The gawd-almighty merged DRM in Silent Hunter V thread

[partyboy]

Originally Posted by snapli

Hi all!
You won't buy a complete game; all you'll get for your $$$ is just a fragment of a game, with the missing parts being downloaded at runtime. That's the reason for the permanent connection requirement and that's the reason why the whole crack-idea will fail, in the end.

I agree that almost every other game was cracked in the past, but these guys had the whole package in their hands to do their dirty work ...

There have been plenty of games released already where not all of the files necessary to play are on the game disc and you have to connect to a server to download the rest. Half-life 2, for example. And guess what? They were cracked.

The crackers simply go through the legitimate process at least once, gain access to the downloaded files, package them with their release and crack the executable so it doesn't try and connect to any servers. They either include the downloaded files as part of the normal installation process or in a separate directory which you copy over after the regular install.

There is nothing really new here. It will be cracked like just about everything else. The only benefit is in delaying the inevitable. That's what protection schemes are really about - not stopping a crack, just delaying it for as long as possible to increase sales.

[lorka42]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

I'm betting all PC games will go to online authentication eventually. True, there are a few people on the planet who play games in their doublewide without internet accesss, and there are occasions where internet access is not available to play, but the PC gamer is usually connected to the web 24/7.

I take offense, sir are you implying that we, the wood-constructionally challenged, are somehow less because of our 2" walls, leaky roofs, and terminally leaning porcelain throne?

OT there is a workaround for nearly anything, but FORCING people to have internet access in order to play a game that is meant primarily for offline use, is stupid,#1, wont do anything in the way of stopping piracy#2, and makes me mad#3.

[razark]

I'm seeing why they kept a tight lid on this game. Every time they open their mouths, they lose more customers.

I've found the direction they're going with SH5 to be quite interesting, but I wasn't that interested in playing it. With this model of DRM, I simply can't see buying it any time soon.

[Gatt]

Originally Posted by razark

I'm seeing why they kept a tight lid on this game. Every time they open their mouths, they lose more customers

Well, they kept their mouth shut for pre-orders.
I'd like to know how many pre-orders they will loose in the next month or so.
Mine for sure

[Weather-guesser]

At least with STEAM you only have to be on-line to authenticate the game the first time you play. After that you could play in off-line mode. I wonder what this will be like?

[Gatt]

Originally Posted by Weather-guesser

At least with STEAM you only have to be on-line to authenticate the game. After that you could play in off-line mode. I wonder what this will be like?

Judging form the UBI official post it will be like Rise Of Flight: loose the connection and you can say goodbye to the game session.

However, due to players complaints, RoF will probably drop this system in one of the next patches.

[Gilbou]

I like to go to holidays in Portugal where we have a house there.
It's a calm place, on a top of a kind of moutain.
There, I don't have water coming in : we have a whell with a pump
that brings water to the house. No gas, we use wood we have
to go grab, cut and burn. And there's no telephone line there. It
was so expensive to bring telephone there that the national telephone
company brought ONE line to ONE house and the contract is everyone
there can use the line and pays for its own use. So if I need to call or
be called, I have to go to the neighboor's house which has the phone line,
and call/be called and pay for the use I do. Forget about cellphones
working there.

This is a quiet isolated place I like to go, and with a nice wood fire
turn on a confortable laptop to watch movies, play or reads books
and relax. And yes, I did play SH3 there.

So I am supposed to be connected to Internet all the time now ?
More and more often I no longer carry a cellphone because I'm fed
of people thinking I am supposed to be available for them when I lunch,
when I going to/from work and when I'm not working. I'm not keeping
the cellphone at home and less and less using it to have some moron
marketing suit tell me how I should live my life.

Offline play = no online Internet connection required

Man comes down from the monkey, and it seems some have missed
the ladder at Ubisoft.

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by lorka42

I take offense, sir are you implying that we, the wood-constructionally challenged, are somehow less because of our 2" walls, leaky roofs, and terminally leaning porcelain throne?

Sorry, lol, I let my creative side get carried away As it happens, I live in a 14x70 when I got out of school.

[COWBOY10]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

I'm betting all PC games will go to online authentication eventually. True, there are a few people on the planet who play games in their doublewide without internet accesss, and there are occasions where internet access is not available to play, but the PC gamer is usually connected to the web 24/7.

Im Sorry Neal, I respect you mate and what you have done for our community, But I cant agree with this statement, There are more than a few who dont have internet access on our Gaming Rigs, I have internet on a Internet Rig, allows me to download patches, Surf, Email etc, Then I have a Gaming Rig alone.

This allows me to make sure its running at peak performance, without Virus's, Trojens, Spyware slowing it down etc. I have no problems with DRM, as a rule, BUT this course of going down the lone of permanant Connection at all times is a joke. A one off connection to validate connection, as I had to do with Blackshark and MSX then No Problem.

BUT I dont have a Gaming PC connected full time to the Internet for full time connection, Have the producers heard of a little Flight sim called Rise of Flight, Amazing idea, one the community was looking forward to a great deal, BUT They have lost many many sales by having such an awful way to play the game. E.G. Permanant connection, Server Crashes half way through mission and Bang you lose game.

They state one of the bonus's is that we can have multiple copys on different machines to play anywhere we want, our save games will be on the server etc, UMMM Guess they are thinking about laptops and gaming at work etc, Damn Im lucky to get a mobile signal where I live, let alone Wii Fii at a speed good enough to let this work.

