Here we go again-Ukraine once again pt2

[Skybird]

Yes, the West expected them to fight as if they had air superiority, while not providing them with the tools to enforce air superiority. Thats why I asked whether its fair to now blame Zalushnyi for their failure.



A US high mobility ground assault in the open plains of the summer South of ukraine probably would have gotten shot into pieces by Russian air superiority, too.



Some of the German, merican and British trainers' doctrinal expectations simply were inadequate for the war in ukraine, and terrain there. Troops that were getting trained in the West said that repeatedly that not just minor parts of what they were told simply was nonsense for the war reality in Ukraine. The Western doctrine did not meet the material and terrain reality, and it wa signored that the Ukrianaisn ahd no air superiority at all.



And then, the impact of drones, making the battlefield fully transparent: another variable Western doctrine so far does not reflect. You cannot hide huge formatiosn manouveirng anymore, its impossible, and more: the moment they get spotted, they get targetted immediately. THAT is the reaosn wyh the ukrainians fell back to extremely small combat formations, small groupos of troops only. It was the only way to avoid detection. To blame Zalushnyi and accuse him of tactical incompetence - thats what is imlied in the end - is possibly a bit rich. I think the doctrine of NATO simply is inadequate for the reality in Ukraine 2023. Whjat we see now instea dios trench warfare like 1914-18 - and almost nobody in Brussels expected to ever see that again.

[Dargo]

Putin’s Pals Think the GOP Just Won Them the War in Ukraine
‘WELL DONE, REPUBLICANS!’
Kremlin propagandists celebrate the Republican move to block funding and predict President Trump will totally cut off Ukraine and Israel. Republicans voted to block a $110.5 billion emergency spending bill to aid Ukraine and Israel Wednesday night, sparking celebrations in Moscow where they believe the U.S. will withdraw support for Kyiv allowing them to win the war.

A classified briefing with administration officials reportedly devolved into a meltdown on Tuesday afternoon, making it clear that the measure would fail. “We are about to abandon Ukraine,” Senator Christopher S. Murphy told the press as he left the briefing. “When Vladimir Putin marches into a NATO country, they will rue the day they decided to play politics with the future of Ukraine’s security.”

These developments prompted jubilation in Moscow. During Wednesday’s broadcast of a state TV program 60 Minutes, Evgeny Popov said Ukraine was now in “agony” and it was “difficult to imagine a bigger humiliation.”

During his morning show Full Contact on Wednesday, top pro-Kremlin propagandist Vladimir Solovyov joyfully noted: “[Janet] Yellen screamed, “Don’t you dare!” [Joe] Biden screamed, “Don’t you dare!” but Republicans said, “Go to hell! We won’t give your khokhols [slur for “Ukrainians”] any money.” The segment was entitled, “No one needs Ukraine anymore—especially the United States.”

Appearing on his program, America analyst Dmitry Drobnitsky noted, “The downfall of Ukraine means the downfall of Biden! Two birds with one stone!” During his appearance on 60 Minutes, Dmitry Abzalov, president of the Center for Strategic Communications, predicted that the fiasco with the funding for Ukraine will spell the political demise of Biden. Host Olga Skabeeva added, “We’ll have no pity for him! To the contrary, we’re ready to hammer those final nails right in!” With a happy grin, Skabeeva said, “Well done, Republicans! They’re standing firm! That’s good for us.”

Roman Golovanov, the host of Golovanov’s Time on Vladimir Solovyov’s channel Solovyov Live, pointed out, “This will be a great revelation to other countries. It is even more dangerous to be a friend of the United States than its enemy. In the end, they will abandon you, leaving nothing but the scorched earth on your territory.”... https://www.thedailybeast.com/putins...war-in-ukraine

[mapuc]

The military supply from the West to Ukraine was last month at the lowest since the start of the war-This according to some German institute(kiel institute)

https://www.ifw-kiel.de/topics/war-a...pport-tracker/

Markus

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by mapuc

The military supply from the West to Ukraine was last month at the lowest since the start of the war-This according to some German institute(kiel institute)

https://www.ifw-kiel.de/topics/war-a...pport-tracker/

Markus

I do not know whether the Kiel Institute for World Economy is one of the leading institutes for economic topics as some claim, but they usally are agreed to be in the top of sources assessing the overall donations made and aid packages send to Ukraine. Which may mean something. Or not. I have quoted them before, too.


