These guys are getting ready to go to war!

[geetrue]

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/126842

Originally Posted by Israel inn.com

Arab reports indicate that Hizbullah is preparing to arm its rockets with chemical warheads and to build extensive fortifications. Defense Minister Ehud Barak blames the Syrians, while Prime Minister Ehud Olmert asks the United Nations to do something.

I’m not saying there is going to be a war, but if there was a war they’re getting ready.

Where’s Avon lady when you need her?

[Letum]

Interesting graphic halfway down that report.

An an interesting link with it to. Speaks for its self:

Our land is not Arab land

Four decades ago, “Entrance forbidden to dogs and Arabs” was a common sight in Germany. Xenophobia was sublimated from Jews onto Arabs. Every nation has a right to live as it wishes, including the right to live without strangers. Had the Germans evicted Jews in 1939 to Switzerland or even to Palestine, that won’t be a crime comparable to Holocaust. Even the impractical UN law differentiates between genocide and ethnic cleansing, the last being a much lesser crime of forcible resettlement. Xenophobia is a powerful evolutionary feature which stabilizes societies. Racism is often rooted in the very real considerations: Jews have a good reason to resist Arabs in Israel, the people whose malicious intent was demonstrated on myriad occasions.
Racism is insulting. No one likes being despised. The objects of racism can question whether the core population has more rights than they have. But our lives are full of minute insults and injustices. Some are born rich, other – poor; some – smart, other – silly; some – beautiful, other – ugly. The world doesn’t offer absolute justice, but rather statistical: a person deficient in some respects sometimes excel in other respects; sort of the blonde correlation between nice look and nice brains. The same statistical approach applies to racism. Should the entire world turn on the Arabs, as it turns on Jews, that would be absolutely unjust and worth fighting against. But here we’re talking of a country which took 0.01% of Islamic lands exercising anti-Arab racism. What if one in a ten thousand clubs in Germany exclude Arabs? That’s surely not a meaningful offense. There are clubs for women, not for men; for 30-year-plus, not for teens. Such establishments are technically illegally exclusivist (sexist, for example), but only substantial crimes are punished. In practical terms, women clubs do not substantially violate male rights because males can enjoy other clubs. The similar logic applies to Israeli Arabs. Islam bans Jews from the entire Saudi Arabia and practically excluded Jews from most Arab countries. Almost the entire Middle East is a Muslim-only club.
Jews are entitled to the club of our own.

Really building some bridges there, huh.




*edit* Yeesh, it even goes on with some good old 1930s social Darwinism. Link
Talk about irony!

Thats a hell of a link Geetrue

[geetrue]

My first thoughts on this article about Olmert asking for UN help is that his job is on the line from the cash pay off's to sexual abuse reports still being investigated.

They already know he is gulity of taking bribes ... they just don't know what to do about it.

Now he comes over to see President Bush last month and after he returns home he says that Israel has a yellow light to go after Iran. Now he's asking the UN for help.

Polictically he is saying don't worry about what I have done wrong, worry about our neighbors that want to wipe us off the map.

But reports of putting chemical warheads on their missiles did cause me some concern due Israel intelligence being one of the best in the world.

Basically they're saying; "you bomb our nuclear plants making weapons grade material and you will pay dearly for it".

[Skybird]

"Four decades ago, “Entrance forbidden to dogs and Arabs” was a common sight in Germany."

Ach, was it...?

Arab reports indicate that Hizbullah is preparing (...) to build extensive fortifications.

That'S no news - they started with that days after the end of the war 2006. theyx also started to ream with even more and more modern ATGMs just days after the war 2006 ended. They moved north of the Litani to force the Israelis to reach further out and expose their vulnerabilites that way - and then turning Lebanon into an killing ground that should serve as a grave for the IDF.

Say about these bastards what you want, but they are neither stupid, nor do they have any scruples. They prepare hard to maximize losses amongst Lebanese population, delivering Israel another PR blow that way.

Iran/Hezbollah also buys soil in Lebanon, and massively, since two years. Their supply in money is frightening. Civilian structures again will become Hezbollah'S preferred sites for ammu storage, communication and control. Clever tactic - just very brutal to the civilians.

[geetrue]

If the Israel's enemies are so smart ... how did they lose the 6 day war?

Yahweh God intercedes for Israel on a regular schedule ... He takes Sunday off.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by geetrue

If the Israel's enemies are so smart ... how did they lose the 6 day war?

That is over a generation ago...!

Thirty years ago, electronic calculators were rare. the TI-30 that my grandfather ordered - cost 700 D-Marks! And today? Every teenager can afford to have his own gloal communication gadget, a mobile tricorder and a computer with incredible calculation capacity that 30 years ago would have costed hundreds of thousands - and even then it was not available for many institutions.

