US says it has right to kidnap British citizens

[Skybird]

I like that posting, Mush Martin.

[Jimbuna]

Well put Maerin

[Tchocky]

Originally Posted by Mush Martin

so I ask are we really different men here in the future.
and inspite of the real cultural and national differences
are we different than they or any in this respect.

Some stay dry and others feel the pain.

(dum dum, dum dum dum, dum dum dum dum dum)

[August]

Originally Posted by Skybird

American demand to be the judge of all world and being free to overrule any other nation's law and sovereignity at will

This is a lie Skybird. I thought you were above posting deliberate falsehoods. Guess I was wrong.

[Skybird]

In a way, you are the liar, August, because you deliberately ignore the context of my posting and by that twist it'S meaning, although I am absolutely sure that you are knowing that the whole post where you ripped it from has been adressing the issue of this thread: the inherent claim by america that it has the right to overrule the sovereignity and laws of foreign nations, ullustrated in the story that the thread starter told at the start.

Is it so difficult for you to discuss something without trying again and again some rethoric tricks on people not agreeing with you, to give them a bad name where your argument is not sufficient to counter theirs? I'm getting tired of it, really. It is foul style. Lacking sportsmanhsip, if you want. Unfairness. However you call it.

You could try this until next year, but still you will not prevent me from countering your self-centered claims concerning the moral validity of america's self-perceptiin when behaving like being discussed in this thread. All you illustrate to people by that is that you arguments are not sufficient, so that you need to use rethoric cheats and tricks. there are people claiming rethoric to be a high art, and they even train it, but to me it is just an attempt to manipulate people, and deceive over lacking argument. It does not impress me at all. You either have an argument where I can see the point in it, or you have not - that is all.

[August]

Originally Posted by Skybird

In a way, you are the liar, August, because you deliberately ignore the context of my posting and by that twist it'S meaning, although I am absolutely sure that you are knowing that the whole post where you ripped it from has been adressing the issue of this thread: the inherent claim by america that it has the right to overrule the sovereignity and laws of foreign nations, ullustrated in the story that the thread starter told at the start.

Is it so difficult for you to discuss something without trying again and again some rethoric tricks on people not agreeing with you, to give them a bad name where your argument is not sufficient to counter theirs? I'm getting tired of it, really. It is foul style. Lacking sportsmanhsip, if you want. Unfairness. However you call it.

You could try this until next year, but still you will not prevent me from countering your self-centered claims concerning the moral validity of america's self-perceptiin when behaving like being discussed in this thread. All you illustrate to people by that is that you arguments are not sufficient, so that you need to use rethoric cheats and tricks. there are people claiming rethoric to be a high art, and they even train it, but to me it is just an attempt to manipulate people, and deceive over lacking argument. It does not impress me at all. You either have an argument where I can see the point in it, or you have not - that is all.

Oh that's complete bull Skybird. Your penchant for insulting my country, it's government and it's people is well known on these boards and judging by the many PMs I get about you a lot of people are also getting fed up with it.

"American demand to be the judge of all world and being free to overrule any other nation's law and sovereignity at will"

Now either prove what you said or admit you are deliberately making false accusations in order to bolster your arguments.

[Skybird]

I'm tired of your distortions and false accusations about me, and your total inability to stay focussed on the original content of this thread or the contexts of my postings), and the example in the starting story. I suggest you exchange some more PMs with your friends.

You strongly give the impression of being unable to bear any criticism of your country at all, and labelling that as anti-americanism completely, always. and by that you are the living clue why worldwide so many people have such a critical view our your nation'S self-perception. you think yo are the knights of the holy grail. But you aren't. You are just one nation amongst many others, with light and shadow, like many others.

that you probabaly do not reflect on with your friends in your PMs. more likely that you all spend time clapping each other's shoulders.

