Atlantic Warfare is born

[Gotmilk]

Hello Hans.

First i would like to congratiulate you on this HUGE crazy project that you and your team have taken on. I wish you all the best and hope that your Kickstarter will be a major success.

Secondly i would strongly suggest you to stick with Unity (but i think that you guys have reached that conclusion yourself already). Ogre is nice, open and all but your programmers will have to do 1000% more work to create features that Unity has already built. Also Unity improves faster and their support has never failed me. Unity is going to be around in 10 years.

Now that all out of the way i want to apologize because i am going to be very negative here. When i discovered this thread today i was happy and started to read entire 11 pages of it. The further i got the less happy i was. I quickly recognized that this is one of these overly ambituous projects that will probably never see the light of the day. Sorry for saying that, i am not trolling or trying to demotivate you and your team.
The guys who usually make a lot of money on kickstarter with niche games are usually known industry veterans (but even 40% of them are still failing) and they already have some gameplay footage to show before going onto kickstarter.
Do you guys have any gameplay to show? Just showing off fancy 3d models wont do. Something that makes thousands of people to believe that you are capable to fill your promises and make a game that they want.

What amazed me the most was how unrealistic all the discussion here was until Xaron and Sung came here and raised some valid points. Sadly the answers were not so good because it is easy to talk how you "theoretically" implement this or that until you reach into real development cycle and realize how wrong you are.
These features you talk are unrealistic and cannot be done with a small team. And maybe its just me but i did not see them attacking you. They are just stating the truth that these features are unrealistic. If game designer is already talking about these kind of features (even if there is no game yet) then there is a high change that he actually dont know about game development that much.

Do yourself a favour and before you start to make such a big game try to make a simple arcade subsim game where you just shoot boxes trough periscope. No fancy AI,3D or simulation. This way you can see if you and your team have enough organization and skills to actually finish something.

And i would take very seriously what Xaron and Sung are talking. You know why? Because they were actually able to finish something. I did not know who they were unitl someone here dissed their own game. Then i discovered that they were the guys who develop Silent Depth. A game that i play on my android almost every day. EDIT4: <--- FAIL. I confused the game for Silent Subarine
This was the point were i got really angry. Here it is a situation where bunch of guys who have made nothing are gearing up for the next big project and when someone who has actually released several games before are giving their critical, constructive, and realistic feedback are getting their game LOL-ed and they are being called trolls because on for some reason you think that they wish you to fail.

One thing you need to understand is that game development is boring. You and your team may be super motivated at first and you may manage to make 80% of the game pretty quickly but then comes the other 80% when you realize that the last 20% turns into 80% of the boring work that you had not accounted for.
And then you are out of funding and motivation. You start to cut out features and your entire game vision suffers until it turns into something else. Something simple, a simple game with full of unfinished and buggy features. Then you realize that you have wasted 60% of the development time on those features because they do not work as itended. A mistake that could be easilly avoided if you had set and planned realistic expectations from the first day. Then one of two happens. The community will be very angry or they just dont care. You better hope that they would be angry because this means that your game would still have potential. Look at SH5. Big team did work for a year and turned out an unfinished buggy game. And they already had an engine codebase to work on.

I would wish, i would kiss, i would thank with all my heart if i had someone like Xaron or Sung who brought me down to earth 5 years ago when i started Unity and making my new crazy ideas. I have tons of finished projects that are crap and i will never show it to anyone. I have even more unfinished crap and i have some work that are finished that i am not particularly proud of.

To prove that i am a developer and not some anonymous "know it all"
<--- unfinished Oculus Rift multiplayer prototype.
<--- VRJam entry that is my spare time project with a solid plan to finish it.
<--- First revision of finished battle visualisation project. We are improving it constantly

So lastly i would like to say that in no way i am trying to troll or demotivate you. I would not waste 30 minutes of my time to write this lengthy post if i would not care. I wish nothing more than you to prove me wrong and make one kick-ass perfect game. The thing is that i have seen this one too many times. I have been on that road myself. Granted its a good learning experience but seeing as other members here (who do not know about game development) may take your words a little bit too seriously and areleady certain that they are going to see next great game coming from you in the next few years.

