US Politics Thread 2016-2020

[vienna]

Originally Posted by Oberon

I think the key is not so much the funds from Russia, which is, like you say, dirty but not exactly unusual, but more the way that information was suddenly leaked which was highly advantageous to the Trump campaign. That's what gets me. If wikileaks wanted to even have an smidgeon of impartiality then they'd have gone for the Republican emails as well as the Democrat ones, but they didn't. There's little doubt that there is dirt there, but the people who did the digging against the Democrats are strangely reluctant to do the same for the Republicans, which makes you think...doesn't it?

The timing is also seriously suspect; for instance: Immediately after the release and airing of the infamous audio tape of Trump boasting to Billy Bush about his (Trump) ability to pull (and paw) women because of his (Trump) celebrity, there was a major Wiki Leaks release of emails damaging to the Clinton campaign; in fact, if you go back and check the Wiki Leaks release dates of damaging emails, they seem to curiously 'coincidentally' coincide with events that may have or did prove damaging to the Trump campaign...

Regarding Trump's charges the Obama White House wiretapped the Trump Tower, it has been pointed out there is a simple solution to find out the facts in this case: all Trump has to do is exercise his Presidential powers and authority and declassify any documents proving his charges; it's just that simple; there is even one of those things he is so fond of, an Executive Order, promulgated under fellow GOP POTUS GW Bush defining and describing the process for a POTUS to declassify virtually anything a POTUS would wish:

https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-200...df/03-7736.pdf

So, given the means to settle once and for all the existence of any FISA or other intelligence or law enforcement actions regarding the charges of Obama White House illegality is literally at the fingertips of Trump, why is it not one step has been taken to do so? Is it possible that, in fact, the alleged documents do not exist and the fear of Trump and his minions is they have dug a deep pit in the Bandini and are in severe danger of the Bandini walls failing in on them? The time has come: Trump has more than enough means and powers, so it's time for him to man up and either put up or shut up. Walk the walk...



<O>

[vienna]

Just now saw this on TV (wow, they do post really quickly to YouTube, don't they?) relevant to the wiretap charges from someone who probably knows more (lots more) than Trump about wiretapping and declassification:





<O>

[August]

Originally Posted by Oberon

There's little doubt that there is dirt there, but the people who did the digging against the Democrats are strangely reluctant to do the same for the Republicans, which makes you think...doesn't it?

Makes me think you have a short memory or don't get the full news way over there. The Republicans were hacked too. It's just their stuff didn't contain the bombshells that John Podestas had in them like media collusion, campaign fixing and the like so there has been little mention of it. Besides it doesn't fit in with the Dems victim meme.

[Bilge_Rat]

He also forgets that Colin Powell's email account was hacked and the contents released. Powell had made unflattering comments about Trump in his email.

Bottom line on the Trump-Russia story is that everyone questioned, whether former CIA director Brennan, DEM senator Chris Coons, GOP senator Tom Cotton and Richard Burr, DEM congressman Adam Schiff, GOP congressman Nunes, all of which have received classified briefings say they have not seen any hard evidence of collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia. Leaks from FBI director Comey say the same thing. This is after close to a year of investigation.

[Bilge_Rat]

the plot thickens.

to recap, according to the BBC, the Obama administration made 3 requests for FISA warrants to spy on the Trump campaign. Apparently, the first 2 applications were rejected by FISA judges.

It is rare for FISA applications to be rejected, but it is even rarer than I thought.

According to official statistics released by the U.S. government, out of 35,529 FISA applications between 1979 and 2013, only 12 were rejected.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...eillance_Court

it really makes it look like the first two warrant applications were just political "fishing expeditions" with no legal basis.

this wiretap story is really starting to look like Watergate.

[August]

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

this wiretap story is really starting to look like Watergate.

It sure does and i'm thinking that Loretta Lynch will be the one who is eventually forced to fall on her sword for this. No way is BHO going to take the rap for it.

[DicheBach]

There is no such information which, stored on a server to which a Russian hacker gained unauthorized access, would afford the holder of such information the capacity to turn losing a state's electoral votes into winning it.

There is nothing to be found here; it is not only an unethical smear job, it is a patently stupid one at that. Much like most of the critiques made by leftists and their media. I'm honestly shocked that people as intelligent as WWII strategy and tactics gamers would be so gullible as to trot to the tune of the leftist media on these sorts of matters . . . but then, we have been literally drowning in their rhetoric from almost every available source for decades, so I suppose it is inevitable that even the most skeptical objectivists would be somewhat vulnerable.