Now I dont know about others, but another problem, is I play SH3 in Real Time, Now if I need a permainant connection, and Im playing Real Time, then Im guessing the connection will be open and info will be getting downloaded to pc right. Wont take long to hit the Download limit and then, Wham, You lose your whole internet not just SH5.


Sorry to Rant guys but Damn, This had so much to offer, and now looks like its sinking with all hands. I just wish the producers would start listening to us once, I am seriously thinking, that they are trying to kill the PC market, NOt just Ubisoft but you just have to look round at other producers and see the shafting PC Gaming is getting.


Seriously considering canning my Pre Order, It seems every peice of news we are hearing in the last few weeks, seems to fire another fish into us.

Cowboy10uk

[sabretwo]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

True, there are a few people on the planet who play games in their doublewide without internet accesss, and there are occasions where internet access is not available to play, but the PC gamer is usually connected to the web 24/7.

Neal,

With all respect, that is absolutely NOT true. There are many people out there with high end systems who do not "live in double-wides", whom are not connected to the Internet when they play games. I travel a lot for business teaching seminars for a living. Most of the opportunity I get to play SH3 is when I am traveling with my laptop on the road and saying in hotels. Depending on where I am and how long I'm there, I often do not have an internet connection.

I have been giving UBI the benefit of the doubt on everything so far...taking a wait and see attitude. But any authentication system that requires an active Internet connection is a deal breaker for me. If they implement such a system, they lost my sale. I'll stick with SH3/SH4 until someone comes out with a crack or a work around. Then I'll buy it.

[theluckyone17]

After a day's worth of thinking it over, I've decided to:

Call 'em tomorrow morning, anid politely express my displeasure.

Then I'll wait.

When SH5 comes out, I'll see what the result is. Maybe SH5 will be good enough to overcome my... reservations. Maybe it won't.

If it doesn't, I'll take the time I would've spent on playing SH5 and put it into helping out on the Danger from the Deep project.

Forget "finding a new hobby". Forget embracing the DRM nonsense and succumbing to the "future". If Ubisoft doesn't want to hand me what I want, maybe I ought to be helping make what I want.

Originally Posted by theluckyone17

Forget "finding a new hobby". Forget embracing the DRM nonsense and succumbing to the "future". If Ubisoft doesn't want to hand me what I want, maybe I ought to be helping make what I want.

Excellent post.

[trenken]

Originally Posted by sabretwo

Neal,

With all respect, that is absolutely NOT true. There are many people out there with high end systems who do not "live in double-wides", whom are not connected to the Internet when they play games. I travel a lot for business teaching seminars for a living. Most of the opportunity I get to play SH3 is when I am traveling with my laptop on the road and saying in hotels. Depending on where I am and how long I'm there, I often do not have an internet connection.

I have been giving UBI the benefit of the doubt on everything so far...taking a wait and see attitude. But any authentication system that requires an active Internet connection is a deal breaker for me. If they implement such a system, they lost my sale. I'll stick with SH3/SH4 until someone comes out with a crack or a work around. Then I'll buy it.

You're a special situation though, you're travelling on business and playing on your laptop in hotels. Safe to say you're way down in the minority there.

Fact is most PC gamers these days have PCs that are always connected to the internet on broadband, so games are being made for them now.

I dont have some killer connection, standard issue broadband cable you can get in almost every town, and if that can handle an MMO, Im pretty sure I can play SH5 while my girlfriend streams a netflix movie through the internet with no problems.

Hell, she's done that while im playing guild wars. It sounds like you guys are stuck in 1996 where games just died if you tried to launch even just a web browser. Its just not like that anymore. I know a lot of PC gamers, all of them are on the internet 24/7, Ubi is well aware of this.

[tater]

You keep harping on the broadband issue. ANY hiccup either in your connection (my MMOG experience is filled with these---as are those of every ww2ol player) ends your game. Have the ubi forums ever been slow or out? Hmmm, yes. Part of subsiums popularity is likely the fact that the ubi forums are amazingly screwy. I remember trying online using the built-in stuff in il-2... ubi again, very flakey. Hence everyone uses HL instead. Any one of these problems ends your game now.

Streaming updates? No modding. No modding AND THE GAME IS NOT WORTH PLAYING.

Read that again, the SH games have not been worth playing regardless of DRM until modded. Not "not as good," but not worth playing. At all (unless you are a twitch gamer who doesn't care in the least about realism).

None of this of course addresses the REASON for this DRM technique. The reason is piracy and the presumption of lost dollars. The reality is that thieves won't pay for it. They'll either crack it and play for free, or not play and not pay.

ANY customers lost due to this are a net revenue loss as a result. Or do you expect deadbeats who pirate stuff to suddenly decide it's worth $50?

[Highbury]

The bottom line is (and don't kid yourselves, the bottom line is all Ubi will look at) is that yeah, 300 - 400 ppl from Subsim may pass on it because of this. But with the new distro methods like Steam you have it adverised as ready to go to millions of people every day. They WILL gain numbers over SHIV because of this.

Have any of you ever played a non Steam game that was later added to Steam? I have with a couple and going by online players the number shot up fourfold.. and we know most players don't go online.

Sure they will lose some of the dedicated old people, but will gain thousands of people who say "Oh what's this, I'll try it" on Steam. SHV will outsell SHIV. A new players money smells just as good as a Salty Old Dog's and Ubi will be pleased with themselves.

If you are angry because you have a poor connection, I feel for ya. If you are just trying to make a moral stand... good luck with that.. Ubi is laughing all the way to the bank.