Germany bans Cruise film shoot

Originally Posted by P_Funk

Parallels that Skybird already answered in post #8. The difference now though is that you are wording it in such a way as to infer he has similarities to Nazis in his beliefs.

I'm very wary of any comparisons to the Nazis. Its overdone. As John Stuart said once "Hey you know who's like Hitler? HITLER! Hitler worked really hard to be as bad as he was." I'm paraphrasing that sorta but you get the point. Its a bad idea to make those comparisons, and certainly in bad taste.

I'm glad to see you have gotten into the spirit of the light heartedness that this thread has become P-funk. Quoting John Stuart, the comedian, was in the spirit of the thread as it currently stands.

[P_Funk]

Originally Posted by waste gate

I'm glad to see you have gotten into the spirit of the light heartedness that this thread has become P-funk. Quoting John Stuart, the comedian, was in the spirit of the thread as it currently stands.

Oh boy. Must I say it again? Ad hominem. Jon Stewart may be a comedian but that doesn't dismiss his remarks. Tell me where what he said is not apt.

Originally Posted by P_Funk

Oh boy. Must I say it again? Ad hominem. Jon Stewart may be a comedian but that doesn't dismiss his remarks. Tell me where what he said is not apt.

Now you are loosing the spirit of Chocklam P-funk. Some one give him a Hersey bar.

[Reaves]

Originally Posted by waste gate

Now you are loosing the spirit of Chocklam P-funk. Some one give him a Hersey bar.

Hersey bars are considered Heresey in Chocklam. :rotfl:

Originally Posted by Reaves

Hersey bars are considered Heresey in Chocklam. :rotfl:

Could be, Reaves. I don't know. I have yet to be dipped in chocolate.
I am very much looking forward to that baptism. I guess its up to Chock as to how he promulgates Chocklam.

I think I have mentioned my German heritage in the past, and in the interest of transperancy I will show you the social network of one of my relatives.

http://www.namebase.org/cgi-bin/nb06...NSTEIN_LEOPOLD_

OK, now that you know I'd like some chocolate.

[SUBMAN1]

I can see why Germany doesn't want any Scientology people in their country after the Nazis. It is along the very same lines.

Let's see, Scientology brainwashes their followers with what they call reprogramming - basically hypnotism that is re-enforced due to sensory depravation over very long periods of time. Tom Cruise has been through this re-programming at there Cali camp.

Scientology's mission is to take over the entire world, by force if neccesary. Part of how they plan to do this is to take control of the media and celebrities so that they can drill Scientology into your brain because all the cool celebs follow it. Some others include John Travolta, and the Presley's. They make extra special effort to accomidate all celebs.

The FBI rates it as a possible terrorists organization and watches their every move closely.

So why exactly would Germany want this filth in their country? Good for Germany.

-S

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Second time you jump to the defence of a very dangerous totalitarian psycho-sect that has brought misery to thousands of people and only is about money, political power and economical influence, WG. They are rated as top-threats on the lists of counter-sect projects in European countries. I must wonder if you simply do not know what you are talking about - or if you are a scientologist yourself.

Religion has nothing to do with it. The scientology sect is no religion, not even close to it. It is a sect that abuses people, leads them into heavy psychic dependance, brainwashes and psychologically manipulates them, drives them towards complete self-denial and submission, psychic breakdown, financial exploitation, even suicide. It threatens and vows to hurt, injure and kill members if they leave the sect. It haunts criti9cs and apostates with psycho-terror and diffamation, for months and years. It acts by lies, defamation campaigns, mudthrowing, intimidation, deception and persuasion, and a constant bom,bardement of sues and court files. Preferred target group for harvesting are the young and the rich and influential ones, social leaders and representatives - key figures of social life, preferrably with either political power, or money. Scientology was rejected in several European countires to be accepted as a religion by highest national courts. Intelligence communities warn of them as one of the major threads to constitutional orders of social communities and nations in europe. they are under tight monitoring by intel services in several nations. In Germany, several federal countries also monitor them, and Berlin is about restarting observation again, too, since they said they want to turn the new Berlin centre, close to the governmental quarters, into one of the globally rare elite units of theirs. Some voices, mainly from the intel community, even want to simply prohibit scientology in germany - we even did not prohibit Nazi parties. Says something on the threat level they are rated at.

One either does not know a clue about scientology to defend them, or one is a member. tjhe first can be helped by starting to get informed. The second is either being a victim, or acting criminally and in an attempt to overthrow the constitutional state.

The family of Stauffenberg does not wish to see the Graf being represented by a scientologist, and does not wish their family member, which is a german icon, being abused for a PR stunt by scientology, and the defense ministry also does not want to see a key idol of German military history being linked to scientology. so, permission to shoot the film in the historical Bendlerblock has been rejected. That is all - not more, not less.

It is not about religion. If totalitarian traditions have anything to do with it - than in form of scientology itself.

