Obama running scared. Refuse to debate Clinton - Page 12

TDK1044 · 05-16-08, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/d0a842c3d2

That guy is mild compared to Hillary during a rant!

NEON DEON · 05-16-08, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TDK1044

Barack Obama
Pledged: 1608
Superdelegates: 291
Total: 1,899

Hillary Clinton
Pledged: 1445
Superdelegates: 274
Total: 1,719

Today he's 180 delegates ahead. I'd say your incumbent needs a mathematical miracle, NEON.

Pledged delagates TDK

Pledged delagates.

Obama is 400 or so short.

Race is not over. If it makes you feel better to add in SDs that can flip flop any old time they want, then go right ahead.

In the end, swings states, popular vote, and not enough pledged delegates will sink Obama.

TDK1044 · 05-16-08, 01:16 PM

I really don't think you understand the structure set up by the DNC. It's a total of pledged and super delegates, NEON. With pledged delegates alone, neither of them win this race. The SDs are just waiting for the appropriate time to push Obama past the post. He's actually about 130 votes short right now. Hillary needs over 300.....never going to happen.

NEON DEON · 05-16-08, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TDK1044

I really don't think you understand the structure set up by the DNC. It's a total of pledged and super delegates, NEON. With pledged delegates alone, neither of them win this race. The SDs are just waiting for the appropriate time to push Obama past the post. He's actually about 130 votes short right now. Hillary needs over 300.....never going to happen.

Oh I understand. Do the Sds understand is the question.

According to you they vote for who they want to win.

According to me they vote based on who can win in November.

If the SDs are charged with voting based on their own personal beliefs, then the numbers right now show Obama will more than likely win.

That, however, is a big if when you consider why they were created in the first place. To beat the republicans in November.

Thats me story and I am sticking to it

August · 05-16-08, 03:18 PM

Isn't Bill Clinton one of the Super Delegates? He's for sure not going to vote for Obama.

TDK1044 · 05-17-08, 05:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NEON DEON

Quote:

Originally Posted by TDK1044

I really don't think you understand the structure set up by the DNC. It's a total of pledged and super delegates, NEON. With pledged delegates alone, neither of them win this race. The SDs are just waiting for the appropriate time to push Obama past the post. He's actually about 130 votes short right now. Hillary needs over 300.....never going to happen.

Oh I understand. Do the Sds understand is the question.

According to you they vote for who they want to win.

According to me they vote based on who can win in November.

If the SDs are charged with voting based on their own personal beliefs, then the numbers right now show Obama will more than likely win.

That, however, is a big if when you consider why they were created in the first place. To beat the republicans in November.

Thats me story and I am sticking to it

What you don't seem to understand is that the SDs are first and foremost politicians at either local or National level. Their first instinct is self preservation. That is how they are voting. Here are todays numbers.

Barack Obama
Pledged: 1612
Superdelegates: 292
Total: 1,904

Hillary Clinton
Pledged: 1443
Superdelegates: 274
Total: 1,717

There has been and will be a day to day trickle of endorsements for him and none for her....one or two maybe. An honorable candidate would have put the Party first and withdrawn by now, but there's nothing honorable about Hillary. She'll give a victory speech after her meaningless Kentucky victoy and ask the voters for more money.

nikimcbee · 05-17-08, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

Isn't Bill Clinton one of the Super Delegates? He's for sure not going to vote for Obama.

...or is he?:hmm: That would be priceless if that ever slipped out. The plates would be a-flyin' at the Clinton house.:rotfl:

TDK1044 · 05-17-08, 11:17 AM

NEON is wrong when he says that the SDs will vote based on who they think will win against McCain in November. That is the theory behind the formation of the SDs sure, but in reality another game is in play.

Most of the SDs are local politicians of one type or another, and they are primarily interested in getting re-elected in their State, whoever ends up as President.

Take as an example Congressman John Lewis in Georgia. He is a staunch Clinton supporter. At the start of her campaign, he held a press conference, with her present, openly endorsing her. When Georgia went to the polls, Georgians voted heavily for Obama. Within a few days of the result, Lewis held another press conference endorsing Obama. He knew that if he didn't, he be voted out at the next election.

That scenario is what's playing out accross the Country now, and that's why the fact that Obama has won so many more States than Hillary is important.

The only reason that this farce isn't over yet, is because a large number of the SDs would much rather not be forced into showing their preference in a vote if they don't have to be. They don't want to piss off their constituents, and they don't want to piss off Hillary, but when push comes to shove, they will put their own interests first and vote the way their constituents voted.

Come June 3rd, Obama will be the nominee, even if Hillary does well in KY, Puerto Rico and Montana. Dean has put the word out that he wants votes from the remaing SDs on that day.

NEON DEON · 05-17-08, 02:39 PM

TDK

How do you explain Richardson the Governor of New Mexico, or for that matter the Governors of North Carolina, Puerto Rico, and Massachussets?

Besides that theory of yours might just work against Obama since a lot of delegates are not elected officials and even more are from Non urban areas which heavily favored Clinton.

Indiana:

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/pri.../state/#val=IN

Missouri:

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/pri.../state/#val=MO

The best place for your theory would be large urban areas where there are a signifigant number of African American voters. Here I can understand how they would vote and yet the Mayor of Philidelphia endorsed Hillary Clinton.

So in the end the SDs will do what they are charged with doing.

With the exception of Bill who will vote for his wife even if she did not have the popular vote, swing states, and has the best chance to beat McCain based on the demographics.

TDK1044 · 05-18-08, 06:01 AM

Come June 3rd, we'll see who is right, NEON.

NEON DEON · 05-18-08, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TDK1044

Come June 3rd, we'll see who is right, NEON.

YAY!

Everyone gets to vote afterall!

TDK1044 · 06-06-08, 07:08 AM

And it all went down exactly as I said it would. Obama got a flood of super delegates having reached the magic number, and Horrible Hillary is left whining about the popular vote.

We live in a Republic, not a Democracy.....although 90 percent of Americans don't know that because of our poor education system. The popular vote is cosmetic in terms of the presidential election, and the same is true for the Democratic nomination process.

Since the Indiana primary, Hillary's strategy has been to hang around long enough to damage Obama enough so that he will struggle to beat McCain. She would like to see McCain elected so that she can run against him in 2012, when he'll be 76 years old and looking and sounding even more frail than he does now.

Such is politics!

AVGWarhawk · 06-06-08, 07:29 AM

We are not "We the people...." She is correct in the respect concerning the popular vote. In a way I sympathize with Hillary in this matter. IMO, the super delegates did not look at the popular vote, they went with who THEY liked. Not democratic at all. So, did we really have a vote that mattered? No. Did the media drive Obama to the nomination? Sure did.

McCain will be a one term president if elected.

TDK1044 · 06-06-08, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

McCain will be a one term president if elected.

Sure. He'll either die in office, or Hillary will run against him and he'll wish he was dead.

Stealth Hunter · 06-06-08, 07:49 AM

Or somebody will kill him...

In all honestly, the Republicans are the last thing the citizens of the United States want in office. I doubt he'll be elected to begin with, but if he is, perhaps he'll either die of shock or be assassinated. I respect his military career, but I don't respect nor agree with his politics, which have included appearing with President Bush 95% of the time the man gives a speech.

McCain is old, frail, and doesn't appear to be in the best of health. Perhaps it will turn out to be a Fatty Arbuckle situation if he is elected to save us the pain of more Republican incompetence (Fatty Arbuckle lost his job with his movie studio and was eventually signed back into it a few years later; he was so excited that he died of a heart attack that night, brought on by his poor dieting options).

05-16-08, 03:18 PM	#170
August Wayfaring Stranger Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 23,226 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Isn't Bill Clinton one of the Super Delegates? He's for sure not going to vote for Obama. __________________ Flanked by life and the funeral pyre. Putting on a show for you to see.

