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#1 |
Lucky Jack
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Ok, this next one is notes the OP wrote furing the time he was listening to the lecture of Lindemann.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- To set the scene a bit, the British had just failed to pull off 'Operation Battleaxe' (an attempt to relieve Tobruk) losing almost 80% of their tanks. The Germans lost 62 tanks but managed to recover 50 of those to fight again. On arrival in Libya, Lindemann spent his first two months assembling and training a panzer company for the planned November attack to crush the besieged town of Tobruk which had been cut off by the Germans and now lay 70 miles behind the front lines. (Lindemann said that one of the punishments for screwing up in training was being made to jog along behind your tank carrying one of the spare road wheels!) The biggest difficulty was lack of supplies. Fuel, ammunition and vehicles were having a very tough time crossing the Mediterranean sea due to British submarine and air attacks. The Germans were recieving about 72,000 tons of supplies per month (including only 35 Flak 36 guns all summer), which was not enough to get by on. By November 18th (according to my sources) DAK only had 35 PzII, 58 PzIII, 17 PzIV, 12 Flak 36 and 96 Pak 38 AT guns. The Italians could only field about 140 tanks, mostly M-13s. Other vehicles including captured British equipment helped bulk out the force. In November a combination of bad weather along the coast and the fact that NO supplies had made it across the Med that month forced Rommel to postpone the attack on Tobruk until Dec3. About the only action was a recce mission to investigate a large supply dump that suggested that the Brits were building up for an assault. While the recon team was almost destroyed during this probe, they did discover that the supply dump was a dummy and captured a South African command tuck which contained orders concerning British withdrawals and made no mention of any planned attack. (these orders were fake, meant to fool the Germans.) The British had other ideas however and launched 'Operation Crusader' with 724 tanks, 201 of them infantry tanks and the rest cruisers, on November 18th. Designed to do what 'Operation Battleaxe' had failed to do, only on a larger scale, the operation was meant to both relieve Tobruk and drive the DAK out of Cyreniaca. The Germans had no warning of the impending attack until some units of 15th panzer on patrol near Sidi Omar ran into lead elements and reported them as a "Reconaissance in Force". (it was still being called that after two days of heavy fighting). One of Rommels few mistakes. The Brits and Commonwealth forces advanced quickly until they ran into the effects of the weather on the coastal areas. General Cruwell decided that this was the line of the British attack and ordered von Ravenstein to form a special force- 5th Panzer Regiment with 12 10.5cm howitzers and 4 Flak 36- to move south from Gambut (where the main German supply and repair area was), to Gabr Saleh to attack the British 4th Armoured Brigade there. This unit was called 'Kampfgruppe Stephan' after its commander. Chasing 3rd Recces armoured cars and doing recce sweeps themselves had broken up 4th Armoureds units. Kampfgruppe Stephan first encountered the 8th Hussars late in the afternoon on the 19th, northeast of Gabr Saleh. In the vicious firefight that followed, 20 Stuart tanks were knocked out mostly by the 88s which were using a new tactic of firing from their trailers. This was the first time this had been done although 88s had been used at Arras in France as a despiration measure against Matildas and again at Halfaya pass. This was the first time they had been fired from trailers however. It worked very well, the guns could fire, move quickly to another position and fire again. (Lindemann said that this bent the early trailers and later trailers were made much heavier to allow for this.) 5th RTR was called up to assist the 8th Hussars and promptly lost another 3 Stuarts although 12 of the knocked out tanks would later be recovered. Kampfgruppe Stephan lost only 3 tanks with 4 more damaged but recoverable. The two sides withdrew from each other as darkness came on but Kampfgruppe Stephan who had planned to move to Sidi Omar was stuck awaiting fuel from its supply columns. The rest of 15th and 21st panzer were moved south in the night to support Kampfgruppe Stephan. At dawn on the 20th of November, elements of the 4th Armoured Brigade re-engaged Kampfgruppe Stephan in what would turn into a running battle with Stephan doing a fighting withdrawal to the northwest. Knocking out 8 more stuarts and losing 4 tanks themselves (2 of which were PzIIs) The unit retreated to its rendezvous point with 15th and 21st panzer. The British, thinking they had beaten them, followed only to be engaged by the 15th panzer. 21st having had to stop to refuel. 15th and 21st panzer were ordered to disengage and move west to strike at the 7th Armoured Brigade and other units drawn up at Sidi Rezegh just south east of Tobruk. Moving out in the dark just before dawn on 21 Nov they were so quiet that 4th Armoured brigade (and the 22nd who had by now arrived in support), didn't even realize they had left until dawn light showed the last unit disappearing westward. The 21st of November had started for the 7th armoured brigade at Sidi Rezegh being ordered north to meet the Tobruk breakout force at El Duda. The British assumed the the retreat earlier meant the end of the German threat in the area. However, just before the attack was supposed to begin, two large German armoured formations appeared on their right flank. This was 15th and 21st panzer in full attack. 7th Armoured Brigade was forced to split its formation with the 7th Hussars and the 2nd RTR moved east to meet them leaving the 6th RTR alone to lead the charge for Tobruk. This move cost the 6thRTR 39 tanks to the field guns and 88s that formed the outer ring of the besiegers forces. 