US Politics Thread 2021-24

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Written with the US on mind, but true for Germany and then some more countries, too.

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinio...no-ncna1276221

Those wood heads take us all hostage. And thats why I am turning increasingly aggressive and unforgiving against them.


The longer the virus is allowed to freely roam in the bigger numbers, the more opportunities it has and will use to form mutations.

I don’t get it, if only fifty percent of our population has been vaccinated and yet we have reached the projected herd immunity target set for Jul-Aug 2021. That would mean the remaining balance is made up of unvaccinated persons who have COVID anti-bodies achieved from being infection rather than vaccination. It seems to me then that COVID can only roam about in a relatively insignificant number of people who do not have immunity either through vaccination or natural selection because have chosen to remain isolated.

Believe or not in the majority of cases the human body is capable of defending itself all on its own quite well.

[Skybird]

I red until "herd immunity" and then stopped. Nonsense becomes not less nonsense just because it gets endlessly repeated.

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Skybird

I red until "herd immunity" and then stopped. Nonsense becomes not less nonsense just because it gets endlessly repeated.

The Jul-Aug 2021 wasn’t my projection. IMO you all are being set up to believe COVID caused the economy to tank. Keeps you distracted and blaming each other instead of holding the administrations of both parties accountable for digging this hole I think we’re about to fall into.

[Rockstar]

NY Times, WaPo national security reporters serve at pro-war Pentagon-funded think tank

https://thegrayzone.com/2021/08/09/n...ed-think-tank/

Imagine a country where there’s no separation between the government, the military, and the media. A lot of Americans would think of China, Russia or North Korea, but it’s a perfect description of the United States today. Located in Washington, the Center For A New American Security (CNAS) is the clearest example of the unholy merger.

CNAS is the premier foreign policy think tank of the Democratic Party. It is funded by the State Department and Pentagon and has taken more money from weapons companies over the last several years than any other think tank in Washington. It’s also funded by oil companies, big banks, and right wing governments – basically the most destructive forces on the planet.

Here’s an oldie but a goodie, sure it’s not Rolling Stone Magazine but it will do.
17 July 1996
https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/...rnal00unit.pdf

Mr. Koppel. Mr. Chairman, thank you, and thank you for invit- ing me here this morning and for this opportunity to make a few preliminary comments.
As you no doubt expected, I am unalterably and categorically opposed to the notion of the CIA having the legal option of using journalism as a cover for its officers or agents. Having said that, there are circumstances under which the Agency has, under what it per- ceives to be the greater national interest, broken American laws in the past, and I have no doubt that it will continue under such circumstances to do so in the future.

… It will be much easier for those foreign government and agencies if we give them yet another opportunity to assume that the United States is, after all, just like them. It will certainly make life much more difficult for my colleagues and me. It will also place an even greater strain on the worn thread of credibility that exists between American journalists and our readers and viewers if they are left to wonder which of us are still trying to maintain some ethical and professional standards and who among us is actually working for U.S. intelligence.
Those of my colleagues who have devoted a lifetime striving for fairness and objectivity in their work, who have genuinely reported without fear or favor, will now have to settle for the assumption that they were just maintaining their cover.
How often the CIA would actually use such cover is beside the point. The relevant question is how often it would be assumed, both home and abroad, that American reporters are working with a sec- ond secret agenda.
Which brings me back to my initial point. The gathering of intelligence is a difficult, dangerous, and sometimes dirty operation. That is not my judgment. That is what we have repeatedly been told by senior intelligence officers. It is they, including the distinguished current Director of Central Intelligence, who explained the use of tainted assets by invoking the need to deal with crooks and thugs in the interest of protecting our national security.
When, as they sometimes do, U.S. intelligence officers circumvent or even break American laws, they must reckon with the possibility that they will one day be held to account. If their argu- ments are persuasive, if it is true that the national interest could not be served in any other fashion, the Congress can be expected to be lenient and understanding. But at least everyone understands that a line has been crossed and that there may be consequences. If the CIA must on occasion use the role of an American journalist to conceal one of its operatives and to protect the greater national interest, it will do so, regardless of what is decided by Congress. But let that continue to be in the knowledge that a free press is being endangered and that American law is being broken.

