Problem with mark 14 torps - Page 2

GTHammer · 06-03-07, 05:08 PM

I've read lots about this and complained about it plenty myself, but my conclusion in the end is that the torps seem pretty accurate. I've played mostly early war patrols and campaigns and was at first frustrated at the number of torps required to make certain kills. However as time has progressed I've realized perhaps its been easier to focus on the negatives. The five or so odd torps I've had explode early stick out alot more in my mind than those that functioned perfectly and did good damage. I've had plenty of issues with torps, but I've also had a few one shot kills on smaller ships and even taken down a FUSO with 2 shots that hit low on the keel. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I think it seems pretty realistic that you're gunna strike out more often than you're gunna hit a home run.

nattydread · 06-03-07, 06:20 PM

I dont mind the strike outs so much, I mind the strike outs when I do land several torp hits. I have duds on 100% for a reason and expect mishaps...just not kinetic energy absorbing space vessels.

zylark · 06-04-07, 07:38 AM

Sometimes you get duds, premature detonations and non-functioning magnetic detonators. Not to mention the circlers with a broken gyro. As far as I see it it is not a bug, but a feature. That is how the mk14 fishes was. Very unstable. At least until late 43. Before mid/late 43, don't get surprised if less than half of your fishes actually hit their target, much less do any significant damage. You want a simulator, you got it

badb0y · 06-04-07, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ATR-42

later in the war, ive had MUCH MUCH better luck with the "pink" torpedos(mk17s?), i forgot the model number, but they seem to be much more reliable and powerfull. im on my 3rd career and im stuck with the mark 14s right now and i go through the same stuff you do, especially when they explode 100yards before the target !

but i know that skippers back in the day had the same frustrations so i keep on firing and make more trips for refits....

agreed - i've found this also.

tycho102 · 06-04-07, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by badb0y

Just did a 1942 mission where i got right into a convoy undetected. Primary targets were 2 large modern tankers.

?? Any comments anyone please ??

Set your torp as shallow as possible (2 meters) and fire at the actual tanks. If you can't tell where the tanks are located, you probably ought to take a look at a few historical photos on google. One shot is all it usually takes, but I typically fire two. If I fire them deep or mag, it takes 4 or more. Shallow has been very good to me for a whole bunch of tankers.

Cargo and troop boats are the ones you want mag shots as close to the keel and centerline as possible.

nattydread · 06-04-07, 06:39 PM

Yeah, I dont even fire torps with mag detonators active.

I try to mix the depths up and spread the love when I fire multiple fish, especially against tankers, in hopes I can get the water to flood in through the deep hole allowing it to push the oil upward to spill out the shallow hole...then I found out no tankers have anyting in their holds.

Taurolas · 06-06-07, 06:33 AM

Tankers can take one hell of a beating... i think you should read about the Ohio doing the malta run during WWII, and then you'll have greater respect for the amount of damage they can take and still continue on their merry way

Marko Ramius · 06-06-07, 07:14 AM

Well here's a true story:
On my second mission to the Solomon islands I come across one large modern tanker, unattended. I've had problems with these mammoths before so I take no chances and fire all six of my bow torps at her. They all hit home, one after the other. That only slowed her down a bit and she's got a gaping hole on the side and a small fire.
I cut in front of her and fire all 4 of my stern torps, no misses. Another gaping hole and I can now literally see through the ship.
No worries, she's still proudly making 5 knots! I'm a little angry now and meanwhile my bow torps are loaded so I turn the boat around and fire another six, all hits.
She's now listing heavily, she's ablaze and has slowed down to 3 knots but she doesn't mean to go down, so I wait a while to see if she will oblige. And sure enough, she's picking up speed again! I couldn't believe it!

Same drill again, I turn around and fire another four to finally see her slowly leave the surface...
20 torpedos...

tycho102 · 06-06-07, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marko Ramius

one large modern tanker
unattended.
all six of my bow torps
she's still proudly making 5 knots!

Dude. You need to set your torps for 2 meters. As absolutely shallow as they go.
Then, you need to aim for the bloody tanks. Let me see if I can find a picture and circle it real quick.

There's always a crane boom or other structure denoting where the tank fillhole is. The tank is either fore or aft of that marker. You put two torps into the same tank, and it's going to drop very quickly from the secondary explosions.

nattydread · 06-06-07, 06:40 PM

Man, Ive put torps of varying depths all in those areas before, the things treats them like mosquitos in SHIV.

Marko Ramius · 06-06-07, 06:59 PM

I will certainly try that and thanks for the instructions!
So with the depth of the torps is only for tankers that you gotta set them shallow or this is a general rule? Or the bigger the ship the shallower you have to aim?