7th Hussar and 2ndRTR fared no better with the 7th nearly being wiped out by 21st panzer in a running fight that made good use of pak and flak guns moving and shooting. By the end of the day only 12 7th Hussar tanks, some damaged, were left running. This was Lindemanns first combat action and he and his unit did well, knocking out nearly 30 British and Commonwealth vehicles with very few losses to themselves. Another 16 tanks from the 21st panzer attacked the 7th Hussars support group near the Sidi Rezegh airfield. This unit met with less success as they met 25lber guns manned by 60th Field Regiment and were beaten back. A Stuka attack on the guns was unsuccessful due to inaccurate bombing. A British counter attack by 5 Support and HQ company Crusaders was also unsuccessful as all were hit. Fire from the 25lbers continued to hold off 21st panzer but both sides were running low on ammunition and with the arrival of the 22nd Armoured Brigade from Gabr Saleh made the Germans decide to withdraw. 2nd RTR was engaged by 15th panzer and suffered much the same fate as the 7th Hussars. Rommel in the meantime, had got together a scratch force from the Gambut repair facility and used them to repulse the British breakout attempt from Tobruk at El Duda. ![]() At this point British XXX corps had suffered badly but incomplete intelligence from the front convinced the 8th Army Commnader that things were going well except for the failure to link up with Tobruk and he suggested that the 1st South African Division be brought up from Bir Gubi to aid in the next mornings attack. DAK commanders decided to disengage and reposition themselves overnight with the 15th panzer being sent to a position east of the British and south of Gambut and the 21st being set up on a line facing south along the escarpement from Sid Rezegh to Belhamed and between the British and Tobruk. The British, including the 22nd Armoured division, seeing these movements interpreted them as a withdrawal from the fight and stayed near the Sidi Rezegh Airfield. Rommel deciding the chance was too good to miss, told Von Ravenstein to attack the airport in the afternoon of the 21st. With fire support fron Artillery Gruppe Bottcher (a company Rommel had assembled to bombard Tobruk), the 21st panzers 155th rifle regiment attacked from the north engaging the British infantry protecting the airport while one battalion of 15th panzer swept around and attacked from the west. iIn the dust, smoke and confusion the British even fired on approaching tanks of the 4th Armoured Brigade br mistake as they came in to counter attack. It was all too much for the British and they had no choice but to withdraw from the airport to the south over a protecting ridge. As dusk fell however, 15th panzer came roaring in from the Northeast causing extra chaos. By the end of the action 22nd Armoured Brigade was down to 34 running tanks an 7th Armoured had only 15. German losses were very light. As a bonus, 15th panzer also captured the HQ and Staff of the 4th Armoured Brigade during the night attack, but this was more than offset by the capture of the DAKs entire communication center and staff and codebooks from their base near Gambut by the 6th New Zealand Division. |
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#2 |
Lucky Jack
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![]() ![]() The 23rd of November was a Sunday Totensonntag (Rememberance Sunday)in the German calender. Rommel ordered the destruction of the remaining 7th Armoured by encircling them. 15th panzer plus 21st panzers 5th Panzer Regiment came down ffrom the North, sweeping west and joining up with the Italian Ariete division coming up from the south west. The British were decimated, but at a severe cost due to poor management of the northern attackers, the Germans losing 72 out of the 162 tanks that attacked. Lindemann said he remembered the day as incredibly hectic, they fired as fast as they could pick targets, the tommies were running everywhere. Rommel decided to capitalize on the destruction and dissarray of the British by making a spectacular dash towards the Egyptian border in his command car leading the 15th and 21st panzer in a diversionary sweep along the coast. At one point his column was 40 miles long. Back in the border area, things were quiet Cunningham and his corps commanders were having a conference near the border and staff cars and trucks were parked everywhere. Suddenly, out of the blue came Rommel and his tanks bearing down on them. In a mad dash (later jokingly called the Matruh Stakes), everyone including the Generals, scattered and ran east for the border. Unfortunatley for the Germans the DAK was too depleted for Rommels sweep to do much more than psychological damage, although they did finally figure out how to tackle the 25lbers that had been troubling them. By giving the batteries a plastering from the 75mm guns of the PzIV firing HE they could kill or drive off gun crews then the tanks would roll over the guntrails crushing them. 'Operation Crusader' had been badly handled by Cunningham and Auchinleck used it as an excuse to relieve him. Both sides were badly battered afterwards and Rommel decided to cut his losses and withdraw to El Agheila where he had started back in February. So in spite of the loss of most of the battles, Operation Crusader actually achieved it's goals of liberating Tobruk and kicking th DAK out of Cyrenaica. ![]() |
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#3 |
Lucky Jack
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Anlashok; I think what he said he hated most was artillery, You never know they are coming in until they start exploding all around you and you can't shoot back. All you can do is try to find cover and hope it doesn't last very long. I imagine his worst moment was when they recieved the order to surrender at Cape Bon. Von Arnhem was in charge of the DAK at that time and I remember him saying that Von Arhem had surrendered before they did....