Too late Ted media corporations have been for sometime now openly hiring FBI, CIA operatives and intelligence officers as their very own panel of ‘experts’. Americans don’t care about facts or truth in journalism they want drama! Makes them feel that their opinion matters, they love the drama they crave it, they dream about it. It’s all they know.

You’ve come a long way baby! Gone are the days when in 1996 our elected officials dare inquire and speak freely. These days they need to toe the line to keep their elected to position.
3 January 2017

“Let me tell you, you take on the intelligence community, they have six ways from Sunday at getting back at you,” Schumer told MSNBC's Rachel Maddow. “So even for a practical, supposedly hard-nosed businessman, he’s being really dumb to do this. Schumer said that as he understands, intelligence officials are "very upset with how [Trump] has treated them and talked about them."”

Tictok tictok, Michael cohen, any day now, inner circles, Russia gate, collusion, Steele dossier, low hanging fruit, stormy Daniels and the beat goes on.

[Rockstar]

[3catcircus]

Originally Posted by Skybird

I red until "herd immunity" and then stopped. Nonsense becomes not less nonsense just because it gets endlessly repeated.

That you consider herd immunity to be nonsense is a shame - it shows only your lack of science education.

The science has been settled - herd immunity exists, it's just a matter of how many people need to be infected and recover for the rest of the population to not become sick.

[Arlo]

We all know how questionable the Mayo Clinic is compared to most other sources of "science education". Never-the-less .... (ignore because ... hey, you don't wanna be wrong or nuthin'):

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-...s/art-20486808

"How is herd immunity achieved?

There are two main paths to herd immunity for COVID-19 — infection and vaccines.

Natural infection

Herd immunity can be reached when enough people in the population have recovered from a disease and have developed protective antibodies against future infection.

However, there are some major problems with relying on community infection to create herd immunity to the virus that causes COVID-19:

Reinfection. It’s not clear how long you are protected from getting sick again after recovering from COVID-19. Even if you have antibodies, it’s possible that you could get COVID-19 again.
Health impact. Experts estimate that in the U.S., 70% of the population — more than 200 million people — would have to recover from COVID-19 to halt the pandemic. This number of infections could lead to serious complications and millions of deaths, especially among older people and those who have existing health conditions. The health care system could quickly become overwhelmed.

Vaccines

Herd immunity also can be reached when enough people have been vaccinated against a disease and have developed protective antibodies against future infection. Unlike the natural infection method, vaccines create immunity without causing illness or resulting complications. Using the concept of herd immunity, vaccines have successfully controlled contagious diseases such as smallpox, polio, diphtheria, rubella and many others.

Herd immunity makes it possible to protect the population from a disease, including those who can't be vaccinated, such as newborns or those who have compromised immune systems.

The U.S. Food and Drug Administration has given emergency use authorization to a handful of COVID-19 vaccines.

But reaching herd immunity through vaccination against COVID-19 might be difficult for many reasons. For example:

Vaccine hesitancy. Some people may object to getting a COVID-19 vaccine because of religious objections, fears about the possible risks or skepticism about the benefits. If the proportion of vaccinated people in a community is below the herd immunity threshold, a contagious disease could continue to spread.

Protection questions.

It’s not clear how long the COVID-19 vaccines will protect you from COVID-19. Further research is needed to see how much the COVID-19 vaccines reduce transmission of the COVID-19 virus. Also, research suggests that COVID-19 vaccines may have lower efficacy against some of the variants of the COVID-19 virus. New variants, which could be more resistant to vaccines, are regularly emerging.

Uneven vaccine roll-out. The distribution of COVID-19 vaccines has greatly varied among and within countries. If one community achieves a high COVID-19 vaccination rate and surrounding areas don’t, outbreaks can occur if the populations mix.

What’s the outlook for achieving herd immunity in the U.S.?
The U.S. is currently making progress toward herd immunity through a combined approach. The number of fully vaccinated adults continues to rise. In addition, more than 31 million people in the U.S. have had confirmed infections with the COVID-19 virus — though, again, it’s not clear how long immunity lasts after infection.

Given the challenges, it’s not clear if or when the U.S. will achieve herd immunity.

