Iranian Navy Exposes a US Navy Weakness

[krashkart]

As a lifelong southpaw I feel it is necessary to step up to the plate in our collective lefty defense. Lefties are not wimps. We are merely in our right minds.

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by Skybird

The Dolphins are extremly quiet, so one could even ask what decent ASW procedures there are against them - the Dolphins are Israel's name for the German type 212 class (214 for export versions), and regarding quietness and general stealth that class is at the very top of the international competition, not to mention the long leg it has for staying submersed. Also, although a conventionally armed Dolphin is a local anti-shipping derrent that in the limited space of the Red Sea finds somewhat ideal hunting grounds, the Israelis probably have already finished to adapt the torpedo tubes for launching nuclear armed cruise missiles, which makes the Dolphins also regional, strategic deterrants.

Two more Dolphins have been willed by Germany to be delivered to the Israeli navy. And this time, different to the first two boats, the Israelis even will need to pay for them. In case of a shooting war at sea between Israel and Syria or Iran, hostile navies will totally hate to have to deal with these boats.

Actually the Dolphins are more closely related to the Type 209 class. They predate the 212 by a number of years. They have a down side in that their endurance is only 30 days. The two new Dolphins the Israeli Navy is receiving might have had their endurance increased since they are equipped with AIP (guessing Fuel Cells)

[Skybird]

Heck, you are right, I had it wrong. I always believed to have read the Dolphins are a special variation of the export version of the 212 (a modified 214), but in fact they indeed are not the successors to the 212, but it's precessor. The earlier developement of the Dolphins gave the Germans experiences which influenced the design of the 212, and probably later modifications of the Dolphins as well.

I should have noticed it earlier myself just when looking at photos of the towers. They obviously look different for the two classes.

I wonder if the boats number 4 and 5 the Israelis are receiving are a newly developed (AIP-equipped) Dolphin, or if they ordered thge more advanced design of the 214 and just call it "Dolphin". The latter would make more sense if they want to enter the Persian Gulf or maintain a presence in the Red Sea for longer time.

[Matador.es]

Originally Posted by Skybird

I think Israel does its best to track ALL supply and smuggle routes their enemies have on sea and on land, namely for Hamas, Hezbollah and Syria. Remember the bombing of the Northkorean reactor in Syria? The Gaza blockade? Intel activity of the Israelis in Lebanon and in the Palestinian territories?

It might surprise you, but the oposit is true. though israel has a special place in my heart, i must admit that israel is not always as clean in this as they claim to be. It the lates bombardments in Gaza (2008-2009) the infrastructure was "destroyed". I saw a UN report with an inventory of what was destroyed. Since its a UN report i consider it true. Just for the idea of what was destroyed.

* All government buildings
* Police stations
* Prisons
* Factory areas, especially Bread, cookies (food)

Of the about 1200 tunnels which off course are used for smuggling (not only weapons, most food and black market stuff) only a few were hit. Dont recall the exact number but less then 5 i thought.

If you want to make sure Gaza would become self supporting, you would not destroy all needs to govern it. But Israel did destroy everything needed for a basic/ normal control. And they left all that undermined common government like black trade markets.

Israel is not at all out for blocking its opponents for supplies.

Israel and Iran share the same point of view in contrast to the USA in regards from the current Iranian Ship "Crises", both benefit from the rising oil prices.

When you have no decent ASW weapons in your navy and your sworn enemy that has a habit of launching surprise attacks deploys a submarine near where you are sending your ships that tends to make you worried about the likelihood of those ships reaching port.

What gives you the faintest indication the Iranians really care if the ships reach port?
If they don't care then it is no deterrant at all
They have set up a win/win situation.
The only question is, are the Israeli government dumb enough to make it a really big Iranian win gift wrapped and with a pretty ribbon.

Cool. Can they come up with a pet term for you?

Pet name? Bubbles.

[Gerald]

Two Iranian warships have entered the Suez Canal to make a passage to the Mediterranean Sea, canal officials say.

Iranian officials have said the warships are headed to Syria for training, a mission Israel has described as a "provocation".

"They entered the canal at 0545 (0345 GMT)," Suez Canal officials said.