So it is with modern weapons as welol, and communication tools, especially ATGMs and shopulder-launched SAMs. These factors even can counter the modenr tanks and air force of Israel, in combination with guerilla tactics.

And have you ever realised HOW CLOSE that war was, and how threatening high Israeli losses and how low their supplies in the end were...? They won, but do not dare to think it did not cost them.

The wars of '67 and '73 mean nothing today anymore. Even tactics have chnaged, due to Israel'S enemy no longer being a regular army, but a terror-guerilla.

And the UNIFIL mission in Lebanon - don'T make me laugh. It just illustrated the UN's adamant determination to fail again. OF COURSE they did not stop weapon supplies reaching Hezbollah - what have people thought it else would do? Stopping them and fight Hezbollah...? Did they really think they would smuggle weapons via sea lanes now because a nice parade of Western frigates and patrol boats ships up and down the Lebanese coast now? The UNIFIL was naive, like so many missions of the UN. The UN should be forbidden to raise mandates for sending troops and forces. It simply is too incompetent with this matter.

[peterloo]

I don't think either Israel or Iran wants to start wars...

If Israel starts war, maybe she can advance rapidly, but don't forget the Iran knows how to fight guerrilla asymmetrical warfare. Furthermore, Iran does process some nice weapons, like RPG-29, or copy of TOW missile, or the best torpedo in the world, and these stuff can definitely deal a heavy punishment to Israel despite her aerial advantage.

Don't forget the ballistic missiles as well~

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by peterloo

I don't think either Israel or Iran wants to start wars...

If Israel starts war, maybe she can advance rapidly, but don't forget the Iran knows how to fight guerrilla asymmetrical warfare. Furthermore, Iran does process some nice weapons, like RPG-29, or copy of TOW missile, or the best torpedo in the world, and these stuff can definitely deal a heavy punishment to Israel despite her aerial advantage.

Don't forget the ballistic missiles as well~

Huh?? the "Best torpedo in the world"?

You mean that VA-111 Shkval knockoff the Hout? Or that new conventional one the YM somsuch?

The Hout is a joke even midrange 533 mm torpedoes out range it, not to mention range heavyweight 533mm weapons like the MK 48 ADCAP, Spearfish and UGST which have something like four times the range.

Besides the US Navy's VLA ASROCs have greater range and speed than the Hout.

If the Hout is being used by a PTG then Harpoons can deal with the platform from beyond its range, if its from a sub than MK 48s and ASROCs can deal with the platfrom from beyond its range.

[geetrue]

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike

Huh?? the "Best torpedo in the world"?

If the Hout is being used by a PTG then Harpoons can deal with the platform from beyond its range, if its from a sub than MK 48s and ASROCs can deal with the platfrom from beyond its range.

Reminds me of a sea story ... this one is true, (don't give me that look)

I was just a young 19 year old sonarman on the USS Salmon SS-573 diesel boat back in the spring of 64 ... yes 44 years ago. We were testing the first subroc to be fired from a submerged platform, in this case it was the USS Permit SSN-594 stationed off San Clemente Island which is just off the coast of Southern California.

We were about fifty miles down range when the captain came on the 1mc and said, "Attention all hands the Navy is testing a new weapon called SUBROC ... it's suppose to come out of the Permit like a torpedo and come up to the surface and back down fifty miles later and then be a torpedo again".

The captain then snorts and says, "If anyone hears anything let me know"

Evidently the captain started his speech about the same time they fired it and no sooner did these words come out of his mouth that we were then rocked by a large "bam".

That sucker hit us broadside and after we came back in we had to go to drydock, because it put a four inch dent in the saddle tanks.

This ain't no lie ... I was there.

geetrue

[peterloo]

Don't forget that Iran got several Kilos

If they use Hout, they won't use Kilo to fire it, through. They will definitely use one of their disposable midget submarine. You are right --- Sharvl or Hout is just a last ditch weapon if used in Kilo, as what is shown in Dangerous Waters.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Current...els#Submarines

They have got many midget subs here! Beware!

[baggygreen]

Peterloo,

I invite you to go to this website http://maps.google.com/ and type in "Bandar Abbas, Iran". On the western edge of the city is the naval base there, with probably half their fleet if not more.

1 airstrike and not a single vessel will be serviceable. It would take several hours for the fleet to be mobilised and start sailing, which would likely be hours too late in the event of an outbreak in hostilities. Unless they have advance warning, ie they decide to do something silly and sortie the fleet in advance...

[Monica Lewinsky]

Originally Posted by geetrue

Where’s Avon lady when you need her?

right here: