and the CHP screws me again....

[Ducimus]

Umm, sorry bud, im a native californian, and i don't think were getting the whole story here.

81 MPH on the freeway is not a big deal, most of the time, but it is cutting it close. Alot depends on WHERE you were speeding. If you were doing that in the number 2 or 3 lanes, that would single you out. Nevermind that most everyone who should be in the no 2 and 3 lanes is in the no 1 lane. As well all know, the rule of "slower traffic keep right" seems to be lost on people here, along with the lost art of merging onto a freeway. But thats beside the point, and quick lane changes (IE "weaving") will do it too, especially if your barely clearing bumpers by only a couple feet.

Your safe at 75. I've been driving here since i was 16 (36 now) and have never been stopped doing 75. However 80, or a single mile past 80 though and your pushing your luck. BTW, i hear most officers spend alot of their days off in court now days. Good luck dodging that ticket.

[I-25]

the fact i was speeding is clear to me. i know that but in the bit of research i have done i came across a basic speed-safety law.

CVC 22351 Speed Law Violations, basicly this states that the speed of any vehicle upon a highway in excess of the prima facie speed limits...or established as authorized in this code (includes the 65mph max speed limit) is prima facie unlawful unless the defendant establishes by competent evidence that the speed in excess of said limits did not constitute a violation of the basic speed law at the time, place, and under the conditions then existing.

Since my speed was not unsafe for the conditions, we use this law to justify that my traveling above the 65mph limit was not, in itself, unlawful.

i found a good example of this put to use

STATEMENT OF FACTS

Defendant's Name: XXXXXXX
Case No.: XXXXX

I respectfully submit this written declaration to the Court pursuant to CVC 40902. I plead Not Guilty to the charge of violating CVC 22349(a).

The facts of my case are as follows: While driving northbound on Interstate 5, just north of Sorrento Valley Rd., at around 2300 on 3-12-99, I noticed an overtaking car in my lane flash its lights at me. The overtaking vehicle was following very closely, creating an unsafe situation. Since I could not move to the right immediately due to traffic, I accelerated somewhat to pass this traffic so that I could yield to the right of the overtaking vehicle and alleviate this developing unsafe situation. Soon after I safely yielded to the right to the overtaking vehicle , I was stopped by CHP Officer XXXXX (I.D.#XX) and charged with violating CVC 22349(a).

CVC 21753 "Yielding for Passing" requires that "the driver of an overtaken vehicle shall give way to the right in favor of the overtaking vehicle on audible signal or the momentary flash of headlights by the overtaking vehicle...." I do not think it is fair to convict me for momentarily breaking one law in my attempt to obey another and relieve an unsafe situation caused by an impatient driver.

The Basic Speed Law, CVC 22350, states: "No person shall drive a vehicle upon a highway at a speed greater than is reasonable or prudent having due regard for weather, visibility, the traffic on, and the surface and width of the highway, and in no event at a speed which endangers the safety of persons or property."

Where I was stopped, Interstate 5 is a well-maintained multi-lane freeway, quite safe to travel on at a speed slightly above the 65mph maximum limit with the favorable weather (clear and dry) and road conditions that existed at the time of my stop. Since I was required for safety to momentarily accelerate to allow the car overtaking and tailgating me to pass, I contest that my speed in excess of 65mph was necessary, reasonable, and prudent pursuant to the Basic Speed Law.

Section (b) of Speed Law Violations, CVC 22351, states: "The speed of any vehicle upon a highway in excess of the prima facie speed limits...or established as authorized in this code (includes the 65mph max speed limit) is prima facie unlawful unless the defendant establishes by competent evidence that the speed in excess of said limits did not constitute a violation of the basic speed law at the time, place, and under the conditions then existing."

The favorable road and weather conditions existing at the time and place of my stop combined with the necessity to momentarily accelerate to alleviate an unsafe situation with a speeding tailgater, made the speed I was traveling at the time of my stop Safe and Reasonable for conditions. As such, I know that I was not in violation of the basic speed law at the time and place of my citation and, pursuant to CVC 22351(b), contest that my speed at the time of my traffic stop was therefore not per se unlawful.

I trust in the Court's fairness in this matter and believe that my citation should be dismissed in the interest of justice.

If the court does not find in my favor in this case, I request a fine reduction and a Court assignment to attend traffic school.

I declare under penalty of perjury under the laws of the State of California that the foregoing is true and correct.

but yea i need more info on how the ball rolls too.

last year my dad got busted for the same thing (oddly enough on the same freeway and also 81 over)

he took it to court hoping that the cop would not show and well out of 10 persons that were there hoping for the same thing his was the only Officer that did show but he didnt have to pay any other extra fees.

so i really don't lose anything giving it a try.

i was also in the fast lane of a 5 lane freeway

So far I've seen posts here by cops, truckers, and "others".
The two former groups seem to be in agreement here, and it doesn't matter whether it be in Europe or North America, as the traffic laws are fairly uniform. (So are the Hours Of Service regulations for truckers!)

From another trucker:
You were in the left lane. (Keep right. Pass left.)
This indicates that you were NOT just keeping up with traffic.

81 in a 65.
You're 10 MPH over what most juristictions consider to be the discretionary/courtesy/tolerence/grace (for lack of a better word) zone.

You're a repeat offender, which means your license is on the line, as it should be.

Personal advice:
Pay the ticket.
Leave earlier, thus allowing yourself enough time to arrive at destination, without speeding.
Keep right, except to pass.
Drive the posted speed limit. (At least until your past violations have been cleared from your license.)
Don't bother applying for a driving job. (Poor driving record.)
Brace yourself for an insurance premium increase.

Side note: They do NOT have to but, most cops will allow you 10% over the posted limit.

The only question a judge considers is, did you break the law as cited.

The only out is that obeying the law would create a hazardouse situation.
(This clearly does not apply to your case.)

[Ducimus]

Originally Posted by Snestorm

81 in a 65.
You're 10 MPH over what most juristictions consider to be the discretionary/courtesy/tolerence/grace (for lack of a better word) zone.

...
Keep right, except to pass.
...
Drive the posted speed limit.

California is a little different in this regard. There's really two speed limits here. The posted one nobody pays any attention to, and the acceptable one that will result in someone bumper hugging you if you don't reach it. (75 being the "real" speed limit)

This place is way over crowded. Everyone has somewhere to be, and they needed to be there yesterday. Which is one reason why speeding here is the norm. It's also the reason why many people regardless of speed, head straight into the number 1 lane. There's always many people coming on and off the freeway your constantly dodging them. So, people tend to lock it up in the no 1 lane and stay there. EVEN if they're driving slower then the flow of traffic, it is maddening. Few here keep right.

What you end up with is a total reversal of how traffic should be. The passing lane becomes the no 2 and 3 lanes, and the slow lane becomes the no 1 lane. This has the additive effect of REALLY needing to use the onramp when getting on the freeway to its maximal potential - in otherwords, FLOOR IT, because you have a better then average chance of being forced onto the shoulder by oncoming traffic half the time, assuming its not jammed by rushhour traffic, in which case nobodys moving.

Anywho, alot of traffic problems would be solved here if slower traffic kept right. But that will never happen.

[CaptainHaplo]

PJC

Nuff said......

[Ducimus]

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

PJC

Nuff said......

http://www.google.com/search?q=PJC&i...&oe=utf-8&aq=t

Pensacola Junior College
Paris Junior College
Pacific Jewish Center
PIPER JAFFRAY COS
Piper Jaffray Companies


ambiguous dig is ambiguous.

[FIREWALL]

Find a lawyer in So. Cal or anywhere else for that matter for $300.00 or less ?

[Platapus]

it all depends on the judge and that you have no control over.

Good luck with it, but it does not sound like anyone "screwed" you over.

Speeding is like playing an anti-lottery. Most of the time you will get away with it and often some other guy gets pulled over. This was your time.

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

This place is way over crowded.

California freeways were insane back when I lived there. You could be driving at 0200 on a Wednesday and there would still be traffic jams.

Southern California is a 24/7 traffic jam. I don't ever want to move back there.

[Zachstar]

Why are some of you trying to give him advice for fighting it? That's false hope. 81 in a 65 means he is well outside of grace and is screwed in court. They wont mind showing up as that means he gets to have the book thrown at him and court costs for the state. They wont show up for less than 10 but past 10 and this is just too juicy for the state to ignore.

Just pay the ticket.

[Platapus]

When I was auditing court cases for my undergrad degree, it was a rarity for a police officer, in Nebraska, not to show up. In many (most?) states the police are now paid for their court days and judges coordinate the trial with the officer's court schedule.

So if your defense is based on the officer not showing up, I think you will be mistaken.

If you would like to be represented by an attorney but cannot afford one, contact the Legal Aid Society or the San Diego Volunteer Lawyer Program:
Legal Aid Society: (877) 534-2524
San Diego Volunteer Lawyer Program: (619) 235-5656

[CaptainHaplo]

Sorry Ducimus - I really should have been more clear.

PJC - Prayer for Judgement - Continued. May not apply in CA - but basically you ask for the case to be in abayence - as long as you don't get another ticket for a specified amount of time - then the whole thing disappears. If you get another ticket - you get slapped with both of them. Its a way to stay clean and have a good reason not to be silly and speed again.

[I-25]

tnks a bunch man
i never got a speeding ticket in SH III

[CaptainHaplo]

I-25 - never used my nuke boat mod then huh?

[Ducimus]

I used to drive 80 all the time. I slowed down when i traded my V6 for a 4 banger.

Im looking at where some of you all are from, because of the constant mentioning of 81 in a 65, but im telling ya, a posted limit of 65 on the freeway doesn't mean much here. Even when the posted speed limit was 55 back when i was 16, the "real " speed limit was 75. I cop won't stop you for 75 unless he's REALLY having a bad day.

My point is, its a different driving culture out here. I completely believe he got stopped for 81. States bankrupt and needs the money. In the past, he probably wouldn't have. To give you a contrast, the posted speed limit in a school zone in missippi is 10 or 15 MPH if memory serves, here its 25.

The posted speed limit on a freeway is more of a formality really. In some places it is posted at 70, but again, ive never been stopped (on the freeway) doing 75 regardless if the posted limit was 55, or 65, or 70.

That said, a single mile past 80 and your pushing your luck.

I guess i say this more out of protest to "Mr 65 MPH in the fast lane". Everyone else is doing 75 MPH (give or take a few MPH), but this guy has to park himself in hammer lane and be an obstruction to everyone nearby. I don't know where these people come from, but they need to get with the program.