Me personally, up through about 9 months ago, I had very luke warm feelings about Trump and found him merely "unsettling." My hopes were on Rand Paul, the most professional, intelligent, rational, businesslike and meritorious of any of them as far as I can tell.

But he didn't get the nomination. I allowed myself to learn more about Trump and I was a bit surprised by what I realized: there seems to be a method to his madness. He's a showman yes, but he is a successful one and a deal maker on top of that. His estimated worth is in the $2 billion ballpark, and he has been in that slice of humanity for decades, and despite having suffered more than one very serious financial setback (I believe he or one or more of his corporate entities underwent bankruptcy at one point?).

Someone who can amass that much wealth, and hold on to it for decades is necessarily more smart than lucky. Maybe it isn't Obama, "I'm a Harvard elite who understands the world better than you schmucks, so shutup and let me tell you how it is gonna be . . ." But Trump does seem to have common sense and that is a big part of his appeal to the ~HALF the country who came out in favor of him. It is the main reason I've come around in favor of him too, and plan to vote for him in 2020 as long as he stays pretty much exactly on the course he is on . . . I didn't vote this last time, but that was just laziness really . . .

I suspect that similar social processes are in motion in Europe as the ones which led to this shocking 2016 Presidential election result. Many people are tired of "the elites" (meaning, established political parties, the lionshare of mass media outlets, the majority of intelligentsia and celebrity who opine on social topics, a significant fraction of legal activists and the overwhelming majority of NGO/activist culture[s]) hypocritical preaching. Many are also tired of corporations which enjoy the benefits of trading on a U.S. based exchange, and/or U.S. based headquarters, which nonetheless offshore large or even majority fractions of their operations and employment. Many are also tired of various special interests groups who enjoy double standards and unwarranted special privileges. The oppressive nature of "political correctness" up through November 2016 and the increasingly clear signs that social justice warriors like Obama, and the Democratic Party are absolutely delusional when it comes to issues of race, class, gender, and related identity topics and how they relate to equality and opportunity.

When I find the rare criticism of Trump which does not rely on one of the tired old cliche's that reflect the leftists' party-line as synthesized in something like the things just described, I find it tremendously refreshing and invigorating. No leader should be regarded as infallible and the whole point of democracy is that leadership is (as far as national security and sound justice allows) transparent. In today's climate of online discussion, we, the people of Earth stand to actually make a difference by engaging in rational discourse about our leaders and the patterns unfolding in our nations.

But 99% of anything about Trump fits into two neat categories: 1. Praise (some warranted, some defensive, some mindless, some pure trolling). 2. Hysterical, seething, apoplectic outrage.

In my opinion, "the left" and the media outlets that can be beneficially considered to be part of "the left" are completely off-the-rails as far as doing anything helpful or useful for themselves or anyone else. They are so incensed and self-righteously indignant when it comes to Trump, they are literally incapable of thinking, much less developing a cogent strategy for how to assail him and achieve their primary goal of reinstating the leftist elite establishment to its rightful role as supreme social engineer of America and all of Western civilization.

Here we have one of the most remarkable elections in American history. A wealthy, controversial non-politician who managed to win an election without sanctioning (and if he is to believed, without any outside financial assistance) by ANY of the existing powers in the U.S. Presidential election campaign scene: Neither of the two dominant parties, none of the major industries, and not media. To the extent Trump had support 18 months ago, it was from "fringe" elements within the society not from any of the "establishments."

Trump was such an outsider/underdog, that he was not even taken seriously by anyone until, apparently, it was too late for them to develop proper counters to his appeal.

How did he win? By promising to "fix" everything that a large fraction of Americans regard as being "broken" and which both of the established elite parties (as well as media and other well-ensconced groups such as unions, corporations, etc.) had helped to build and had a vested interest in maintaining. You'll note, Republicans are still smarting from the licking they took from Trump as well, and it is curious to me how quickly some commentators have slipped into talking and apparently thinking about Trump as if he is "just another Republican."

He has managed a "hostile takeover" of their party, and some might recognize that the future of their party will be made or broken based on how well they follow his lead, but that is not the same thing as him "being a Republican."

Rather than an audible pause of amazed puzzlement on the part of mass media and some serious introspection and chin-scratching to try to cotton what the hell just happened, what do we see? More of the very same lip-smacking, innuendo-churning, propagandist poop; in sum, "they" (the left and the media and the SJW movement as a whole) have redoubled the very habitus which one might reasonable hypothesize were THE CAUSES for their historical downfall last November.

Across the United States as a whole, and taking into consideration elected seats at all levels of governance, the Democratic party now enjoys proportionally less presence in American government than at any time since the 1920s.