BTW: If i like what i see in your Kickstarter then i am certainly going to support this project.

All the best of luck for you and your team.

EDIT: Oh and please could you answer Xaron questions? These are all valid issuses that needs to be adressed if you want a coherent game.

EDIT2: I totally forgot to mention Vic20. A very talented developer who i respect with all my heart. He has been trying to make iPhone submarine simulator. He's inital plan was to release it 2011 but now in 2013 his game is "its ready when its ready" status.
My point? Even the talented smart developers are not sometimes able to forsee all the issues that they might have with game development and once these issues will arise you have to account for motivation and finance. I suggest you to contact him, he could be a perfect mentor and maybe he would help you to avoid some pitfalls. He's current wip looks wonderful


EDIT3: http://makegames.tumblr.com/post/113...nishing-a-game <--- a very good article about making and finishing a game

[raymond6751]

Hans

All that being said, I hope you won't lose heart. Give up on this community, but don't give up on your dream.

The only mistake that you made, I think, was mentioning kickstarter fund raising. It is too soon for that. People just think "money grab" and get upset.

Stick with your project!! Don't listen to the negative. There was a time when people were saying 'personal computers will never succeed' and also 'the Internet?'.

Every successful game started with some doubters. Every inventor faced ridicule. Even famous artists have their detractors. Keep going.

[Gotmilk]

Really? You put your title : yada yada and then keep feeding him "self help book" style of encouragement???

Originally Posted by raymond6751

but don't give up on your dream

-- thats right. Always keep your dreams in mind and work towards the goals. Just keep them realistic and go step by step.

Originally Posted by raymond6751

The only mistake that you made, I think, was mentioning kickstarter fund raising. It is too soon for that. People just think "money grab" and get upset.

- Nope. No one cares about that. We are discussing about the game and what can be realstically done. Heck even big games studios tend to over promise

Originally Posted by raymond6751

Don't listen to the negative.

-- always listen to the negative. I know its not what you want to hear but you have to see the other side of the coin. You can only ignore negative when its done with bad itentions. Someone wants to fail, talk rubbish to demotivate you. Sometimes it may be hard to tell them apart. Which one is constructive negative feedback and which one is not.

Originally Posted by raymond6751

There was a time when people were saying 'personal computers will never succeed' and also 'the Internet?'.

-- I dont see what this has to do anything with successful game development?

Originally Posted by raymond6751

Every successful game started with some doubters.

-- Not to mention that only 10% of the released indie games are usually the succesful ones. So in order for you to get a chance to be successful you have to release a game first which is a huge challenge itself.

Originally Posted by raymond6751

Even famous artists have their detractors

-- No artist has ever becaome famous buy saying "i will do this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, and this" and get "you go boy, thats the spirit" attitude from everyone. Usually they become famous after they release something spectacular. No matter how much the "self help book" may try to persuade you... we all cant be Einsteins or Picassos

[v-i-c-]

Originally Posted by Gotmilk

…
EDIT2: I totally forgot to mention Vic20. A very talented developer who i respect with all my heart. He has been trying to make iPhone submarine simulator. He's inital plan was to release it 2011 but now in 2013 his game is "its ready when its ready" status.
My point? Even the talented smart developers are not sometimes able to forsee all the issues that they might have with game development and once these issues will arise you have to account for motivation and finance. I suggest you to contact him, he could be a perfect mentor and maybe he would help you to avoid some pitfalls. He's current wip looks wonderful

Thank you for the flowers

Actually Hans and I are in contact since 15 months…
You are right in many points, especially the Pareto principle (80-20 rule).

