Putin's mad and I'm glad

[CCIP]

Originally Posted by loynokid

All Putin is doing is sucking up to the liberal world media, does no one have the common sense to see that... it is pretty plain and simple

I think everyone has the common sense to see that Putin has nothing to gain from the world liberal media, especially since he's no liberal to begin with. Please stop with the conservative drivel already, it's getting annoying.

[Fish]

Originally Posted by loynokid

All Putin is doing is sucking up to the liberal world media, does no one have the common sense to see that... it is pretty plain and simple

You use the word liberal as a curse isn't it?

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by CCIP

I think everyone has the common sense to see that Putin has nothing to gain from the world liberal media, especially since he's no liberal to begin with. Please stop with the conservative drivel already, it's getting annoying.

To add further, whatever one may say about Putin, and many things can be said, he plays by his own rules. Accordingly, sucking up is not in his playbook. If he does not like what the media says, he simply closes them down or kicks them out.

[loynokid]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

To add further, whatever one may say about Putin, and many things can be said, he plays by his own rules. Accordingly, sucking up is not in his playbook. If he does not like what the media says, he simply closes them down or kicks them out.

Its seemes that i am proved wrong again. Now if you wouldn't mind please tell me why he is saying this stuff.

[Kapitan]

There are very few people who dislike putin since he came to power russia's GBP as quadrupled and is set to double again by 2009, under the last idiot the navy went to pot and so did most of the armed forces, putin re constructed and still is today.

unemployment has gone down a fair bit too it could be better but theres plenty of work yet to be done, ok its not a free state there are draw backs but it works.

Remember freedom comes at diffrent levels and it doesnt all work the same way for everyone.

[CCIP]

Originally Posted by loynokid

Its seemes that i am proved wrong again. Now if you wouldn't mind please tell me why he is saying this stuff.

We've said plenty of times.

1) Raising his government's profile at home, leading up to the elections in 2008 when his likely successor, Ivanov, will capitalize on pursuing a tough and confident line of foreign policy that shows Russia as not afraid to speak to its interests and criticize others (very different from 90's Russia).

2) Likewise flexing his foreign policy muscle abroad. I consider this to be a 'subtle' hint to the Western leaders that Russia is no longer worried about sounding harsh. For the past while it has been traditional for the West to criticize Russia's exertion of power on and around her immediate interests - and now Putin says "look, we can do this too!"

3) As per the 'liberal media' theory - again, Putin could care less. In fact he knows that the conservative media will be far more in an uproar over this than any liberals, and it is perhaps much-better suited to them, though again - this isn't the purpose. Putin would be catering to western media if he wanted to step softly or bluff; meanwhile I think he's at a point where he's neither bluffing nor stepping softly.

By the way, I still blame the west, in large part the conservative west that has perceived Russia as an enemy/potential enemy, for turning their back on Russia at a crucial moment and not supporting true liberal (in the economic, not neccesarily social, sense) democratic elements and values in the country when it had the chance. Instead they rejoiced at the downfall of the old enemy, and now they're getting the response they deserve - "Don't mess with us, we know what we're doing, and we know what you're doing (and don't like it)".

[Kapitan]

I think russia would do alot better if it was semi communist semi capitalist basicaly roughly what it is now kind of.

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by CCIP

We've said plenty of times.

1) Raising his government's profile at home, leading up to the elections in 2008 when his likely successor, Ivanov, will capitalize on pursuing a tough and confident line of foreign policy that shows Russia as not afraid to speak to its interests and criticize others (very different from 90's Russia).

2) Likewise flexing his foreign policy muscle abroad. I consider this to be a 'subtle' hint to the Western leaders that Russia is no longer worried about sounding harsh. For the past while it has been traditional for the West to criticize Russia's exertion of power on and around her immediate interests - and now Putin says "look, we can do this too!"

3) As per the 'liberal media' theory - again, Putin could care less. In fact he knows that the conservative media will be far more in an uproar over this than any liberals, and it is perhaps much-better suited to them, though again - this isn't the purpose. Putin would be catering to western media if he wanted to step softly or bluff; meanwhile I think he's at a point where he's neither bluffing nor stepping softly.

By the way, I still blame the west, in large part the conservative west that has perceived Russia as an enemy/potential enemy, for turning their back on Russia at a crucial moment and not supporting true liberal (in the economic, not neccesarily social, sense) democratic elements and values in the country when it had the chance. Instead they rejoiced at the downfall of the old enemy, and now they're getting the response they deserve - "Don't mess with us, we know what we're doing, and we know what you're doing (and don't like it)".

Grrr. CCIP, I direct you to the Forum FAQ's where it specifically states that no member is ever permitted to beat Tak to the punch in a response. Ever. Don't make me ban you.

Goofyness aside, this is correct: Putin has his own election cycle to deal with in '08. The Russian voter loves a strong man, and Putin has demonstrated domestic toughness in dealing with the press and with rival political factions. Now, he seeks to further demonstrate his foreign policy teeth by standing up to the US. He looks to reestablish a resurgent Russia on the world stage. Russia will not be a superpower, and Putin knows this. However, he is looking to give Russia a formal position on matters.

All of this plays very well with the voters back home.

[Kapitan]

I dont think putin can stand in the next election its limited to a set amount of terms i do believe theres been talk that he cant his predassessor put a limit on how many turns in office you can do.

Think im right il double check though.

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

I dont think putin can stand in the next election its limited to a set amount of terms i do believe theres been talk that he cant his predassessor put a limit on how many turns in office you can do.

Think im right il double check though.

No, he can't, but he has to have something to hand Ivanov. Best to get the ball rolling now and then have Ivanov tell the Russian people, 'I plan to give you more of this!' Nothing is better for a successor than a strong incumbent.

[loynokid]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

Grrr. CCIP, I direct you to the Forum FAQ's where it specifically states that no member is ever permitted to beat Tak to the punch in a response. Ever. Don't make me ban you.

Goofyness aside, this is correct: Putin has his own election cycle to deal with in '08. The Russian voter loves a strong man, and Putin has demonstrated domestic toughness in dealing with the press and with rival political factions. Now, he seeks to further demonstrate his foreign policy teeth by standing up to the US. He looks to reestablish a resurgent Russia on the world stage. Russia will not be a superpower, and Putin knows this. However, he is looking to give Russia a formal position on matters.

All of this plays very well with the voters back home.

Thanks guys, it seems as if you have brought up some new info that i hadnt thought of before. thanks again

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by loynokid

Thanks guys, it seems as if you have brought up some new info that i hadnt thought of before. thanks again

I hope that a lot of members sit up and take notice of this. Observe the lack of ad nauseum rhetoric. See that circular argument has not been persued. See that it is okay to actually admit learning something from your fellow members.

Loynokid, your stock has gone way up in my book. BZ to you. You are already a fine addition to this forum.

[Skybird]

A two-split way to look at things:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...467111,00.html

Winners: none.

Loosers: we all.

Maybe better to step back from trying to press it to the limits. 25x times a higher defense budget may buy more and better weapons. But does it buy wisdom as well?