05-17-08, 02:39 PM	#174
NEON DEON Ace of the Deep Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 1,207 Downloads: 39 Uploads: 5	TDK How do you explain Richardson the Governor of New Mexico, or for that matter the Governors of North Carolina, Puerto Rico, and Massachussets? Besides that theory of yours might just work against Obama since a lot of delegates are not elected officials and even more are from Non urban areas which heavily favored Clinton. Indiana: http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/pri.../state/#val=IN Missouri: http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/pri.../state/#val=MO The best place for your theory would be large urban areas where there are a signifigant number of African American voters. Here I can understand how they would vote and yet the Mayor of Philidelphia endorsed Hillary Clinton. So in the end the SDs will do what they are charged with doing. With the exception of Bill who will vote for his wife even if she did not have the popular vote, swing states, and has the best chance to beat McCain based on the demographics. __________________ Diesel Boats Forever!

06-06-08, 07:29 AM	#178
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,291 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	We are not "We the people...." She is correct in the respect concerning the popular vote. In a way I sympathize with Hillary in this matter. IMO, the super delegates did not look at the popular vote, they went with who THEY liked. Not democratic at all. So, did we really have a vote that mattered? No. Did the media drive Obama to the nomination? Sure did. McCain will be a one term president if elected. __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

05-16-08, 01:16 PM	#168
TDK1044 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 2,674 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	I really don't think you understand the structure set up by the DNC. It's a total of pledged and super delegates, NEON. With pledged delegates alone, neither of them win this race. The SDs are just waiting for the appropriate time to push Obama past the post. He's actually about 130 votes short right now. Hillary needs over 300.....never going to happen.

05-17-08, 11:17 AM	#173
TDK1044 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 2,674 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	NEON is wrong when he says that the SDs will vote based on who they think will win against McCain in November. That is the theory behind the formation of the SDs sure, but in reality another game is in play. Most of the SDs are local politicians of one type or another, and they are primarily interested in getting re-elected in their State, whoever ends up as President. Take as an example Congressman John Lewis in Georgia. He is a staunch Clinton supporter. At the start of her campaign, he held a press conference, with her present, openly endorsing her. When Georgia went to the polls, Georgians voted heavily for Obama. Within a few days of the result, Lewis held another press conference endorsing Obama. He knew that if he didn't, he be voted out at the next election. That scenario is what's playing out accross the Country now, and that's why the fact that Obama has won so many more States than Hillary is important. The only reason that this farce isn't over yet, is because a large number of the SDs would much rather not be forced into showing their preference in a vote if they don't have to be. They don't want to piss off their constituents, and they don't want to piss off Hillary, but when push comes to shove, they will put their own interests first and vote the way their constituents voted. Come June 3rd, Obama will be the nominee, even if Hillary does well in KY, Puerto Rico and Montana. Dean has put the word out that he wants votes from the remaing SDs on that day.

05-18-08, 06:01 AM	#175
TDK1044 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 2,674 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	Come June 3rd, we'll see who is right, NEON.

06-06-08, 07:08 AM	#177
TDK1044 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 2,674 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	And it all went down exactly as I said it would. Obama got a flood of super delegates having reached the magic number, and Horrible Hillary is left whining about the popular vote. We live in a Republic, not a Democracy.....although 90 percent of Americans don't know that because of our poor education system. The popular vote is cosmetic in terms of the presidential election, and the same is true for the Democratic nomination process. Since the Indiana primary, Hillary's strategy has been to hang around long enough to damage Obama enough so that he will struggle to beat McCain. She would like to see McCain elected so that she can run against him in 2012, when he'll be 76 years old and looking and sounding even more frail than he does now. Such is politics!

06-06-08, 07:49 AM	#180
Stealth Hunter Silent Hunter Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Y'ha-Nthlei Posts: 4,262 Downloads: 19 Uploads: 0	Or somebody will kill him... In all honestly, the Republicans are the last thing the citizens of the United States want in office. I doubt he'll be elected to begin with, but if he is, perhaps he'll either die of shock or be assassinated. I respect his military career, but I don't respect nor agree with his politics, which have included appearing with President Bush 95% of the time the man gives a speech. McCain is old, frail, and doesn't appear to be in the best of health. Perhaps it will turn out to be a Fatty Arbuckle situation if he is elected to save us the pain of more Republican incompetence (Fatty Arbuckle lost his job with his movie studio and was eventually signed back into it a few years later; he was so excited that he died of a heart attack that night, brought on by his poor dieting options).