The feature list of their project is huge and I personally doubt they will add all those features in the initial release, maybe a lot of features will never see the light of the day - but it is possible to do this if you have time and money. I think naturally they will add and drop features and ideas during development.

Who knows how well a good prepared kickstarter campaign for this project might end? With a nice budget they could add more developers to their team - this would help fighting the time problem. From what I've seen they have made great game assets and I think their art department is capable to handle the amount of work. This is also a great plus for the kickstarter campaign. With all their art they could prepare some decent basic scene footage for the presentation.

This project is a challenge, but as any challenge you won't know how it ends unless you try to do it. This project stands and falls on the quality and quantity of the team. I am sure they will rethink features over time - this is just the beginning of ATWAR.

You've mentioned WOTA and its damned release date. It is in development since almost five years now - the first version of it will be released in april 2014. I can't count how often I've scrapped FINISHED elements of the game and each time it was the right decision because the new solution was much better.

In one point you absolutely can't compare WOTA to this project: I have to fight the comparable low performance and the limitations of mobile devices. This takes a lot of time. And while doing this the mobile devices evolve, offering new chances and new opportunities for features. ATWAR does not need to fight those issues - the performance of desktop computers is already capable to handle such a project.

My main problem are not development issues, my main problem is time. As a single developer there are way too many other things stealing my time. If ATWAR starts with a decent funding they will avoid a lot of problems.
I've tried to fund WOTA by creating WotP (a flight sim based on the blade element theory) - this was a terrible mistake because it turned out the potential of WotP was too good to waste it by doing it quickly - I've almost lost a full year. And the other titles I've released are just not selling good enough to fund WOTA.

They say the development of ATWAR is estimated to take 3 years, this is not a lot of time for development but it is a lot of time to learn things they just can't learn without trying them and to announce changes. And I think one thing is pretty clear: this has the potential to end as the start of the next generation of WW2 sub sims on the desktop - not because of their list of features - just because they are doing it and almost no one else is seriously working on the genre anymore (excuse me SHO…), the evolution of hardware and performance is their best friend.

[v-i-c-]

Originally Posted by Gotmilk

- Nope. No one cares about that. We are discussing about the game and what can be realstically done. Heck even big games studios tend to over promise

I think people should not discuss if a feature can be realistically be done - this is the job of the ATWAR team.

People should discuss if they WANT or don't want a feature and why, ask for features and mostly give feedback from a players point of view only.

Regarding development itself (except historically accurate 3D models), there are many other much more useful developer forums out there.

[Hans Witteman]

Hi shipmates,

Well many thing are going on in the back stage and many would be surprise about how good the news are for ATWAR so one thing is certain is that if i want to show you what we have done so far then i will have to work instead of arguing with people in this thread.

I am already overload with work and will be more available to go in detail upon website launch but all i can say is that many will be very surprise about our progress!

The team is currently working very hard and the moral is high.

On the positive side of thing i had the pleasure to take our first plane(B-24 Liberator) for a flight this morning and the flight physic handling is really realistic and i have play a lot of Il2 so i know what i am talking about here.
Kudos to Chris&John for this first but exciting test in game.

P.S. Very interesting people are currently following our progress very closely.

Regards the Atlantic Warfare team

[Gotmilk]

Congrats on the progress!

And thank you v-i-c for answering because you brought up some very good arguments.

Hans i dont know if you are aware of it but few weeks back someone released UnityFS into assetstore. https://www.assetstore.unity3d.com/#/content/11321
It it supposed to be currently the best flight simulator engine available on Unity and the developer of this project is also a real life pilot.
Take a loot at their webplayer demo. It is pretty neat.

Also do you have any plans to add oculus rift support for your game? It could attract much more attention from oculus community. They are starving for new games It may help you get more attention for your kickstarter campaign.
All you have to do is to drag and OR camera prefab into a scene. I have a rift and can help you create a demo video for your campaign if you wish.

[Hans Witteman]

Originally Posted by Gotmilk

Congrats on the progress!

And thank you v-i-c for answering because you brought up some very good arguments.

Hans i dont know if you are aware of it but few weeks back someone released UnityFS into assetstore. https://www.assetstore.unity3d.com/#/content/11321
Its it supposed to be currently the best flight simulator engine available on Unity and the developer of this project is also a real life pilot.
Take a loot at their webplayer demo. It is pretty neat.

Hi Milk,

Thank and that exactly what we are using at the moment, this is a time saver and would need custom tweaking for more advance features but it will save us a lot of work.

I was very surprise about the realistic flight behavior and my first try i was able to take off smoothly, i didn't test it extensively but i think stall was not model.

That what i like about Unity why reinventing the wheel when something is available at very reasonable price and with some extra programing magic it will be perfect for ATWAR.

Oh well now i have to setup cockpit instruments for both my Heinkel 111 and bf 109 and finish coding the shader i was working on for instruments.

By the way nice work you did on these videos really impressive!

Since you use Unity in production do you have any serious recommendation regarding if Unity is robust enough to handle our type of Sim?

My main fear is not having access to source code and i also know it doesn't work well for big team work + a couple annoyances i found out when i was working on my RPG.

I have ask many questions regarding this but since each type of game is very different then you never get the right answer for this.

Regards the Atlantic Warfare team

[Hans Witteman]

Originally Posted by v-i-c-

I think people should not discuss if a feature can be realistically be done - this is the job of the ATWAR team.

People should discuss if they WANT or don't want a feature and why, ask for features and mostly give feedback from a players point of view only.

Regarding development itself (except historically accurate 3D models), there are many other much more useful developer forums out there.

Hi Vic,

I couldn't have said it better myself since if we start arguing over and over i will spent more time answering here then working on ATWAR.

People will understand soon enough why all these features are possible and the reason why and how they will be integrated but for the moment we cannot talk about it until the website will be going live.

Regards Hans

[Sung]

Originally Posted by Hans Witteman

Since you use Unity in production do you have any serious recommendation regarding if Unity is robust enough to handle our type of Sim?

Hans of course.
But this question can be answerd by your Unity programmer.

Daniel Calin : Daniel have also work on the SH series and he is experience in both programing and senior 3d&2d GUI with
3 years of experience in Unity.

Think about the 80/20 rule.
Its easy to bring something on screen. But there will be no "makegame.exe"

Good luck

[Gotmilk]

Originally Posted by Hans Witteman

Since you use Unity in production do you have any serious recommendation regarding if Unity is robust enough to handle our type of Sim?

My main fear is not having access to source code and i also know it doesn't work well for big team work + a couple annoyances i found out when i was working on my RPG.

team

I had the exact same question when i started my battle visualisation project. I needed thousands of soldiers running around and people kept telling me that Unity cannot handle it. That only Total War engine is capable of this and this engine was built ground up for that purpose.
On the other hand i did not want to start to develop my own engine or borrow an open source solution because then i would be still developing the stuff that Unity already has (and i would probably never finish it) .
Unity has hundreds of developers who work hard every day to make this engine better.

So i decided to use unity and soon enough i found out that almost in every case there are tips, tricks and cheats that will enable to you to achieve the result you are after. I could have thousands of soldiers, i just had to write a smart code that switched some geometry, ai, pathseeking stuff to lower level when camera was further. And now with Unity4.3 beta they have optimized the skinned mesh renderer and i plugged it into my project and have 30 fps with 10k characters.

So yes i am 99% certain that Unity will be suitable for your project. There may be some stuff that are harder to do because you dont have low level access but there are almost always workarounds from this. As a simulation game you really have to simulate stuff that your player sees. The further the object is the less simulation cycles it needs. Also thanks to the popularity of the engine you already get access to modules like flight sim engine. You have already saved hundreds of manhours and thousands of dollars from that. The same applies for GUI system, AI systems,lighting, shaders, visual editors (if you want to use them). There are just too many already done good things for you to lose if you are not going to use unity. And most important is that you get things done.