By
- ignoring the sovereignity of other nations, and their laws,
- and by ignoring the treaties of extradition which the US has signed with the EU, and other nations, and agreed upon,
- by claiming instead the right to secretely kidnapp suspects from foreign countries, friendlies, neutrals and hostile alike,

the United states demand to be the judge of all world and being free to overrule any other nation's law and sovereignity at will indeed. Get this into your brain, August, it is not too difficult to understand the linking, as long as one has not replaced brain with dogmatism. It is a disgrace for your nation's historic ethical claims, and it is the truth of what was to be discussed here. Close your eyes, and keep on imagining that America is not what it is today, and does not do what it does, and means it always different, and is only light, no shadow. But the reality will stay unaltered by your imgination. In other words: make your choice between fantasy, and realism. But you already have, and in favour of the first.

Our little tete-a-tete ends exactly here.

Originally Posted by Skybird

I'm tired of your distortions and false accusations about me, and your total inability to stay focussed on the original content of this thread or the contexts of my postings), and the example in the starting story. I suggest you exchange some more PMs with your friends.

You strongly give the impression of being unable to bear any criticism of your country at all, and labelling that as anti-americanism completely, always. and by that you are the living clue why worldwide so many people have such a critical view our your nation'S self-perception. you think yo are the knights of the holy grail. But you aren't. You are just one nation amongst many others, with light and shadow, like many others.

that you probabaly do not reflect on with your friends in your PMs. more likely that you all spend time clapping each other's shoulders.

By
- ignoring the sovereignity of other nations, and their laws,
- and by ignoring the treaties of extradition which the US has signed with the EU, and other nations, and agreed upon,
- by claiming instead the right to secretely kidnapp suspects from foreign countries, friendlies, neutrals and hostile alike,

the United states demand to be the judge of all world and being free to overrule any other nation's law and sovereignity at will indeed. Get this into your brain, August, it is not too difficult to understand the linking, as long as one has not replaced brain with dogmatism. It is a disgrace for your nation's historic ethical claims, and it is the truth of what was to be discussed here. Close your eyes, and keep on imagining that America is not what it is today, and does not do what it does, and means it always different, and is only light, no shadow. But the reality will stay unaltered by your imgination. In other words: make your choice between fantasy, and realism. But you already have, and in favour of the first.

Our little tete-a-tete ends exactly here.

For a moment I thought Skybird was addressing me. It sure sounded familiar.

[August]

Originally Posted by Skybird

the United states demand to be the judge of all world and being free to overrule any other nation's law and sovereignity at will indeed.

You can repeat it over and over but it is still a lie Skybird. Never has my country demanded to be the "judge of all the world" and as the op link very clearly shows still observes extradition law, so we can hardly be demanding the freedom "to overrule any nations law and sovereignity at will".

[Skybird]

Quote in context, cheater.

[Konovalov]

Why don't you guys just darned well grow up and all walk away from this seemingly futile and stupid debate that it has become. As is almost always the case neither side is willing to give an inch. Just walk away because it is starting to look really silly with all the name calling of liar, cheat, anti-american bla bla bla.

[STEED]

Originally Posted by Konovalov

Why don't you guys just darned well grow up and all walk away from this seemingly futile and stupid debate that it has become. As is almost always the case neither side is willing to give an inch. Just walk away because it is starting to look really silly with all the name calling of liar, cheat, anti-american bla bla bla.

I have to say that is good advice.

Nothing wrong in walking away.

[Skybird]

Can't argue with you guys, it's best advise.

[StdDev]

Originally Posted by STEED

I have to say that is good advice.

Nothing wrong in walking away.

Waitaminit.....
I was gunna remark on Konovalov's directive to maintain peace...
Another example of the UK imposing its will on the sovereignty of flame war participants....
Who do you think you are Konovalov?... the US?

[Konovalov]

Originally Posted by StdDev

Waitaminit.....
I was gunna remark on Konovalov's directive to maintain peace...
Another example of the UK imposing its will on the sovereignty of flame war participants....
Who do you think you are Konovalov?... the US?

:rotfl: :rotfl:

Actually I'm a Australian citizen living in the UK but that was darned funny.