Best moment? Well he told a few stories about partying with Hans Marseille (109 Ace) (<-That'll be be Hans Joachim Marseille, the best scoring LW ace in the western front. -Dowly) who had a reputation for being quite the ladies man.... Wolf 326 asked about tracks; Yes there were two types of track for the Tiger. Due to the fact that they needed to be shippable by rail the Tiger had a 40cm track (verladen kette) that was used to move them around and on and off load them from railcars. (They had to be narrow enough that they could pass through tunnels and under bridges.) A 60 cm set (marsche kette) was what was normally used in combat. Lindemann said that once they had arrived in Afrika however all the Tiger were driven everywhere which was VERY rough on the track and running gear. I haven't heard any wierd war stories from Lindemann, I'll ask the next time I see him! Htmd asked about beer? Hmm well it's not something I'd thought to ask before but in telling the POW story about stealing the rifles I think he said the guard brought them back a case of Blatz (tastes as great as its name!) He said they thought it was frankly piss but they hadn't had ANY beer for a while so it was good enough! Oh yeah, his English is a LOT better than my German! Wolf 326 asked about field conversions and paint. I asked Lindemann about that one earlier while I was trying to track down his particular Tiger. Every freakin' Tiger was different, especially the early ones, it's been driving me nuts! He said, right off the freighter they were all different, they ran differently, transmissions and brakes worked differently, there were good ones and cursed ones. and as soon as the crews got their hands on them they started customising them. Most of the field changes had to do with stowage or correcting factory flaws and omissions. The most obvious external mods were usually to carry extra track, water and fuel. Lindemann described rigs to carry fuel drums strapped on the engine deck (tho I've never seen photos) and I have seen a huge variety of racks and frames made of welded angle iron for tools and spares. Like Lindemann said, "In the desert there is nothing that you don't bring there." Colours are a thread by themselves... According to Herr Lindemann, and I asked him quite pointedly a couple of times, All the early PzIII's and PzIVs, and all the softskins were delivered in the standard Panzer Grey (I don't have the RAL #s handy so I won't make a fool of myself and guess at 'em). The crews initially painted them with mud since that was all they had, but found that the dust that vehicles picked up worked pretty well too. By late '42, early '43, Panzers started arriving in Dunkle Gelb (Dark Yellow) painted by the factories. His Tiger which was manufactured in November of 1942 was painted a light Brown (RAL 7028 I think but don't quote me), and crews were authorized to spray them with panzer grey splotches (although I have only seen one Tiger painted that way and it was a model), in any event he said his Tiger was never camouflaged. After the battle of Kasserine Pass the Germans captured great stocks of supplies including paint. As the DAK was being pushed back to Tunisia which was a bit greener country, these paints were used to recolour and camouflage whatever vehicles were in the repair dumps and needed paint. Thus the occaissional olive drab Tiger... Lyceum6 asked about AT Guns, Lindemann doesn't really differentiate much between them, They were either "Those big bastards" or "the little Pop guns". I have to assume the "Big Bastards" were mostly 6 and 25lbers and the "Popguns" were 2lbers. He said Tigers didn't really have to worry about the popguns because they couldn't penetrate and they knew it, so they would not bother shooting the Tigers but concentrate on the smaller tanks where they had some chance of effect, he did say that they would try to break tracks if they could (sometimes it worked, more often it didn't). The bigger guns were dealt with by going out and scouting a defensive position the night before an attack. The artillery would lob in a few rounds and they would see if anyone shot back, defenses were marked on a map and anything that might be an ATG position was in for a severing pasting with HE when the unit moved up for the attack. As the attack progressed, artillery and air attacks would try to destroy guns or at least keep guncrews heads down until ground forces had advanced enough to take them out. That's the theory at least. The Germans were always critically short of ammunition (and everything else) in Africa and a lot of times they simply didn't have enough. Imsneaky, I asked him about the 3.7" AA guns and I had to explain to him what they were so I don't think he ever saw one shooting (or if he did, he didn't remember). The stuff I have read says that while the 3.7" AA gun WAS used against tanks (quite effectively I understand, the 21st Panzer book suggests it might even have been more effective than the 88), British command was a bit rigid on what things were to be used for. These things are AA guns, that's what they are for, that's the way we'll use them. I suspect that the times they were used were desparate attempts to defend themselves against attacking tanks. Blame High Command I guess TO BE CONTINUED |
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#4 |
Lucky Jack
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More coming either on Sunday or Monday. Depending in which shape the hangover gonna hit me tomorrow.
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#5 |
Sailor man
![]() Join Date: Apr 2005
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Great post........I printed it out and am reading now..........
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#6 |
The Old Man
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Maybe Dowly can use Major Lindemann as an example in the U-864 thread. He fought for Germany, and whaddayaknow, he's a decent fellow.
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![]() The entire German garrison of Vanviken, right here in your thread! ![]() |
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