Conflict between manual and game settings

hunter301 · 04-07-14, 12:57 AM

I was reading thru the SH4 manual cover to cover and under the game settings selections in the manual it shows two options that are not in the game itself.
"No noise meter" which would let you know if you are making to much noise while being hunted, and "No weapons officer assistance" which would be the in between of manual targeting and the game doing automatic targeting for you.
I would think both these would be indispensable as training tools. especially the noise meter would help you to know how you need to run to avoid detection.

BigWalleye · 04-07-14, 06:33 AM

Great ideas. Both exist in SH3. Neither was implemented in SH4. There is a command "Identify target" which is the only part of "Weapons officer assistance" that they included in SH4. But the SH4 crew can put themselves to bed!

hunter301 · 04-07-14, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigWalleye

Great ideas. Both exist in SH3. Neither was implemented in SH4.

Then why are they shown in the manual as being a game setting option?
Was it in the original game before it was upgraded to 1.5 w/ U-boat missions?

BigWalleye · 04-07-14, 09:15 AM

No, AFAIK it was never in SH4. I believe the manual refs are a hangover from SH3, which did have both capabilities. The manual was likely written by cutting and pasting the SH3 manual. If it's like a lot of software, the guys who wrote the manual may never have seen the finished program.

Snarf · 04-07-14, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigWalleye

But the SH4 crew can put themselves to bed!

"Hey cap'n! We've been at General Quarters for 48 hours now, we're gonna stop the boat and go to sleep"

Sniper297 · 04-08-14, 12:37 PM

That's nothing compared to SHIII, where you couldn't set up a watch bill and let them take turns sleeping and working without micromanagement. The main reason I uninstalled it was only half the game was about operating a U-boat, the other half was spent stopping time compression every 6 hours to pull rested crew out of berthing to replace tired crew, then tucking the tired crewmen into their berths and singing "Soft Kitty Warm Kitty" until they went to sleep and you could go back to running the sub. IIRC there was a mod for it which at least made the game playable.

Two files in SH4;

\Data\UPCData\GamePlaySettings.upc

\Data\Cfg\GameplaySettings.cfg

The UPC one has;

NoNoiseMeterRealismPercentage=2
NoWeaponOfficerAssistRealismPercentage=6

Along with the true and false for the different difficulty levels, the files are identical other than those two parameters. GamePlaySettings.upc is one of many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many files left over from SHIII which are not actually used in SHIV but they were too sloppy to remove them before packaging. If you could identify and delete all the old SH3 files that are not actually used and delete them you'd probably gain 1 gig of disk space.

BigWalleye · 04-08-14, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snarf

"Hey cap'n! We've been at General Quarters for 48 hours now, we're gonna stop the boat and go to sleep"

[RANT]If you're playing SH4 and you leave your crew at Battle Stations, that's your own dumb mistake. But if you're playing SH3 and just transiting to your patrol area, the crew will stay at their stations until they drop and the boat stops, even when there is a complete and fresh relief crew lounging in the berths. No, you have to tuck them in one at a time. Apparently, none of the officers and PO's knows how to implement a watch bill. I'd have thought the KM was better than that!

Yes, there is a "mod" that gets around the problem. You can use SH3 Commander, select "Use Fatigue Model" and then choose the "model" called "No Fatigue." In other words, eliminate the crew management module entirely. Then you can stay at General Quarters for THE ENTIRE CRUISE if you want to and the crew will be just as sharp when you return to port as the day you left. Ain't that just reelz?

Oh, and just to clarify: I really, really love SH3! My fave of the three. But the crew management is broken and I haven't seen anyone succeed in fixing it.[/RANT]

Sniper297 · 04-09-14, 01:59 AM

Amen. GQ is one of those things that goes with Artificial Ignorance, a real crew there would be SOMEONE (probably the XO) to say "Hey skip, we've been at GQ for 9 hours, no contacts anywhere, think it would be a good idea to secure now?" It IS realistic that they don't secure without permission, but unrealistic that nobody thinks to suggest it.

I generally wait to order GQ until I actually need torpedoes loaded fast so they don't get tired, but when testing GONE ASIATIC I order the flak guns manned without setting GQ since there's a lot of air attacks. After the first is over I set TC until the next contact, then find that the gun crews decided they needed a coffee break. How does a man get to be a Chief Gunners Mate in the United States Navy without knowing you ALWAYS follow the last order received until told to do otherwise, and never ever leave your station without permission?! Who told you guys you could secure?! I'll bust you down to swab jockey 3rd class IF you survive the keelhauling.

While submerged.

It's odd they won't secure from GQ without orders and will stay manned and ready until they drop from exhaustion, but the man your guns order doesn't follow the same routine, in fact they go AWOL after 20-30 minutes. Blasted lubbers.

04-07-14, 12:57 AM	#1
hunter301 Sonar Guy Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Central Florida, USA Posts: 377 Downloads: 38 Uploads: 0	Conflict between manual and game settings I was reading thru the SH4 manual cover to cover and under the game settings selections in the manual it shows two options that are not in the game itself. "No noise meter" which would let you know if you are making to much noise while being hunted, and "No weapons officer assistance" which would be the in between of manual targeting and the game doing automatic targeting for you. I would think both these would be indispensable as training tools. especially the noise meter would help you to know how you need to run to avoid detection. __________________ "Beware the beast Man, for he is the Devil's pawn. Alone among God's primates, he kills for sport or lust or greed. Yea, he will murder his brother to possess his brother's land."- The Lawgiver "You know what the chain of command is? It's the chain I get and beat you with till you understand who's in command." -ME

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04-07-14, 06:33 AM	#2
BigWalleye Sea Lord Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: On the Eye-lond, mon! Posts: 1,987 Downloads: 465 Uploads: 0	Great ideas. Both exist in SH3. Neither was implemented in SH4. There is a command "Identify target" which is the only part of "Weapons officer assistance" that they included in SH4. But the SH4 crew can put themselves to bed!

04-07-14, 09:15 AM	#4
BigWalleye Sea Lord Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: On the Eye-lond, mon! Posts: 1,987 Downloads: 465 Uploads: 0	No, AFAIK it was never in SH4. I believe the manual refs are a hangover from SH3, which did have both capabilities. The manual was likely written by cutting and pasting the SH3 manual. If it's like a lot of software, the guys who wrote the manual may never have seen the finished program.

04-08-14, 12:37 PM	#6
Sniper297 The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Philadelphia Shipyard Brig Posts: 1,386 Downloads: 160 Uploads: 19	That's nothing compared to SHIII, where you couldn't set up a watch bill and let them take turns sleeping and working without micromanagement. The main reason I uninstalled it was only half the game was about operating a U-boat, the other half was spent stopping time compression every 6 hours to pull rested crew out of berthing to replace tired crew, then tucking the tired crewmen into their berths and singing "Soft Kitty Warm Kitty" until they went to sleep and you could go back to running the sub. IIRC there was a mod for it which at least made the game playable. Two files in SH4; \Data\UPCData\GamePlaySettings.upc \Data\Cfg\GameplaySettings.cfg The UPC one has; NoNoiseMeterRealismPercentage=2 NoWeaponOfficerAssistRealismPercentage=6 Along with the true and false for the different difficulty levels, the files are identical other than those two parameters. GamePlaySettings.upc is one of many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many files left over from SHIII which are not actually used in SHIV but they were too sloppy to remove them before packaging. If you could identify and delete all the old SH3 files that are not actually used and delete them you'd probably gain 1 gig of disk space.

04-09-14, 01:59 AM	#8
Sniper297 The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Philadelphia Shipyard Brig Posts: 1,386 Downloads: 160 Uploads: 19	Amen. GQ is one of those things that goes with Artificial Ignorance, a real crew there would be SOMEONE (probably the XO) to say "Hey skip, we've been at GQ for 9 hours, no contacts anywhere, think it would be a good idea to secure now?" It IS realistic that they don't secure without permission, but unrealistic that nobody thinks to suggest it. I generally wait to order GQ until I actually need torpedoes loaded fast so they don't get tired, but when testing GONE ASIATIC I order the flak guns manned without setting GQ since there's a lot of air attacks. After the first is over I set TC until the next contact, then find that the gun crews decided they needed a coffee break. How does a man get to be a Chief Gunners Mate in the United States Navy without knowing you ALWAYS follow the last order received until told to do otherwise, and never ever leave your station without permission?! Who told you guys you could secure?! I'll bust you down to swab jockey 3rd class IF you survive the keelhauling. While submerged. It's odd they won't secure from GQ without orders and will stay manned and ready until they drop from exhaustion, but the man your guns order doesn't follow the same routine, in fact they go AWOL after 20-30 minutes. Blasted lubbers.