Another weird thing that has happened is when I fired a fish at one of those little subchasers. The guy was following me at full speed and I could see him exactly at 180o travelling on a straight line about 1,000ft away so I thought I'd have a go at him with a stern shot. (BTW I never understood why these subschasers never fire at me with their deck guns. One of them crept up on me once and just sat there behind me, both of us stopped. I turned the boat around and mowed him with the deck gun)

When I hit him his ship actually jumped about 5ft out of the water, I wish I had taken a pic... The fish must have been running too deep and detonated under the ship causing the acrobatics.
And guess what this little #$@# just landed and kept chasing me around...

Thanks for your help on the tankers

Bear · 06-06-07, 07:06 PM

According to the books there were problems with the torpedos until sometime in 43, but the stock fish appear to be under powered even when they explode. If you want? There is a mod in the mod workshop that will increase your fish by x1.5 or x 2.

It is an each to his/her own thing about power mods. But I got damn tired of having to use four or more on some small merchants. x1.5 seems to work for me. There is also a supermod torpedo, but I don't think anyone with realisim set about 51% uses them.

Marko Ramius · 06-06-07, 07:17 PM

Quote:

According to the books there were problems with the torpedos until sometime in 43,

Nah I was supposedly in 1944 when when my debacle with the tanker happened, I don't think it's something they built into the game for historical accuracy purposes.

Marko Ramius · 06-06-07, 07:53 PM

And if they did do it purposedly for historical accuracy they could have done a better job at it. Still this sim has so much going for it that I'm absolutely delighted I bought it. Thanks for the tip Bear I think I might beef up my fishes a tad.

badb0y · 06-07-07, 11:23 AM

?? Any comments anyone please ??[/quote]
Set your torp as shallow as possible (2 meters) and fire at the actual tanks. If you can't tell where the tanks are located, you probably ought to take a look at a few historical photos on google. One shot is all it usually takes, but I typically fire two. If I fire them deep or mag, it takes 4 or more. Shallow has been very good to me for a whole bunch of tankers.

Cargo and troop boats are the ones you want mag shots as close to the keel and centerline as possible.[/quote]

Ok your point/advice is taken but this then begs the question - aren't you going for a level of precision that the game simply does't cater for?
Your personal experience seems to bear you out but maybe the game itself simply randomised your success rate.

One further comment on this - as i've chosen later years, 1943 for e.g. - not only do you get better fish/torps, but also the mark14 fish seem to work better as well. Is this supposed to be the case or is this just an example of the game randomising the effect of effectiveness of a particular (on target) torpedo.

I am truly interested in how detailed the devs went in terms of different areas of a ship being vunerable. The only area i can see at the moment is landing bang on the engine room which i admit tends to cause a rather satisfying explosion more often than not.
One example, hit a propellor bang on - zero damage, ship moves ahead as per normal.
Another shot (diff ship) hits a little further up the boat - prop stops.

I'm just wondering where the line is between reality and poor dev design "mimicking" reality if you see what i mean.

06-03-07, 05:08 PM	#16
GTHammer Machinist's Mate Join Date: May 2007 Location: Iowa Posts: 127 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	I've read lots about this and complained about it plenty myself, but my conclusion in the end is that the torps seem pretty accurate. I've played mostly early war patrols and campaigns and was at first frustrated at the number of torps required to make certain kills. However as time has progressed I've realized perhaps its been easier to focus on the negatives. The five or so odd torps I've had explode early stick out alot more in my mind than those that functioned perfectly and did good damage. I've had plenty of issues with torps, but I've also had a few one shot kills on smaller ships and even taken down a FUSO with 2 shots that hit low on the keel. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I think it seems pretty realistic that you're gunna strike out more often than you're gunna hit a home run. __________________ GT USS Hammer

06-06-07, 07:14 AM	#23
Marko Ramius Swabbie Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 8 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	What's this tanker made of? Well here's a true story: On my second mission to the Solomon islands I come across one large modern tanker, unattended. I've had problems with these mammoths before so I take no chances and fire all six of my bow torps at her. They all hit home, one after the other. That only slowed her down a bit and she's got a gaping hole on the side and a small fire. I cut in front of her and fire all 4 of my stern torps, no misses. Another gaping hole and I can now literally see through the ship. No worries, she's still proudly making 5 knots! I'm a little angry now and meanwhile my bow torps are loaded so I turn the boat around and fire another six, all hits. She's now listing heavily, she's ablaze and has slowed down to 3 knots but she doesn't mean to go down, so I wait a while to see if she will oblige. And sure enough, she's picking up speed again! I couldn't believe it! Same drill again, I turn around and fire another four to finally see her slowly leave the surface... 20 torpedos...

