[WIP] Lighthouses mod

[gap]

Originally Posted by Kendras

So, maybe the easiest way is to keep the current paint sheme.

I am afraid the yellow/black cardinal mark system has been introduced after WWII. In any case, the historical picture you have posted here a few days ago seems to discard it. Pity, because it looked very cool

Plain (dark) green, plain red and red with a central black band, all are likely alternatives with their own pro's and con's. Unless we find information on the paint scheme actually used at the time, I have no real preference for one or the other. Most of my remarks on the subject are more me thinking out loud, than actually suggesting/discarding any of the aforementioned options

Originally Posted by Kendras

Thank you, that was a good exercice.

I am impressed by your work

Originally Posted by Kendras

Now, we have to find an average shape for each group.

More than looking for an average shape, I would rather choose a lighthouse for each category which fits better the caracteristics of the group. I would then model it as accurately as possible, but stripping it down as much as possible of any non-shared feature. Any accessory/specific parts can be stored in the library file, and set as configurable equipments that we can switch on and off at wish.
The advantage of this work-flow is that, within one model, we get an accurate representaation of at least one of the lighthouses in the group, and a generic representation of all the others

Originally Posted by Kendras

You return to Senegal ?

No long trips on the horizon, for now

Originally Posted by Kendras

For generic lighthouses, I think they should be very simple 3D models, and we should be able to rescale them easily (different separated parts, easy scaling on Y axis to change only the height).

In general, I think we should not waste too much of our time in customizing the generic models. If I had to focus on making a generic model to resamble more closely to a specific lighthouse, I would rather model that lighthouse, maybe using the generic model as template.

That said, I hope to use stripped-down versions of specific lighthouse models as generic models, setting them as "proxy clones" (a "proxy clone" is an unit pointing to the dat file of another unit). This is a method used in SHIV and 5 for representing some sibling aircraft/ship classes, but it should work in SHIII too. Using this method, unit type, equipments and textures can be easily customized for each copy of the main unit, but unfortunately there is not way to customize its height, unless we divided the main model in slices, the lower ones being set as configurable library equipments (but that would be a very unhortodox approach lol )

Originally Posted by Kendras

The texture applied to them should be easily tweaked in order to have different textures for the same model, depending on the lighthouse). For example, Le Four and Les Pierres Noires are very similar, but the texture must be different.

No problem for textures, but remember that not always modern paint schemes are indicative of the historical ones

Originally Posted by gap

I am afraid the yellow/black cardinal mark system has been introduced after WWII. In any case, the historical picture you have posted here a few days ago seems to discard it. Pity, because it looked very cool
...
No problem for textures, but remember that not always modern paint schemes are indicative of the historical ones

I think, our method should be this one : we create lighthouses with colors and light signal of nowadays, unless we have precise informations about how it was during WWII.

Originally Posted by gap

More than looking for an average shape, I would rather choose a lighthouse for each category which fits better the caracteristics of the group. I would then model it as accurately as possible

In general, I think we should not waste too much of our time in customizing the generic models.

If I had to focus on making a generic model to resamble more closely to a specific lighthouse, I would rather model that lighthouse, maybe using the generic model as template.

I have put a green color on groups that we should focus on first. In these groups, a lighthouse's name is sometimes also green, meaning that this lighthouse should be modeled first, and used as generic lighthouse for all the lighthouses of the group.

[gap]

Originally Posted by Kendras

I think, our method should be this one : we create lighthouses with colors and light signal of nowadays, unless we have precise informations about how it was during WWII.

If I have to choose, I would rather paint La Plate red with a black band, and Le Chat plain red, even though we miss definitive clues that those were their paint schemes

Originally Posted by Kendras

I have put a green color on groups that we should focus on first. In these groups, a lighthouse's name is sometimes also green, meaning that this lighthouse should be modeled first, and used as generic lighthouse for all the lighthouses of the group.

I hope you have also taken into account the availability of models in 3DWarehouse, as they somehow ease my work...

Originally Posted by gap

I hope you have also taken into account the availability of models in 3DWarehouse, as they somehow ease my work...

My choice is indicative, do as you wish.

[gap]

Originally Posted by Kendras

My choice is indicative, do as you wish.

Okay

[gap]

Originally Posted by Kendras

I think, our method should be this one : we create lighthouses with colors and light signal of nowadays, unless we have precise informations about how it was during WWII.

Maybe we could get in touch with Jean-Christophe Fichou on this subject. He is the author of the article Les phares français pendant la Seconde Guerre mondiale that I pointed you to a while ago, co-author of the book Phares: histoire du balisage et de l'éclairage des côtes de France and owner of the website http://phares-de-france.pagesperso-orange.fr, which is the best source of historical information on French lighthouses I have found so far.
I think no one better than him can provide us with the information we are looking for, or point us to the appropriate sources, and being an enthusiat himself, he could take an interest in our little project. What do you think?

His email address is: JCF@phares-de-france.com. My written French sucks, could you drop him a line explaining to him what we are doing and the information we are looking for?