----------------


This comment by CNN nails it.


https://edition.cnn.com/2023/12/07/e...cmd/index.html

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Skybird

I do not know whether the Kiel Institute for World Economy is one of the leading institutes for economic topics as some claim, but they usally are agreed to be in the top of sources assessing the overall donations made and aid packages send to Ukraine. Which may mean something. Or not. I have quoted them before, too.


----------------


This comment by CNN nails it.


https://edition.cnn.com/2023/12/07/e...cmd/index.html

There is a saying in Sweden "vända kappan efter vinden" Meaning to switch sides when it benefits you

Are the West starting to change their mind regarding Russia ??

In the beginning of the invasion the west was fully on the Ukrainian side and now it seems that they are starting to switch to a more friendly attitude towards Russia.

The expected offensive ran out in the sand. The sanction against Russia has backfired(did not have the effect the west had predicted)

This is only a thought I have I can be wrong.

Markus

[Skybird]

To say "turns friendly towards Russia" is maybe too much said, but as I use to say: while they have not farewelled Zelenskyi out of the room already - they nevertheless have started to remind him where his coat hangs.

[Jimbuna]

[mapuc]

Markus

[Skybird]

A study of medical conditions in Ukrainian hospitals reveals concerning news:
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[FR] The spread of multi-resistant germs was investigated at the end of 2022 in three regions in western and central Ukraine, a good 450 kilometers from the front line near Kherson. In the three hospitals studied, 14 percent of the 353 patients examined suffered from an infection that had only been contracted in hospital. Of these, however, more than half suffered from an antibiotic-resistant infection. Resistant even to the reserve antibiotic carbapanems, which, according to the CDC, is considered a "last resort" against hospital germs.

The researchers were particularly concerned about one lung germ: Klebsiella pneumoniae, which causes antibiotic-resistant pneumonia, was found in 30 percent of all patients infected with hospital germs. An EU-wide survey from 2017 was cited as a comparison: Here, only 5.5 percent of those affected were suffering from a hospital germ infection. Of these, around six percent were resistant to reserve antibiotics. This means that only 0.03 percent of people in the EU were infected with antibiotic-resistant germs. In the three hospitals investigated in Ukraine, the figure was around 8.5 percent. This would mean an incidence almost 300 times higher than in Europe.
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This could turn into a runaway train beyond the borders.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Markus

"Unsustainable losses"? I hear and read that phrase since over one year now.

[Jimbuna]

You and me both

[Exocet25fr]

Maybe the bear is more bigger and stronger than you thought

[Jimbuna]

[Bilge_Rat]

I think the issue we are seeing in the West is not so much war fatigue, but increasing distrust of how it is being run.

A lot of focus is on the fact that Republicans are not approving the $60 billion of additional aid, but that is just the tip of the iceberg. The WH is not saying this extra $60B will win the war, just that it will prevent Ukrainian collapse for another 3-6 months. No one expects the stalemate to break anytime soon. So what happens in another 3-6 months? We have to pony up another $60 Billion? How many years will we have to keep pouring money into this? 1 year? 2 years ? 5 years? 10 years? 20 years?

No one seems to have any idea what the endgame is, just a fuzzy notion that Ukraine has to be "liberated" from the Russians without a clear strategy of how to do it WITHOUT winding up in WW3/Nuclear Holocaust.

This war is starting to look more and more like the Afghanistan War. Everyone said we had to keep the Taliban out or it would be the beginning of the end of civilization as we know it. The War lasted 20 years, cost trillions of dollars and the Taliban have been back in power for over 2 years. Notice how despite all the previous handwringing, no one cares about Afghanistan anymore?

[Jimbuna]