The game model mostly needs...

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

1) Actually model the propagation delay when using active sonar. I once used ONE ping on a Seawolf from an Akula and the return was very bright. I realized the Seawolf had released an Active Decoy.

The only way it could have time to do so is if it detected my ping before it even reached the sub, or else I should at least have one clear ping before it fires off a decoy.

Not that I really mind designating on the bright blob that's the CM. It is a lot easier than designating on subs and the sub is close enough that designating on the CM is good enough for a shot. But it definitely is not realistic.

Something similar happens to radar. I decide to damn the torpedoes and activate the radar on my sub. Even before it turns on, I've been Counterdetected. I swear the trigger is me raising my radar mast rather than the mast actually emitting.

2) Improved auto TMA plotting when dealing with air contacts. In fact, maybe air contacts should not be analyzed using TMA methods. Generally, what happens is that the first few Marks on the radar receiver allows Otto to come up with something decent on say a helicopter. But then the solution refuses to adapt. The solution's estimated bearing won't even align with the newly received bearings.

[Angle]

Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II

1) Actually model the propagation delay when using active sonar. I once used ONE ping on a Seawolf from an Akula and the return was very bright. I realized the Seawolf had released an Active Decoy.

The only way it could have time to do so is if it detected my ping before it even reached the sub, or else I should at least have one clear ping before it fires off a decoy.

Not that I really mind designating on the bright blob that's the CM. It is a lot easier than designating on subs and the sub is close enough that designating on the CM is good enough for a shot. But it definitely is not realistic.

Something similar happens to radar. I decide to damn the torpedoes and activate the radar on my sub. Even before it turns on, I've been Counterdetected. I swear the trigger is me raising my radar mast rather than the mast actually emitting.

2) Improved auto TMA plotting when dealing with air contacts. In fact, maybe air contacts should not be analyzed using TMA methods. Generally, what happens is that the first few Marks on the radar receiver allows Otto to come up with something decent on say a helicopter. But then the solution refuses to adapt. The solution's estimated bearing won't even align with the newly received bearings.

Reminds me of SC/scx. I created a mission once that had a kilo surfaced. I put on show truth, surface, and turned on my radar. As soon as the switch was flipped (radar didn't even raise all the way) the kilo launched a full load of starfish. Had range and bearing with esm!

[LuftWolf]

1) Actually model the propagation delay when using active sonar. I once used ONE ping on a Seawolf from an Akula and the return was very bright. I realized the Seawolf had released an Active Decoy.

The only way it could have time to do so is if it detected my ping before it even reached the sub, or else I should at least have one clear ping before it fires off a decoy.

Not that I really mind designating on the bright blob that's the CM. It is a lot easier than designating on subs and the sub is close enough that designating on the CM is good enough for a shot. But it definitely is not realistic.

An AI sub won't release an active decoy with pinging from an object other than a weapon, they can tell the difference and so you can you by the frequency range on the active intercept.

The SeaWolf fired the decoy for some reason other than your ping.

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

An AI sub won't release an active decoy with pinging from an object other than a weapon, they can tell the difference and so you can you by the frequency range on the active intercept.

The SeaWolf fired the decoy for some reason other than your ping.

I was playing the under-ice scenario in the Future Fleet scenarios. I hacked it so I can play as the Akulas as well as the default Seawolf.

OK, I had weapons in the water, but they have already missed and I've already given up trying to steer them back.

Auto-TMA shows the Seawolf has slowed to nothing again (a few knots). Pretty good AI there, methinks. I turned on Show Truth to verify this (1 knot, but closer than the auto-TMA thought). Then I decided to ping him to get a firing solution.

I got that bright blob, and I turned on Show Truth. The Seawolf is very close to its obviously newly released decoys and maneuvering. Nobody else had fired weapons, including the Seawolf. If there is another cause, I ain't seeing it even on Show Truth.

Not that it was a bad decision. I couldn't find his real body on the active sonar. I fired torpedoes that missed, again. That's when I decided when I next ping him, I'd fire a spread of 6 SS-N-27 ASW missiles (in my external tubes) at his general position. He did the countermeasure thing again, and I designated on his bright blob and set up the spread. This time, it worked.

