Burn Baby Burn. - Page 2

baggygreen · 02-25-09, 05:52 PM

Same thing happened to a family member. burning would be the least of that scumbags worries if i catch up with him. he got let off because at 11, she was deemed too young to be a reliable witness. why? cos her story had 3 minor detail changes in the first 2 days.

Funny that. an 11 yr old kid changing their story a bit after going through that?

more power to the mother i say.

Zach, i know what you're getting at with the vigilantism being a bad thing, and to rely on the justice system, but almost every western justice system now leans in favour of the accused, not the victim. what do you do when they let you down?

Max2147 · 02-25-09, 06:21 PM

Normally I'm against vigilantism, but I have a hard time criticizing the mother here.

My main problem with vigilantism is the risk of getting the wrong person. But in this case, the guy had already been found guilty.

Ideally, the justice/prison system would have done its job and the guy would have been locked up forever or come out a reformed man, remorseful for what he did. But his comment shows that clearly wasn't the case.

So you have a case where there's no risk of mistaken identity, the failure of the justice system, and a highly emotional issue. Lighting the guy on fire in a crowded bar may have been going overboard a bit, but even as somebody who opposes vigilantism I find myself sympathizing with the mother.

Zachstar · 02-25-09, 11:02 PM

Actually the bigger risk is the breakdown of trust in the justice system. Where people don't even bother calling police when the "Law of the land" Is to attack someone in revenge for something they did to you or family or friends.

That could lead to social collapse REALLY fast.

I will be the first to admit the justice system is not perfect. Where pot dealers are treated worse than rapists and prisons filled to the brim with people serving time and gaining street knowledge for simple crimes that could have been better remedied through mandatory training and pysch help.

But it is the best we have. And if we don't like the sentence we have the right to petition congress to change the law to make the sentences tougher. And many civilized nations have similar systems.

You HAVE to admit its better than "Eye for an Eye on teh cold street"

Schroeder · 02-26-09, 07:20 AM

Zachstar would you still feel like that if your daughter had been raped, the guy who did that would smile in your face and asking how she is?
What would you do? File a report to congress? Call the police?
Nothing of that would have ANY impact (at least not within the next few months).
At that moment you already feel betrayed by your justice system that allowed this to happen. I'm normaly not for vigilantism but sometimes frustration and injustice are so big that people can't control themselfes anymore.
If that had happened to my daughter and that guy would be bold enough to ask me how she was I would have send him to hospital too.

Tarrasque · 02-26-09, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zachstar

But it is the best we have. And if we don't like the sentence we have the right to petition congress to change the law to make the sentences tougher. And many civilized nations have similar systems.

Unfortunately in we lack that option in the UK. Someone is convicted, they then appeal to the European Court of Human Rights who then turn around and tell the UK that to imprison someone for that length of time is an infringement of their human rights.

02-26-09, 08:26 AM

What that mother did has more to do with justice then most courts can provide. law hardly ever equals justice. As a person I have the deepest sympathacies with this woman, I'd probably actually cheer as well upon seeing her and how she acted.

But living in a civilized country comes with a price, and that means there are certain principles to obey. Ppl can't just start acting on their own, the result would be utter chaos and ever growing violence for ppl that want to take revenge on ppl that took revenge. Blood feuds came to start this way.

Thus that woman has to go to jail, else more people could be motivated to take the law into their own hands..and what happens next is a decline of society.

Life is not fair.

baggygreen · 03-02-09, 07:51 PM

Further to this story, I just found this report: http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/...d-rapist-freed

How the hell can raping a 4 year old girl warrant a 2 year suspended sentence?

I'm all for mandatory sentencing for rape. give em 10 years per count they're found guilty on.

TarJak · 03-02-09, 10:27 PM

Mandatory sentence should include having their bollocks smashed between a couple of bricks. Plus the jail time. When they get out they won't be doing it again.

A Very Super Market · 03-02-09, 10:31 PM

You know, I would be fine with castration for rapists.

August · 03-03-09, 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A Very Super Market

You know, I would be fine with castration for rapists.

Not me, nor would I be fine with executing them. But put them in a 8x8 cell for 40-50 years to think about what they did to put them there. Yeah.

baggygreen · 03-03-09, 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

Quote:

Originally Posted by A Very Super Market

You know, I would be fine with castration for rapists.

Not me, nor would I be fine with executing them. But put them in a 8x8 cell for 40-50 years to think about what they did to put them there. Yeah.

And for sick mongrels like the bloke today, give him a cellmate named bubba, or chopper reid...

August · 03-03-09, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baggygreen

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

Quote:

Originally Posted by A Very Super Market

You know, I would be fine with castration for rapists.

Not me, nor would I be fine with executing them. But put them in a 8x8 cell for 40-50 years to think about what they did to put them there. Yeah.

And for sick mongrels like the bloke today, give him a cellmate named bubba, or chopper reid...

My only objection to that is the same as what I don't like about the death penalty. Death and physical injury cannot be undone if it turns out later the person was wrongly convicted, and that happens too often to ignore it.

Kapt Z · 03-03-09, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max2147

Normally I'm against vigilantism, but I have a hard time criticizing the mother here.

My main problem with vigilantism is the risk of getting the wrong person. But in this case, the guy had already been found guilty.