06-06-07, 06:59 PM	#26
Marko Ramius Swabbie Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 8 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	What's this tanker made of? I will certainly try that and thanks for the instructions! So with the depth of the torps is only for tankers that you gotta set them shallow or this is a general rule? Or the bigger the ship the shallower you have to aim? Another weird thing that has happened is when I fired a fish at one of those little subchasers. The guy was following me at full speed and I could see him exactly at 180o travelling on a straight line about 1,000ft away so I thought I'd have a go at him with a stern shot. (BTW I never understood why these subschasers never fire at me with their deck guns. One of them crept up on me once and just sat there behind me, both of us stopped. I turned the boat around and mowed him with the deck gun) When I hit him his ship actually jumped about 5ft out of the water, I wish I had taken a pic... The fish must have been running too deep and detonated under the ship causing the acrobatics. And guess what this little #$@# just landed and kept chasing me around... Thanks for your help on the tankers

06-06-07, 07:06 PM	#27
Bear Helmsman Join Date: May 2005 Location: CSA - Confused States of America Posts: 107 Downloads: 99 Uploads: 0	Torpedo Problems Mark 14 According to the books there were problems with the torpedos until sometime in 43, but the stock fish appear to be under powered even when they explode. If you want? There is a mod in the mod workshop that will increase your fish by x1.5 or x 2. It is an each to his/her own thing about power mods. But I got damn tired of having to use four or more on some small merchants. x1.5 seems to work for me. There is also a supermod torpedo, but I don't think anyone with realisim set about 51% uses them.

06-03-07, 06:20 PM	#17
nattydread Captain Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 498 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	I dont mind the strike outs so much, I mind the strike outs when I do land several torp hits. I have duds on 100% for a reason and expect mishaps...just not kinetic energy absorbing space vessels.

06-04-07, 07:38 AM	#18
zylark Loader Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Norway Posts: 84 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Sometimes you get duds, premature detonations and non-functioning magnetic detonators. Not to mention the circlers with a broken gyro. As far as I see it it is not a bug, but a feature. That is how the mk14 fishes was. Very unstable. At least until late 43. Before mid/late 43, don't get surprised if less than half of your fishes actually hit their target, much less do any significant damage. You want a simulator, you got it

06-04-07, 06:39 PM	#21
nattydread Captain Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 498 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Yeah, I dont even fire torps with mag detonators active. I try to mix the depths up and spread the love when I fire multiple fish, especially against tankers, in hopes I can get the water to flood in through the deep hole allowing it to push the oil upward to spill out the shallow hole...then I found out no tankers have anyting in their holds.

06-06-07, 06:33 AM	#22
Taurolas Medic Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Notts UK Posts: 163 Downloads: 167 Uploads: 0	Tankers can take one hell of a beating... i think you should read about the Ohio doing the malta run during WWII, and then you'll have greater respect for the amount of damage they can take and still continue on their merry way

06-06-07, 06:40 PM	#25
nattydread Captain Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 498 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Man, Ive put torps of varying depths all in those areas before, the things treats them like mosquitos in SHIV.

06-06-07, 07:53 PM	#29
Marko Ramius Swabbie Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 8 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	And if they did do it purposedly for historical accuracy they could have done a better job at it. Still this sim has so much going for it that I'm absolutely delighted I bought it. Thanks for the tip Bear I think I might beef up my fishes a tad.

06-07-07, 11:23 AM	#30
badb0y Swabbie Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 14 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	?? Any comments anyone please ??[/quote] Set your torp as shallow as possible (2 meters) and fire at the actual tanks. If you can't tell where the tanks are located, you probably ought to take a look at a few historical photos on google. One shot is all it usually takes, but I typically fire two. If I fire them deep or mag, it takes 4 or more. Shallow has been very good to me for a whole bunch of tankers. Cargo and troop boats are the ones you want mag shots as close to the keel and centerline as possible.[/quote] Ok your point/advice is taken but this then begs the question - aren't you going for a level of precision that the game simply does't cater for? Your personal experience seems to bear you out but maybe the game itself simply randomised your success rate. One further comment on this - as i've chosen later years, 1943 for e.g. - not only do you get better fish/torps, but also the mark14 fish seem to work better as well. Is this supposed to be the case or is this just an example of the game randomising the effect of effectiveness of a particular (on target) torpedo. I am truly interested in how detailed the devs went in terms of different areas of a ship being vunerable. The only area i can see at the moment is landing bang on the engine room which i admit tends to cause a rather satisfying explosion more often than not. One example, hit a propellor bang on - zero damage, ship moves ahead as per normal. Another shot (diff ship) hits a little further up the boat - prop stops. I'm just wondering where the line is between reality and poor dev design "mimicking" reality if you see what i mean.