However, the FDA-authorized COVID-19 vaccines are highly effective at protecting against severe illness requiring hospitalization and death due to COVID-19. Even if it isn’t currently possible to stop transmission of the COVID-19 virus, the vaccines are allowing people to better be able to live with the virus."

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by 3catcircus

That you consider herd immunity to be nonsense is a shame - it shows only your lack of science education.

The science has been settled - herd immunity exists, it's just a matter of how many people need to be infected and recover for the rest of the population to not become sick.

I slammed herd immunity in case of Covid 19, and Corona virusses in general.

I know herd immunity exists with other deseases. With Corona however such claims are naive, if not dubious, and I got tired of them by now. Do we have herd immunity against flu? Common cold? We do not, and probably never will. These virusses, Corona family, are too eager to mutate all the time.

The term has been used by antivaccers since long time now to denounce the reasonability of artifical vaccination.

Fact is that whereever they claimed herd immunity already existed for Covid-19 - it did not.

Therefore, many virologists have given up hopes to ever acchieve herd immunity for Covid 19 already last autumn, and some did so even earlier, if they really knew Corona virusses from their workplaces and research projects.

Theoretically, for keeping Delta harmless, you would need a vaccination rate of all population and all age groups, of 90% it was said, btw, probably even higher, 95%. Lower rates of 75-85% are only valid for earlier strains that were less infectous.

Its a dead horse, but they keep on beating it like a jungle drum. Pure desperation.


Of course it does not help that vaccinated and recovered alike loose immunity again after some months. Another detial Covid 19 has in common with the seaosnal flu and the common cold. Thats why they give seasonal flu shots, every year. Their efficiency vary from year to year and with age group, from 20, 25% to 40, 45%, in some years slightly higher.

[mapuc]

To stay in this Corona herd discussion in our US-politic thread.

Read somewhere that to archive this herd immunity at least 80-90 % of the population need to take the vaccine or get infected and thereby build a natural immunity against Covid-19
(Could of course remember wrong)

Markus

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by mapuc

To stay in this Corona herd discussion in our US-politic thread.

Read somewhere that to archive this herd immunity at least 80-90 % of the population need to take the vaccine or get infected and thereby build a natural immunity against Covid-19
(Could of course remember wrong)

Markus

Unfortunately Marcus we’ve learned from some here they just simply believe it’s impossible to achieve. Instead demanding that we must lock down, quarantine and start forced injections. Meanwhile U.S. media has turned into just like any other banana republic source of information. Having been infiltrated by our own government intelligence services and our elected officials fear them and not us. Even worse our economy may make like a submarine and crash dive to the bottom soon.

Mark my words, if that happens I can guarantee you the headlines will pit us against each other once again. Instead of our media journalists defending us and looking at the decades of irresponsible spending, and holding politicians of both parties to account. They will lead off with headlines squabbling with each other over whose fault it was vaxxers and anti vaxxers.

[Rockstar]

See the difference between media spin and an actual real honest to goodness accusation of a crime having been committed?

Trump accused of everything under the sun, collusion, Steele dossier, stormy Daniels, Michael Cohen, pee tapes, tax evasion, Putin’s Manchuria candidate, insurrection. six years later nothing.

Governor Cuomo accused of rape and he hauls arse out of town.

https://nypost.com/2021/08/10/andrew...r-of-new-york/

[Catfish]

Originally Posted by mapuc

[...]Read somewhere that to archive this herd immunity at least 80-90 % of the population need to take the vaccine or get infected and thereby build a natural immunity against Covid-19
Markus

Rockstar read it all somewhere, too.

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Catfish

Rockstar read it all somewhere, too.

It was in the Danish news some days ago. In this issue they talked about herd immunity and why Denmark could not archive this.

Denmark can not archive herd immunity due to many(800.000) not response to the call and the vaccine is not 100 % effective

Markus

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Catfish

Rockstar read it all somewhere, too.

That’s right I did. I love ya buddy if your ever in the U.S. you buy the whiskey and I’ll buy the Hindu Kush and we’ll head up to the Appalachians and go shroom hunting and talk to the bears.

[mapuc]

Back to US Politics

So USA does not exist anymore !?

What type of country has it turned into instead ?

Markus