Ideally, the justice/prison system would have done its job and the guy would have been locked up forever or come out a reformed man, remorseful for what he did. But his comment shows that clearly wasn't the case.

So you have a case where there's no risk of mistaken identity, the failure of the justice system, and a highly emotional issue. Lighting the guy on fire in a crowded bar may have been going overboard a bit, but even as somebody who opposes vigilantism I find myself sympathizing with the mother.

I agree. I sympathise with her as well. No getting around it the fact that she flat out murdered the guy though. You have to pay the piper for that no matter what the 'justification'.

August · 03-03-09, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kapt Z

You have to pay the piper for that no matter what the 'justification'.

Which by European standards should be about two weeks home confinement with a weekend pass in the middle?

Kapt Z · 03-03-09, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kapt Z

You have to pay the piper for that no matter what the 'justification'.

Which by European standards should be about two weeks home confinement with a weekend pass in the middle?

Seems fair to me....

He was out for a weekend pass wasn't he?????

02-25-09, 11:02 PM	#18
Zachstar Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Shreveport, Louisiana Posts: 1,956 Downloads: 13 Uploads: 0	Actually the bigger risk is the breakdown of trust in the justice system. Where people don't even bother calling police when the "Law of the land" Is to attack someone in revenge for something they did to you or family or friends. That could lead to social collapse REALLY fast. I will be the first to admit the justice system is not perfect. Where pot dealers are treated worse than rapists and prisons filled to the brim with people serving time and gaining street knowledge for simple crimes that could have been better remedied through mandatory training and pysch help. But it is the best we have. And if we don't like the sentence we have the right to petition congress to change the law to make the sentences tougher. And many civilized nations have similar systems. You HAVE to admit its better than "Eye for an Eye on teh cold street" __________________

02-26-09, 07:20 AM	#19
Schroeder Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Banana Republic of Germany Posts: 6,170 Downloads: 62 Uploads: 0	Zachstar would you still feel like that if your daughter had been raped, the guy who did that would smile in your face and asking how she is? What would you do? File a report to congress? Call the police? Nothing of that would have ANY impact (at least not within the next few months). At that moment you already feel betrayed by your justice system that allowed this to happen. I'm normaly not for vigilantism but sometimes frustration and injustice are so big that people can't control themselfes anymore. If that had happened to my daughter and that guy would be bold enough to ask me how she was I would have send him to hospital too. __________________ Putting Germ back into Germany.

03-02-09, 10:31 PM	#24
A Very Super Market The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Deep in the Wild Canadian suburbs. Posts: 1,468 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	You know, I would be fine with castration for rapists. __________________ The entire German garrison of Vanviken, right here in your thread!

02-25-09, 05:52 PM	#16
baggygreen Sea Lord Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Canberra, ACT, Down Under (really On Top) Posts: 1,880 Downloads: 7 Uploads: 0	Same thing happened to a family member. burning would be the least of that scumbags worries if i catch up with him. he got let off because at 11, she was deemed too young to be a reliable witness. why? cos her story had 3 minor detail changes in the first 2 days. Funny that. an 11 yr old kid changing their story a bit after going through that? more power to the mother i say. Zach, i know what you're getting at with the vigilantism being a bad thing, and to rely on the justice system, but almost every western justice system now leans in favour of the accused, not the victim. what do you do when they let you down?

02-25-09, 06:21 PM	#17
Max2147 Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 714 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Normally I'm against vigilantism, but I have a hard time criticizing the mother here. My main problem with vigilantism is the risk of getting the wrong person. But in this case, the guy had already been found guilty. Ideally, the justice/prison system would have done its job and the guy would have been locked up forever or come out a reformed man, remorseful for what he did. But his comment shows that clearly wasn't the case. So you have a case where there's no risk of mistaken identity, the failure of the justice system, and a highly emotional issue. Lighting the guy on fire in a crowded bar may have been going overboard a bit, but even as somebody who opposes vigilantism I find myself sympathizing with the mother.

02-26-09, 08:26 AM	#21
Bewolf Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	What that mother did has more to do with justice then most courts can provide. law hardly ever equals justice. As a person I have the deepest sympathacies with this woman, I'd probably actually cheer as well upon seeing her and how she acted. But living in a civilized country comes with a price, and that means there are certain principles to obey. Ppl can't just start acting on their own, the result would be utter chaos and ever growing violence for ppl that want to take revenge on ppl that took revenge. Blood feuds came to start this way. Thus that woman has to go to jail, else more people could be motivated to take the law into their own hands..and what happens next is a decline of society. Life is not fair.

03-02-09, 07:51 PM	#22
baggygreen Sea Lord Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Canberra, ACT, Down Under (really On Top) Posts: 1,880 Downloads: 7 Uploads: 0	Further to this story, I just found this report: http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/...d-rapist-freed How the hell can raping a 4 year old girl warrant a 2 year suspended sentence? I'm all for mandatory sentencing for rape. give em 10 years per count they're found guilty on.

03-02-09, 10:27 PM	#23
TarJak Fleet Admiral Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 17,052 Downloads: 150 Uploads: 8	Mandatory sentence should include having their bollocks smashed between a couple of bricks. Plus the jail time. When they get out they won't be doing it again.