It is believed to be the first time since Iran's 1979 Islamic Revolution that Iranian warships have passed through the waterway.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12533803

Note:22 February 2011 Last updated at 11:37 GMT

Reuters, why open another topic on the Iranian ships?
Couldn't you just put you cut and paste article in the existing one as whole topics of the forum are ending up as just you posting few lines from the BBC.

[Matador.es]

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=180423
But thanks, its on the World Navel News now as well

Same story, differant source:
http://www.defencetalk.com/iranian-n...z-canal-32269/

They paid U$D 290.000 for the two ships to pass though the suez. Which is quite cheap i think.

This or next weak a container from China will pass Suez (if it makes it through the Gulf of Aden). It will coast me about 8 U$D. My transport agent ones told me that an averange cargo can hold between 6000 and 12000 containers of 20". a 6000 container 20" ship will pay U$D480.000. But i am not sure if that number of containers is correct plus, my agent may charge me more that it costs...

Edit://Tribesman, did not see your replay when i started writing.

[Matador.es]

Monday, February 21, 2011
Iranian Navy Set to Cross Suez Canal
The Associated Press has confirmed when the Iranians will cross the Suez Canal.

Suez Canal officials say two Iranian naval vessels are expected to start their passage through the strategic waterway early Tuesday.

Canal officials say the ships are expected to pay a fee of $290,000 for the crossing. The officials spoke on condition of anonymity because they aren't authorized to speak publicly about the matter.

If the ships make the passage, it would mark the first time in three decades that Iranian military ships have traveled the canal that links the Red Sea to the Mediterranean.
It seems pretty clear that from the Iranian point of view, this is a communication exercise. Timing for Tuesday, they are hoping for maximum impact to make the headlines on Tuesday as folks get back to work after a three day weekend.

The question isn't if anyone will do anything - the US Navy guarantees freedom of the seas to the world, including Iran. The question is whether people will overreact politically to news of the transit. Keep in mind, it is to the advantage of Israel and Iran for the US markets to overreact, because impacts to our markets give cover to politicians who support Israel's claim the Iranian Naval movements are bad for the US. I

don't see any scenario where the US Navy reacts to the Iranians in any way. I will never to presume to know what Israel will do when it comes to Iran.

For those who are curious, yes, I do believe the purpose of the Iranian naval force is to deliver weapons for Hezbollah in Lebanon. This voyage is expensive for Iran, so I am thinking there must be a payoff in it somewhere otherwise it wouldn't be done.
Posted by Galrahn at 1:00 PM

written by the same write as the first article...UnderseaLcpl fire at will

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by Matador.es

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=180423
But thanks, its on the World Navel News now as well

Same story, differant source:
http://www.defencetalk.com/iranian-n...z-canal-32269/

They paid U$D 290.000 for the two ships to pass though the suez. Which is quite cheap i think.

This or next weak a container from China will pass Suez (if it makes it through the Gulf of Aden). It will coast me about 8 U$D. My transport agent ones told me that an averange cargo can hold between 6000 and 12000 containers of 20". a 6000 container 20" ship will pay U$D480.000. But i am not sure if that number of containers is correct plus, my agent may charge me more that it costs...

Edit://Tribesman, did not see your replay when i started writing.

According to your "thread" which had a different date, one that I now have posted this is the reason for another post, I am sorry if it means a crash in posting (your post date 17/2 2011)

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Reuters, why open another topic on the Iranian ships?
Couldn't you just put you cut and paste article in the existing one as whole topics of the forum are ending up as just you posting few lines from the BBC.

Tribesman,I suggest that your comments remain on the drawing board, first and then if there is substance they can get out.

[Gerald]

It is most likely that this thread be merged with the other "older"

[NeonSamurai]

merged

[Gerald]

Tribesman,I suggest that your comments remain on the drawing board, first and then if there is substance they can get out.

An interesting viewpoint, where was that taken from and when was it updated?

merged

Note 22nd February Last updated at 1:59GMT

Now I havn't provided a link to that quote, as I think it doesn't need to be treated like a RSS feed, but the content of that quote suggests the substanceof my comment is validated and was unquestionablty valid all along.