BTW, if I rachet down the Pinging Frequency on the Akula, am I likely to get a bit more range out of the active sonar?

[LuftWolf]

That's interesting behavior for the AI. :hmm:

In terms of the active sonar, it doesn't matter how often you ping in terms of what you see as long as you let the ping travel all the way across the screen, although multiple pings will sometimes show contacts that a single ping would not, and the acoustic frequency for the active sonar is fixed. If you have the display range set closer, it will be easier to see contacts in those ranges.

Note, there is a difference between the high frequency sonar and the medium frequency sonar. I assume you are using the medium frequency sonar.

[Miika]

Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II

2) Improved auto TMA plotting when dealing with air contacts. In fact, maybe air contacts should not be analyzed using TMA methods. Generally, what happens is that the first few Marks on the radar receiver allows Otto to come up with something decent on say a helicopter. But then the solution refuses to adapt. The solution's estimated bearing won't even align with the newly received bearings.

I agree with this. In some missions it simply is not smart to use your radar until the target is within missile range. You should be able to use your ESM sensor to have at least some idea of the target's position.

One (simple?) thing I really would like to have is more drawing tools, at least the ability to draw lines in the nav map, for those quick rough estimates etc.

Miika

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

acoustic frequency for the active sonar is fixed. If you have the display range set closer, it will be easier to see contacts in those ranges.

You mean, I can change the sensitivity of my bow and towed sonar arrays, adjust the acceleration of my ship, change my SET-53s for Yu-5s (though not the superficial labelling) and more with a Database Editor, but I can't change the operating frequency of my MF active sonar?!

[LuftWolf]

I didn't realize you were talking about database editing.

For active sonar, I don't believe the transmitting frequency matters, it is only the frequency that shows up on the receiving platforms' active intercept.

As far as I know, only the sensitivity (Nrd) of the active sonar has any effect on its operating ability.

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

I didn't realize you were talking about database editing.

I guess I should have been more clear, but come on, we all saw the interface. It is very single-layer

For active sonar, I don't believe the transmitting frequency matters, it is only the frequency that shows up on the receiving platforms' active intercept.

As far as I know, only the sensitivity (Nrd) of the active sonar has any effect on its operating ability.

Thanks.

[Splobb]

I think the best addition for gameplay would be to be able to fly the Helo while playing FFG. That is to be able to switch to the pilot seat and go and use the dipping sonar myself, and then switch back to the bridge again. Hey I know its not realistic but it would improve gameplay by a mile. For the life of me I can't figure out why they didn't include this option in the game, as you wouldn't think it would be too difficult to impliment. What does everyone else think?

[goldorak]

Originally Posted by Splobb

I think the best addition for gameplay would be to be able to fly the Helo while playing FFG. That is to be able to switch to the pilot seat and go and use the dipping sonar myself, and then switch back to the bridge again. Hey I know its not realistic but it would improve gameplay by a mile. For the life of me I can't figure out why they didn't include this option in the game, as you wouldn't think it would be too difficult to impliment. What does everyone else think?

Since its supposed to be a realistic sim, I don't see the gift of ubiquity as being an essential requisite :rotfl:
On the other hand, the impossibility to command the dipping sonar from the ffg is a pain in the neck.
Of course you can always launch buoys form the helicopter and it bypasses the dipping sonar problem just fine, but yes if S.C.S could fix this little "problem" it would make the sim better

[TLAM Strike]

'nuff said...

[Splobb]

Golorak. I take your point about the realism issue. Then again you could always imagine you were a really gung ho captain who likes to get into the thick of the action in a helo lol.
Anyway it was just a thought, it just gets so frustrating not being able to use the dipping sonar on the AI helo's. Sonar bouys are OK but you don't have the optiion of choosing which type to load the helo up with, so half of them may be useless in the conditions. If you then happen to drop a few in the wrong place, you have to head back to base to reload. It would be so much easier to place a waypoint on the map or go and do it yourself.

[TLAM Strike]

Place a marker with the 'Enter' key and place a Buoy drop waypoint there.

[SeaQueen]

Originally Posted by Angle

Being able to load out the sonobouys on the FFG's helos would be nice.

I agree, but I'd still rather have the dipper.