If still in doubt then just look what v-i-c has achieved with Unity. Hes has a good looking game (which in my mind is not a game but a submarine simulator) that runs on iPhone. If he can achieve that with Unity then you can certainly achieve your vision on powerful computer. You can set the goals "Chris Roberts style" where you are developing your game for a 2 -3 year future gaming computer. And maybe v-i-c can license you his ocean system. It may be not so hardcore as triton but it looks good and has the right feel to it.

As for a team size i cant really say much because i have no experience. My team has a 3 people. 2 Artsist who dont use Unity and me who does code and other stuff. But i know that there are bigger studios 15 - 20 studios who are using Unity. They have their own team workflow pipeline created and by doing some research i am certain you guys manage to work something out.

I also suggest to check this out. This is a huge project and they are giving very good workflow tips on how to not go crazy


BTW: I dont know if you noticed but i edited my previous post asking about Oculus Rift support. Since your kickstarter will be for he niche market then i think that adding primitive oculus support may help you find more attention outside of the subsim community. I am very active in Oculus community and its full of passionate people who are starving for top quality games that can be played in virtual reality.

EDIT: Since you already have a lot of good quality models may i suggest skyshop plugin. https://www.assetstore.unity3d.com/#/content/8880 This one is the best lighting solution. You can easily plug it into your game. Even if you wont use it in final game you can still make near photorealistic turntables for ships and distribute these as interactive "thank you's" for your backers

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by Sung

Hans of course.
But this question can be answerd by your Unity programmer.

Daniel Calin : Daniel have also work on the SH series and he is experience in both programing and senior 3d&2d GUI with
3 years of experience in Unity.

Think about the 80/20 rule.
Its easy to bring something on screen. But there will be no "makegame.exe"

Good luck

I think he was asking you, do you have any recommendation?

[v-i-c-]

Originally Posted by Gotmilk

So yes i am 99% certain that Unity will be suitable for your project. There may be some stuff that are harder to do because you dont have low level access but there are almost always workarounds from this. As a simulation game you really have to simulate stuff that your player sees. The further the object is the less simulation cycles it needs. Also thanks to the popularity of the engine you already get access to modules like flight sim engine. You have already saved hundreds of manhours and thousands of dollars from that. The same applies for GUI system, AI systems,lighting, shaders, visual editors (if you want to use them). There are just too many already done good things for you to lose if you are not going to use unity. And most important is that you get things done.

Originally Posted by Hans Witteman

Since you use Unity in production do you have any serious recommendation regarding if Unity is robust enough to handle our type of Sim?

My main fear is not having access to source code and i also know it doesn't work well for big team work + a couple annoyances i found out when i was working on my RPG.

If you want you can have access to the source code of Unity - but this is expensive (price on application).
But I doubt you will ever need that. You can do almost everything by writing your own plug ins anyway.

As Gotmilk said you have easy access to a lot of solutions - but a lot of them will be useless for you. Most complex 3rd party assets I have seen don't have simulation (and simulating giant worlds/terrains) in mind. For example you can completely forget the Unity terrain for your purpose.
So everything you can expect are nice helper tools and time savers, but almost nothing that will really help you with the core of your simulation and game world. And those that are helpful often need code changes to really fit to your needs (so next update may break your changes)

I personally use Unity mostly as a kind of Organizer that extremely simplifies my work because it offers all the basic stuff and PhysX without too many restrictions. It's an absolutely professional and smart tool with a lot of nice extra features that even helps beginners to do something. But 99% of the day you will write your own code.

There are sometimes some traps with really basic stuff and performance that you would not expect. But that's something you just need to find out to avoid it.


I quote this for truth:

Originally Posted by Sung

Think about the 80/20 rule.
Its easy to bring something on screen. But there will be no "makegame.exe"

My conclusion: You can definitely use Unity for ATWAR. You will write your own engine around the basic Unity features anyway.

