Interesting article and debate

DavyJonesFootlocker · 04-24-08, 08:11 AM

Read here:

http://www.wirralglobe.co.uk/mostpop...ese_uboats.php

sharkbit · 04-24-08, 08:51 AM

Is it any different than having a Luftwaffe fighter or bomber in a museum in England(or any other country for that matter)? They caused quite a bit of death and destruction as well.

I don't think a museum piece or display "glorifies" the Nazi regime. It is part of history and needs to be looked at as such.
I doubt the U-Boat display has any type of glorification type plaque to the heroism and memory U-Boat crews or Naziism. It is just an artifact that the curious can look at and see a weapon used in the past.

Now, I'm a 44 year old American with a love of history and the study of WWII, so Europeans may have a different take on this since the war was so much closer to home. I'd be interested in hearing other opinions on this.

I've always found it interesting how U-Boats have been so villified while the American submarine offensive against Japan can be glorified at times. America was trying to do the same thing as well and not all American and British submariners came out of the war smelling like roses. I guess a lot depends on if you're on the winning side or not.

Just my $.02.

Raptor1 · 04-24-08, 09:07 AM

I completely agree with sharkbit, the U-Boat war was no less destructive then the Pacific Submarine War, a preserved U-Boat doesn't glorify the Nazi regime in any way, it's just another piece of history that should be kept intact rather then destroyed, just as much as any Fleet Boat deserves to be preserved as a museum...

M. Sarsfield · 04-24-08, 09:14 AM

Any time someone says you're glorifying this or that, just tell them that "It's History, Not Hate". This includes confederate and nazi flags. People that want to hate or glorify hate and abusive regimes don't need a museum or flag to rally around to do so. It's amazing that some people are pro freedom of speech as long as you agree with them. Rant over...

AVGWarhawk · 04-24-08, 09:15 AM

To me it is not glorification to restore any machinery from WW2 or any other war for that matter. It is a rememberance that these things did occur and here is hard evidence. It is called history. It is a part of human history as ugly as it was, but here it is. Sounds like this gentleman is upset because he is paying a bit extra to restore the uboat. A lot of people pay extra for things they do not agree with. Check out your tax contributions and you decide.

mookiemookie · 04-24-08, 09:38 AM

I agree with the sentiments here. History is history. And while the winners write it, it's important to remember that there was another side of history...a side full of human beings fighting for their ideals. Whether or not those ideals are noble and worthy can be judged separately from the evidence that this war was fought, which is precisely what this U-boat represents. I do see it as a tribute - not to the Kriegsmarine, but to history and the preservation of it so that future generations will have tangible reminders of what their forefathers experienced.

ReallyDedPoet · 04-24-08, 09:57 AM

It is what it is, part of history. History is the good, bad and all points in between.

RDP

04-24-08, 08:11 AM	#1
DavyJonesFootlocker The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Stink Drunk in Trinidad Posts: 1,572 Downloads: 138 Uploads: 0	Interesting article and debate Read here: http://www.wirralglobe.co.uk/mostpop...ese_uboats.php __________________ "Silence means death. Stand on your feet. Inner fear your worst enemy."- Sepultura. My Silent Hunter 5 mantra is this......"Torpedo missed, sir!" A P-400 is a P-40 with a Zero after it. A proud member of the Wikipedia Haters Club

04-24-08, 09:07 AM	#3
Raptor1 Navy Seal Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Stavka Posts: 8,211 Downloads: 13 Uploads: 0	I completely agree with sharkbit, the U-Boat war was no less destructive then the Pacific Submarine War, a preserved U-Boat doesn't glorify the Nazi regime in any way, it's just another piece of history that should be kept intact rather then destroyed, just as much as any Fleet Boat deserves to be preserved as a museum... __________________ Current Eastern Front status: Probable Victory

04-24-08, 09:14 AM	#4
M. Sarsfield Ace of the Deep Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Tulsa, OK Posts: 1,016 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Any time someone says you're glorifying this or that, just tell them that "It's History, Not Hate". This includes confederate and nazi flags. People that want to hate or glorify hate and abusive regimes don't need a museum or flag to rally around to do so. It's amazing that some people are pro freedom of speech as long as you agree with them. Rant over... __________________ MJS USS Batfish Volunteer/Reenactor www.ss310.com www.ussbatfish.com Communism killed over 100M people and all that I got was this lousy signature.* *http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/COM.ART.HTM

04-24-08, 09:15 AM	#5
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,257 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	To me it is not glorification to restore any machinery from WW2 or any other war for that matter. It is a rememberance that these things did occur and here is hard evidence. It is called history. It is a part of human history as ugly as it was, but here it is. Sounds like this gentleman is upset because he is paying a bit extra to restore the uboat. A lot of people pay extra for things they do not agree with. Check out your tax contributions and you decide. __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

04-24-08, 09:38 AM	#6
mookiemookie Navy Seal Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 9,404 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 1	I agree with the sentiments here. History is history. And while the winners write it, it's important to remember that there was another side of history...a side full of human beings fighting for their ideals. Whether or not those ideals are noble and worthy can be judged separately from the evidence that this war was fought, which is precisely what this U-boat represents. I do see it as a tribute - not to the Kriegsmarine, but to history and the preservation of it so that future generations will have tangible reminders of what their forefathers experienced. __________________ They don’t think it be like it is, but it do. Want more U-boat Kaleun portraits for your SH3 Commander Profiles? Download the SH3 Commander Portrait Pack here.

04-24-08, 08:51 AM	#2
sharkbit The Old Man Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 1,529 Downloads: 334 Uploads: 0	Is it any different than having a Luftwaffe fighter or bomber in a museum in England(or any other country for that matter)? They caused quite a bit of death and destruction as well. I don't think a museum piece or display "glorifies" the Nazi regime. It is part of history and needs to be looked at as such. I doubt the U-Boat display has any type of glorification type plaque to the heroism and memory U-Boat crews or Naziism. It is just an artifact that the curious can look at and see a weapon used in the past. Now, I'm a 44 year old American with a love of history and the study of WWII, so Europeans may have a different take on this since the war was so much closer to home. I'd be interested in hearing other opinions on this. I've always found it interesting how U-Boats have been so villified while the American submarine offensive against Japan can be glorified at times. America was trying to do the same thing as well and not all American and British submariners came out of the war smelling like roses. I guess a lot depends on if you're on the winning side or not. Just my $.02.

04-24-08, 09:57 AM	#7
ReallyDedPoet Canadian Wolf Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Canada. The one and only, East Coast Posts: 10,886 Downloads: 946 Uploads: 5	It is what it is, part of history. History is the good, bad and all points in between. RDP __________________ Back in the Day