Last Chance at my Skipper stripes...

[kage]

Originally Posted by Micksp

In NB you always have two contacts per target. One of them is a mirror.

Might help not to feed misinformation.

The towed array gives mirror contacts. Narrowband has nothing to do with that.

[Chaos81]

Originally Posted by kage

The towed array gives mirror contacts.

Can you or someone else, elabarate on that? I'm still VERY new at this game as well and am trying to pick up all I can.

I think I remember reading this at one point, but can't remember where or when. Why do you get a mirror contact, and how do you tell the two apart?

[Wim Libaers]

Originally Posted by Chaos81

Can you or someone else, elabarate on that? I'm still VERY new at this game as well and am trying to pick up all I can.

I think I remember reading this at one point, but can't remember where or when. Why do you get a mirror contact, and how do you tell the two apart?

You get a mirror contact because the towed array can tell you the angle between the array and incoming sounds, but not the direction. If, for example, the angle in 50°, that could be 50° to the left or 50° to the right. Finding the right one is easy: turn, and wait for the array to stabilise on the new course. When it does so, the fake contact will move by two times that angle, the real contact will not move (well, only as much as it would due to its own speed.)

[Chaos81]

Thanks for the reply, that makes perfect sense to me. I'm off to read some of the things in this thread a bit more.

[Enigma]

That is a good pointer, cheers...

Still struggling with contacts, how to determine what im listening to, how to read the displays, etc....would be great to go on TS with someone and try it. Get a few lessons, if anyone is up to it...

We should start our own Naval academy!

Yeah .. especially TMA without pictures is impossible
I figured most things out with help of the mission editor. I edited one civilian ship in 5nm distance and I tracked it. It's all much easier when they don't shoot back

This is what im doing now. Simply setting up some targets in space, and then attempting to define one from the other, and pinpoint the positions...

[SeaQueen]

Originally Posted by Enigma

Still struggling with contacts, how to determine what im listening to, how to read the displays, etc....would be great to go on TS with someone and try it. Get a few lessons, if anyone is up to it...

How to determine what you're listening to is sometimes just a bit of guesswork. The filters might be able to narrow it down to a range of possiblities but usually the only way to know with perfect certainty is to get so close that you're endangering yourself. Usually, though, you don't need to do that if you use your head. If you're in the Norwegian Sea, for example, you can be pretty sure that you're not looking at any Chinese warships.

This is what im doing now. Simply setting up some targets in space, and then attempting to define one from the other, and pinpoint the positions...

If you have broadband on a target, you should be able to get a pretty good position on it.

[Enigma]

So, when I raise the mast and get contacts from the link, and I see a target displayed on the map, I can opt to "Engage with MK48". dos this simply pop off a torp into the last known location of a target?

I made some progress with NB and BB today, but just scratching the surface.

The LA class has the option of listening to the towed wire, the nose, or the hull of the boat (at least thats what I determine from the diagrams on the buttons). Can anyone explain the benfits of each, and when and why i should be using each area?

I have a rare night off tonite. Ill spend the whole bloody thing staring at the sonar display. Hope you guys are around....

[Dr.Sid]

Use the guides mentioned above. No need to repeat the basics here.

[Enigma]

Hey! It's "read the guides" guy! I've met you on, like, every forum ever!

[udadni]

The bow array sonar is best for close range and high frequency sound. Using the narrowband classification with this array (if you can get a signal) will be the fastest and most accurate way to classify a target, but usually if you're close enough to hear em on that and you don't know what they are, expect to hear "Torpedo in the water" before you even think about going to the fire control screen. The hull array sonar is the least sensitive sonar and works best at picking up low frequency sound. The towed array is your meat and potatoes. It's horrible at picking up high frequency noise, by it is the most sensitive array you have by an order of magnitude. You can pick up contacts as far as 10-12 nm away with this baby.\

To my knowledge, the engage with menu's launch options are smart enough to aim the weapon for an intersect with the target, so it'll lead the target a bit. (I could be wrong) One thing that this menu does not do is set your range to enable distances. A good rule of thumb is half the range to the target, plus a little for good measure. The more sure you are of your TMA solution, the longer your RTE distance can be, if your confidance is low, set the RTE to a lower level.

[PeriscopeDepth]

The Landlubber's guide is excellent for people new to DW. Download it at the one and only subguru.com.

PD

[SeaQueen]

Originally Posted by Enigma

So, when I raise the mast and get contacts from the link, and I see a target displayed on the map, I can opt to "Engage with MK48". dos this simply pop off a torp into the last known location of a target?

Sort of. The thing about using linked contacts is that you have to pay careful attention to the contact age. If it hasn't been updated frequently and the link is from an AI, then it's most likely inaccurate and the AI that reported the contact is no longer detecting it. People don't automatically update their plots like AIs do, so if a person promotes a contact to he link sometimes the contact age is not always a good indicator of it's reliability. If that's the case, then the best thing to do is just ask them.

I made some progress with NB and BB today, but just scratching the surface.

Good to hear it.

The LA class has the option of listening to the towed wire, the nose, or the hull of the boat (at least thats what I determine from the diagrams on the buttons). Can anyone explain the benfits of each, and when and why i should be using each area?

The towed array (or towed wire as you called it), is basically a long rubber hose filled with oil to keep it neutrally buoyant, and also hydrophones. The advantage of it is that because it is long, it can have lots of little hydrophones in it, which makes it very sensitive, and it also has a lower band pass. A lower band pass means it can detect lower frequency sounds. That's important because low frequency sounds (<1kHz) are the ones which suffer the least attenuation in water.

The towed array has some disadvantages, though. One of them is that every time you turn sharply, the array bends and yields wildly incorrect bearings. It can also break if you do strange things like throw the boat into reverse or go too fast.

Because the towed array typically has the longest range, that's the sensor I use most often for searching.

The sphere (nose) and the hull arrays are less sensitive. If you detect something on them, it's probably really close. They have a higher band pass than the towed array, so they can detect higher frequency sounds, albeit you have to get close to do it. The higher frequency sounds are ones that often allow you to identify a target with perfect accuracy using the filters. You don't usually need to do that, though, if you use your head. The sphere also has the ability to emit an active sonar pulse.

The advantage of using the sphere and hull arrays is that they don't bend if you turn, so if you use Ekelund ranging you don't have to worry about the bearings being wrong after a turn like you do with the towed array. Therefore it's more likely to be accurate. The sphere can see forward, the towed array cannot. They also can't be lost by doing wild maneuvers.

[Enigma]

Thanks for all the above, fellows.

I spent hours working on it last night, and made some good progress. Im able to use the BB and NB and have had some succes in identifying my targets. (First time I heard a whale with the BB was cool, too! ) Of course, a couple of times I had a torpedo coming at me before I even knew anyone was there, and got myself dropped like a bad habit, but thats how we learn, I suppose....

On one occasion I was so close to a Kilo that I could see him in my external view, yet I could not find him on the BB or NB. A little puzzled by that. He was at 2kts, so maybe he's silent?

I also kinda self taught myself how to use the incoming ping screen ( I know thats not the correct terminology, but my head is fried from 7 hours on the scope...:rotfl: ) to locate a target that is banging away with active Sonar....

So, progress. And its fun.

Thanks again for all your advice and help. Much appreciated....

[goldorak]

Yes, the Kilo at 2 knots is basically a black hole.

[Enigma]

Figured as much.