Originally Posted by Gotmilk

Hans i dont know if you are aware of it but few weeks back someone released UnityFS into assetstore. https://www.assetstore.unity3d.com/#/content/11321
It it supposed to be currently the best flight simulator engine available on Unity and the developer of this project is also a real life pilot.
Take a loot at their webplayer demo. It is pretty neat.

Originally Posted by Hans Witteman

Thank and that exactly what we are using at the moment, this is a time saver and would need custom tweaking for more advance features but it will save us a lot of work. I was very surprise about the realistic flight behavior and my first try i was able to take off smoothly, i didn't test it extensively but i think stall was not model.

Regarding UnityFS, this looks indeed like an impressive package if someone wants to quickly create a flight sim/game.

But as with many assets on the store it seems that the developer paid too much attention to (excuse me) unexperienced developers. Seriously something like cockpits, gauges and moving lifting devices is not what you should work on when making an asset for other developers - most developers would always want (or quickly realize that they want) to use their own solutions for that. At the end this might be a waste of time for both the asset developer and his customers.

I've talked a bit with the developer of UnityFS when he fist announced it some months ago - because I've announced my own UniFDM two years ago but did not want to release it before WotP is released - so I never prepared (made it ready for easy usage) UniFDM for the Store.
First it seemed his solution is almost identical to mine, at least this was the result of our talk, but something must be different and (I don't like to say that but it's my opinion) I absolutely don't like the feeling how it flies (when trying the web player). It feels too much like flying on rails. Ok, I am not a real life pilot, but I am addicted to flight sims and have about 12.000 hours of simulated flight. So I think I know at least what most fans of the genre would expect.

Certainly everything of the extra detailed physics I wanted to include in UniFDM is also missing in UnityFS. It also does not offer any simulation of damage. A problem that might result from the two different worlds of flight sim fans: combat and non combat. Even X-Plane does not support (combat) damage and it looks like Austin does not want to ever include it. In worst case you might wait a lot of time to see some important missing features (you've mentioned way it handles stall) in UnityFS because the developer could be biased in a way like Austin is: to civil (bus driver) flight and easy usage by adding another cockpit feature or something similar that you could implement on your own without getting into the core of the physics.

For me most impressive is his plane maker tool, and I did not work on a solution for that yet (I am building my planes with the X-Plane Editor and convert it into my own format).

This is maybe a bit of a hardcore example but again this is something I won't go for with a 3rd party tool. I would always prefer my own solutions if possible.

Here is a video showing UniFDM in action. Just ignore the bad prototype graphics, this was just for testing it.
The engine is (like in UnityFS) just a primitive controllable thrust without any simulated engine physics (which is something that in my opinion is an absolute must for such an asset). A primitive way to visualize the forces is shown at 1 minute 17 seconds



Maybe I will release it someday after WOTA is finished.

Originally Posted by Gotmilk

And maybe v-i-c can license you his ocean system. It may be not so hardcore as triton but it looks good and has the right feel to it.

My ocean is optimized for PowerVR SGX. It's the result of a lot (uncountable) of work and testing. And it requires the other parts of my game world to run.

It would be hard to set a price and it is one of the core elements of WOTA. So it's not for sale.

Also it does not make any sense on the desktop because you could do something MUCH better pretty quickly on desktop hardware.

Originally Posted by Gotmilk

EDIT: Since you already have a lot of good quality models may i suggest skyshop plugin. This one is the best lighting solution. You can easily plug it into your game.

Unfortunately Skyshop won't work with a game like ATWAR. It works great for game levels only but not for huge procedural terrains and real time sky simulation. It needs to calculate special prepared cube maps, and these calculations are not possible in real time at all within the next years.
But this is a good example for things that will need your own very special (and tricky) reduced solution for sims like ATWAR… if you want to do something like that.

Originally Posted by Hans Witteman

Hi Vic,

I couldn't have said it better myself since if we start arguing over and over i will spent more time answering here then working on ATWAR.

