22nd June 1941

[Oberon]

3:15

One of, if not the most decisive parts of World War Two begins.

[Jimbuna]

In that particular theatre I'd would have thought it would have been Kursk

[CCIP]

Originally Posted by jimbuna

In that particular theatre I'd would have thought it would have been Kursk

Lots happened in the two years before Kursk. In fact from the very first weeks, when the Germans failed to get to their initial aims, it was already decisive.

[Torplexed]

"We need only kick in the door and the whole rotten structure will come crashing down." --Adolph Hitler

Famous last words.

I remember being stunned by the numbers reading about it as a kid. When it comes to military operations Operation Barbarossa has no equal in history. Number of combatants involved, sheer physical scope, hatred and ruination, the Russo-German War of 1941-45 was staggeringly immense. I recall reading that Eisenhower was shocked when he flew over the devastation while flying to a victory celebration in Moscow. Not a house left standing for hundreds of miles.

[CCIP]

Originally Posted by Torplexed

I remember being stunned by the numbers reading about it as a kid. When it comes to military operations Operation Barbarossa has no equal in history. Number of combatants involved, sheer physical scope, hatred and ruination, the Russo-German War of 1941-45 was staggeringly immense. I recall reading that Eisenhower was shocked when he flew over the devastation while flying to a victory celebration in Moscow. Not a house left standing for hundreds of miles.

Yeah, for me growing up in Russia, it was really something to be surrounded by the material history of the war. I can't understand how people can avoid being touched by it - everyone's been affected somehow.

My own moment as kid came when I was at the Piskarev Cemetery on a cloudy day with almost noone around. Everyone always looks at the monument, but I was just fixated on the mass graves there - a patch of ground that's barely a few football fields in size. It just blew my mind that 500,000 people were buried there, most of them dead by cold and starvation, and that was but a tiny fraction of those killed in that war. Still gives me chills when I think of the moment when, somehow, the reality of that figure dawned on me while standing right among the rows of flat, nondescript ground where hundreds of thousands rested.

[Torplexed]

Originally Posted by CCIP

Yeah, for me growing up in Russia, it was really something to be surrounded by the material history of the war. I can't understand how people can avoid being touched by it - everyone's been affected somehow.

My own moment as kid came when I was at the Piskarev Cemetery on a cloudy day with almost noone around. Everyone always looks at the monument, but I was just fixated on the mass graves there - a patch of ground that's barely a few football fields in size. It just blew my mind that 500,000 people were buried there, most of them dead by cold and starvation, and that was but a tiny fraction of those killed in that war. Still gives me chills when I think of the moment when, somehow, the reality of that figure dawned on me while standing right among the rows of flat, nondescript ground where hundreds of thousands rested.

The number that always struck me was the 800,000 dead at the siege of Leningrad. More than the US lost in the whole war. You wonder how a nation goes through misery like that without melting down. Maybe a history of similar miseries helps?

On a lighter note I found this Theodor Geissel (Dr. Seuss) editorial cartoon from June 1941 New York newspaper very appropriate.

[Lord Justice]

Originally Posted by CCIP

but I was just fixated on the mass graves there - a patch of ground that's barely a few football fields in size. It just blew my mind that 500,000 people were buried there, most of them dead by cold and starvation, and that was but a tiny fraction of those killed in that war. Still gives me chills when I think of the moment when, somehow, the reality of that figure dawned on me while standing right among the rows of flat, nondescript ground where hundreds of thousands rested.

Yes, I remember watching a documentry few years ago, and one vetran form the ss das reich or leibstandarte was telling of how so many bodies piled up in front of them, in wave after wave attack of (woman regiments) whilst charging his lines. He shed no tear as some do in these progs, but did mention that he and his men were horrified at the site of all these woman falling before the machine guns, when the machine guns had stopped and still smoking he said some of the men were crying but it was them or us!!