Originally Posted by gap

Maybe we could get in touch with Jean-Christophe Fichou on this subject. He is the author of the article Les phares français pendant la Seconde Guerre mondiale that I pointed you to a while ago, co-author of the book Phares: histoire du balisage et de l'éclairage des côtes de France and owner of the website http://phares-de-france.pagesperso-orange.fr, which is the best source of historical information on French lighthouses I have found so far.
I think no one better than him can provide us with the information we are looking for, or point us to the appropriate sources, and being an enthusiat himself, he could take an interest in our little project. What do you think?

His email address is: JCF@phares-de-france.com. My written French sucks, could you drop him a line explaining to him what we are doing and the information we are looking for?

Mmh, you gave me all the informations. I guess I have no choice ?

[gap]

Originally Posted by Kendras

Mmh, you gave me all the informations. I guess I have no choice ?

We have no choice. The very same future of SH games modding, is in your and Jean-Christophe Fichou's hands

[MLF]

Returning to La Tourelle de La Plate

Originally Posted by gap

I am afraid the yellow/black cardinal mark system has been introduced after WWII. In any case, the historical picture you have posted here a few days ago seems to discard it. Pity, because it looked very cool

Plain (dark) green, plain red and red with a central black band, all are likely alternatives with their own pro's and con's. Unless we find information on the paint scheme actually used at the time, I have no real preference for one or the other. Most of my remarks on the subject are more me thinking out loud, than actually suggesting/discarding any of the aforementioned options

I emailed the Service de l'Inventaire du Patrimoine Culturel Direction du Tourisme, du Patrimoine et des Voies navigables who replied with a b/w photograph from 1950 (possibly has already been seen on this thread) which shows the tower with a dark top and light coloured bottom. They also referred me to the following web site:-

http://www.dirm.nord-atlantique-manche-ouest.developpement-durable.gouv.fr/sites-des-subdivisions-des-phares-balises-a62.html

From that web site I emailed the address given there and received a reply and a scan of a notice to mariners dated 31/03/1922 basically stating that the light, which had been reported extinguished, was now back up and working.

There is also a section on the notice - Renseignements (Information) which states the following:-

Nature:- Permanent gas light
Shape:- Turret painted in red surmounted by a reservoir and a lantern
Colour of Light: Green


As, I believe, this department is responsible for the painting of these light towers, this is about as close as we will possibly get to knowing the colour of the tower

Regards,

MLF

[gap]

Originally Posted by MLF

Returning to La Tourelle de La Plate ...

Merci beacoup MLF,

your help and the kind support of the French authorities that you have been in touch with, are invaluable!

Summing up:

• 1911:
  • tower color not specified
  • steady green light
  
  (source: Jean-Cristophe Fichou, Les Phares de France (website)).
  
  
• 1922:
  • tower painted red
  • green light, period not specified
  
  (source: notice by the Subdivision des phares et balises de Brest)
  
  
• 1950:
  • dark tower (black or red? Maybe fouling/seaweed at the bottom?) with a central light band (white or yellow?)
  • light color and period not specified
  
  (source: picture by the Service de l'Inventaire du Patrimoine Culturel Direction du Tourisme, du Patrimoine et des Voies navigables, another picture posted by Kendras (year unknown))

All in all, I think I will opt for the red tower and green steady light configuration, i.e. the best documented, though it might have changed before the outbreak of the war...

Any thoughts?

[MLF]

hi gap,

Another picture from delcampe.net which shows La Plate - no dates though. I think it is showing the tower all red as per the 1922 notice?

I think you are right re. opting for the all red config (between wars). The 1950's one would be a post-war, and the cardinal would be post 1971 (or there-abouts)

Regards,

MLF

[gap]

Originally Posted by MLF

hi gap,

Another picture from delcampe.net which shows La Plate - no dates though. I think it is showing the tower all red as per the 1922 notice?

I think you are right re. opting for the all red config (between wars). The 1950's one would be a post-war, and the cardinal would be post 1971 (or there-abouts)

Regards,

MLF

Another good picture, and it clearly shows that the dark portion near the waterline is just algae!

At this point, the 1950's paint scheme might be interpetrated as a North cardinal mark (black on top and yellow near the bottom), though the current West mark usage makes much more sense in that position

Since we are at it, let me know if you find anything about the nearby Tourelle du Chat. This beacon is currently painted as a South cardinal mark and I think it has been recently restored, but some pre-restoration pictures show traces of what could be the remains of a previous red paint coat, especially evident near the base. I would be glad if we found pictorial or written confirmation of my suspects...

 

Merci pour tes recherches, MLF !

[MLF]

I received a b/w photograph this morning from the same source as the Notice to Mariners I posted yesterday. It is a close up (very clear) of the Tourelle de La Plate from 1936 which shows the tower all in one colour. i have asked for permission to post it in this thread. I have also asked about La Tourelle du Chat.

Regards,

MLF