Well, I should better remember my own words and stop the developer babble.

[Hans Witteman]

Originally Posted by Gotmilk

I had the exact same question when i started my battle visualisation project. I needed thousands of soldiers running around and people kept telling me that Unity cannot handle it. That only Total War engine is capable of this and this engine was built ground up for that purpose.
On the other hand i did not want to start to develop my own engine or borrow an open source solution because then i would be still developing the stuff that Unity already has (and i would probably never finish it) .
Unity has hundreds of developers who work hard every day to make this engine better.

So i decided to use unity and soon enough i found out that almost in every case there are tips, tricks and cheats that will enable to you to achieve the result you are after. I could have thousands of soldiers, i just had to write a smart code that switched some geometry, ai, pathseeking stuff to lower level when camera was further. And now with Unity4.3 beta they have optimized the skinned mesh renderer and i plugged it into my project and have 30 fps with 10k characters.

So yes i am 99% certain that Unity will be suitable for your project. There may be some stuff that are harder to do because you dont have low level access but there are almost always workarounds from this. As a simulation game you really have to simulate stuff that your player sees. The further the object is the less simulation cycles it needs. Also thanks to the popularity of the engine you already get access to modules like flight sim engine. You have already saved hundreds of manhours and thousands of dollars from that. The same applies for GUI system, AI systems,lighting, shaders, visual editors (if you want to use them). There are just too many already done good things for you to lose if you are not going to use unity. And most important is that you get things done.

If still in doubt then just look what v-i-c has achieved with Unity. Hes has a good looking game (which in my mind is not a game but a submarine simulator) that runs on iPhone. If he can achieve that with Unity then you can certainly achieve your vision on powerful computer. You can set the goals "Chris Roberts style" where you are developing your game for a 2 -3 year future gaming computer. And maybe v-i-c can license you his ocean system. It may be not so hardcore as triton but it looks good and has the right feel to it.

As for a team size i cant really say much because i have no experience. My team has a 3 people. 2 Artsist who dont use Unity and me who does code and other stuff. But i know that there are bigger studios 15 - 20 studios who are using Unity. They have their own team workflow pipeline created and by doing some research i am certain you guys manage to work something out.

I also suggest to check this out. This is a huge project and they are giving very good workflow tips on how to not go crazy


BTW: I dont know if you noticed but i edited my previous post asking about Oculus Rift support. Since your kickstarter will be for he niche market then i think that adding primitive oculus support may help you find more attention outside of the subsim community. I am very active in Oculus community and its full of passionate people who are starving for top quality games that can be played in virtual reality.

EDIT: Since you already have a lot of good quality models may i suggest skyshop plugin. https://www.assetstore.unity3d.com/#/content/8880 This one is the best lighting solution. You can easily plug it into your game. Even if you wont use it in final game you can still make near photorealistic turntables for ships and distribute these as interactive "thank you's" for your backers

Hi Milk,

Thank for the input that exactly what i want to know before involving the team in a pathway that could have lead to a major change of direction after serious work has been done and switching engine is never easy and brought a lot of headache .

The video reference is really well done and they go in the detail to avoid major pitfall, i really appreciate what these guy's are doing since it save us a lot of frustrations along the way.

Regarding Occulus rift we will have a look at that later on but i am not convince yet that our niche genre would really benefit from it but if implementing primitive support doesn't required a lot of work then we might consider it and our forum website will surely give us the necessary feedback if people want to see us supporting it.

Recently i had an email from a coder from the McGill university who is currently working on a really impressive ocean model base on the Tessendorf paper that is render on the GPU in unity and i am anxiously waiting for an answer from him since he seem very interested in ATWAR.

I want to thank everyone in this thread for their recent intervention since it seem to have spark the interest of some serious coders for our project.

Regards the Atlantic Warfare team

[Hellraiser]

I've seen enough...I'm in.