I really don't think Trump or his proponents need to worry; the opposition are doing a great job of committing suicide all by themselves.

[ikalugin]

Originally Posted by DicheBach

-long read-

It aint me.

[vienna]

Did anyone else happen to note the Breitbart reports regarding the alleged wiretapping of Trump by the Obama White House attributes their 'facts' to anonymous, unnamed sources? You would think any really responsible journalist seeking to tell the truth would be willing to identify their sources; otherwise, this is probably all "fake news". Don't think so? Well, a person known for his 'wisdom' and 'honesty' actually came out and insisted only news reports specifying the sources are the only real news and no journalist and/or news outlet should be able to get away with anonymous sources; and, you know that person's views must be the truth because it was reported by Breitbart:

http://www.breitbart.com/video/2017/...-news-network/

Also, does anybody else think it seems oddly coincidental that when Trump dug himself an embarrassingly deep hole with his tweets about the alleged wiretapping and he desperately needed a diversion, suddenly Wiki Leaks releases a huge trove of hacked material? How very convenient, no?...

Altogether now: "deflect, deflect, deflect..."...




<O>

[Oberon]

[Buddahaid]

We'll see. Maybe the Democrats will have to clean up the mess isolationist Republicans leave after starting the next big war. Just like the last two big wars which started when the Republican party controlled congress and the presidency.

[August]

Originally Posted by Oberon

...

Nice try but you missed the operative phrase: "by the very dishonest media".

[Mr Quatro]

Originally Posted by vienna

Also, does anybody else think it seems oddly coincidental that when Trump dug himself an embarrassingly deep hole with his tweets about the alleged wiretapping and he desperately needed a diversion, suddenly Wiki Leaks releases a huge trove of hacked material? How very convenient, no?...

Altogether now: "deflect, deflect, deflect..."...

<O>

Yes vienna, very odd, plus it worked, uh?

Now he has everyone running around wondering what happened ... and at the same time the Muslim (limited list of countries) ban get rolled out and the American Heath Care Act gets it's first view. Now his wild claim is old news, but still worth investigating along side the Russian connection to the election.

Does the name Cohen ring a bell they say that he learned how to mess with people's minds from him?

Will the real Trump please stand up and be a man or will he be ruined out of office (pun)?

One thought process I have yet to test the theory of ... What if Donald Trump POTUS, hears voices and that they told him POTUS Obama had him flagged as a potential enemy of the state?

He would need a physiological evaluation now wouldn't he?

[Buddahaid]

Ummm....

[August]

Originally Posted by August

It sure does and i'm thinking that Loretta Lynch will be the one who is eventually forced to fall on her sword for this. No way is BHO going to take the rap for it.

Guess the idea is spreading.

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/..._campaign.html

It appears to me that a trap has just sprung on the Democrats, and they need a fall guy. And we just got a huge clue as to who might be in the spotlight to take one for the team when it comes to culpability for covertly listening in on the conversations of the opposition party's presidential candidate.
Clarice Feldman explained the mess the Democrats created for themselves – what I am calling a trap – with her customary wit and brilliance on Sunday in "Trump: A Master Tactician Serves Filet After the Russian Soufflé Collapses."





My explanation for their problems is that The Obama and Clinton Gangs were so sure of themselves and their media dominance that they went ahead and made charges of Russian "hacking" and "collusion" with the Trump campaign, based on surveillance of that campaign. President Trump let them work up their outrage until momentum in that direction left them no chance of reversal.


Then he made his historic, and much vilified as "unsupported," tweet about a wiretap at Trump Tower and changed the discussion.

Now the investigation will include the Watergate-like probability that conversations of Trump campaign officials were being listened to and the conversations leaked to the media. There is criminal liability to consider and the need to pin responsibility on someone. All skillful criminals (the ones who stay out of jail for the big crimes) understand the need for a fall guy.

This brings me to something truly extraordinary: an attorney general, just weeks out of office, posted a video calling for "marching," "blood," and "death."

The chief law enforcement officer of the United States calling for political violence!
Why would she do that, and why now?


Clarice Feldman suggested that the denials of any knowledge of wiretapping by James Comey and James Clapper leave lovely Loretta Lynch exposed. Somebody gave the nod. And met secretly with Bill Clinton in her private jet at Phoenix Airport.
So what does the barely-former AG do? She plays the race card.
It is still too early to have a lot of confidence in this reading of the murky waters of the Democrats’ internal power plays, but it does fit the pieces together pretty well.
Stay tuned.