responsebility - your life, your fate.

Don't believe in hear-say, but base on your experience you were able to live yourself and what you have seen how it leads for the good or the bad of people when under reasonable examination. Then decide to stick with it or to put it aside, or to help to stand up against it. No one else's theories needed for this way of doing, no powerpolitics of priests and religious institutions, no trust in egos of people that are not you yourself and whom you never will be, and never know in full truth. Why blindly trust in hear-say when you are surrrounded by a myriad of daily experiences yourself to help you understand who you are?

Even as a small child I never understood what tamtam is made around heaven and hell, God and the devil. Never needed it, never wanted it, never saw any help coming from believing in it. My first religions teacher I drove crazy at the age of 8 by asking justified questions and he banned me from class for the remaining two years at that school, my first church priest I made kicking me out at the age of 12 by pointing at the contradictions in what he said. I deserve medals for that!

And if someone tells you he has experienced the presence of this or that God or evil, and that he knows now the "truth, the "real" truth that is, for sure - of what use can that be for you? It is him, not you. and if a religion demands you to obey the rules of this or that someone, this or that God - it will be the small little deeds of you human beeing only. A god depending on such small deeds surely cannot be a very impressive one.

there is only one thing you can be sure of beyond doubt - and that is the precious experience of the present moment that is all you will ever have. And in it all universe is yours, forever, without time.

Dornfelder medium red wine. You should try it! Tastes wonderful. In vino veritas - as long as I do not remember that terrible wine trading agreement between the EU and the US.

[Iceman]

John 20
25] The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the Lord. But he said unto them, Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe.
[26] And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you.
[27] Then saith he to Thomas, reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.
[28] And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
[29] Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.



Each man must be convinced in his own way...some can believe having not seen...some have to see...and still don't believe.

Merry Christmas

[The Avon Lady]

I wonder if that's where the English word "holy" came from? :hmm:

[jumpy]

hehe