German authorities have information about the sect wanting to intensify the infiltration of public offices, schools, and economy:

http://www.focus.de/politik/deutschl...aid_64326.html

The battle for Germany is considered by scientology sect to be a very important one, because germany, on the basis of it's totalitarian history, so far has been "a great opressor" to them, and strictly opposes them for very good and fundamental reasons, and more actively than many others. to breach that resistance would be a great propaganda stunt for them. the past months have seen several attempts to infiltrate and manipulate public schools and teachers, and attenpts of getting scientology thinking implemented into school books. they now said that in the future they will delete all reference to scientology from their materials by which they could be identified, so that they are not so easily to be exposed. they also want to turn the new Berlin centre, placed close to the government district, into one of their rare elite units.

If one is acting like that, one can hardly claim to be a religion.

There is a reason why I throw neonazis, islam and scientology all into the same pot. They all are offsprings of the same mind that is named TOTALITARIANISM. And that is something I am definitely allergic to.

Note that I am very critical of Stauffenberg myself.

Skybird hit the nail on the head here. 100% I agree. Not a normal thing for me to agree with you Skybird, but can't deny your dislike for this cult, and I also dislike this cult.

-S

Wasn't Christianity considered a cult by both the Jews and the Romans?

How about the followers of Martin Luther?

[August]

Woah, people are jumping on the intolerance bandwagon pretty quickly here.

Is this cult making the movie, or is (was) Cruise just going to be acting in it? That is the key question here imo. If it's the latter then what Germany is saying is that no one associated with an unpopular "religion" has a right to make a living on their soil. It's their business i guess, being their country, but i'll be expecting them to apply that standard to every Scientology member within their borders from big shot actors on down to a lowly convenience store clerk. Equal treatment under the law is the foundation of a representative government.

The only valid argument here imo is that the family doesn't want it and that's more an emotional opinion than a realistic one, because while I believe families should have some say in how historical events concerning their ancestors are portrayed, denying the freedom of expression based on who a person is, rather than what he has done or what he is saying (the old yelling fire in a theater analogy), is plain wrong.

[Reaves]

Originally Posted by August

Woah, people are jumping on the intolerance bandwagon pretty quickly here.

Is this cult making the movie, or is (was) Cruise just going to be acting in it? That is the key question here imo. If it's the latter then what Germany is saying is that no one associated with an unpopular "religion" has a right to make a living on their soil. It's their business i guess, being their country, but i'll be expecting them to apply that standard to every Scientology member within their borders from big shot actors on down to a lowly convenience store clerk. Equal treatment under the law is the foundation of a representative government.

The only valid argument here imo is that the family doesn't want it and that's more an emotional opinion than a realistic one, because while I believe families should have some say in how historical events concerning their ancestors are portrayed, denying the freedom of expression based on who a person is, rather than what he has done or what he is saying (the old yelling fire in a theater analogy), is plain wrong.

As much as I dislike scientologists, purely due to the fact I think they are daft, you are 100% correct.

[P_Funk]

Originally Posted by waste gate

Wasn't Christianity considered a cult by both the Jews and the Romans?

How about the followers of Martin Luther?

That might be a correlative truth but it doesn't really change anything. Just because other religions have been called cults before doesn't mean that they're all automatically not. The polygamists in the US and Canada are called a cult too, so are you going to rush to their defense?

[The Avon Lady]

It should be the right of any government to rule that a religion is a danger to its citizens or an outright business fraud scam.

Obviously, this is a very slippery slope and has to be decided by a reliable government body ( oxymoron alert! ).

[joea]

I find it ironic that so many are jumping to the defence of a cult that has very few characteristics of other "religions" but say nothing when the subject is Islam. :hmm:

Skybird is nothing if not coherent most of the time.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by waste gate

The essay is accusing the Jews of what you accuse Scientology of being. Insert Scientology where you see Jew and where you see 'the German Reich' insert 'German authorities' and there you have it.

PS
Like I stated its your country. But which religion will the German authorities be going after next?

EDIT: Just so I have it right, you don't like the Poles, you don't like the Scientologists; my question is when in the anschluss? Like I stated unhealthy.

You are a provocating troll, and provocation is all you are after. Your statements above have zero meaning concerning the reality, as I said. This is not the 30s, I am not goebbels, and scientology is not the persecuted Jews. If scientology would get heavy influence in german politics - then Germany would turn out to become that nasty place that you accuse it to already be right now.

scientology is a aggressively acting sect, it is totalitarian, and it hurts people and exploits them. It is no religion, never was a religion, never will be a religion.

But today it has become common habit that every buffoon can show up and tell people that his thoughts and deeds, no matter how hurting to others, how damaging to a state, how stupid and illogical and unreasonable they may be, were just his innocent, precious "religion" - and he will promptly be considered to be untouchable, because "Pssssst! He is about religion, you know... " Every crap and every criminal intention gets excused by that. To ask if the thing in question really is a religion, a cultural tradition, or soemthing like that, and if it really is worth to be tolerated, and really is not damaging to our own societies, and the wellbeing of the citizens in our nations, already is successfully prevented by doing that way. - But I don't buy that.

Hubbard once said something like this: if you want to make really big money, don't just write funny books - found a religion. - So much for the authenticity of the "religion" thing with scientology.