Why are the SUPER MODDERS giving up so quickly?

FAdmiral · 08-08-07, 12:45 PM

SH3 modding was a new concept and the modders spent much time to make it
what it is today. Now SH4 comes along and needs the same time spent to make
it the best. Modders now have to do the SAME thing all over again. Once is fun
but a do-over is getting dull....

JIM

SteamWake · 08-08-07, 01:13 PM

Well I know of at least one modder that got sick and tired of the constant brow beating from the community at large.

Another case of biting the hand that feeds you.

I do know that Duminicus, Tater, and others (sorry Im not real active in the dev community) are still working on things and discovering things on a daily basis.

donut · 08-08-07, 02:38 PM

It is more complex,takes time to learn,& is full of leftover files from SHIII that clutter,& confuse.Because they are connected,or unconnected to nodes that were intended features that were rushed, & or,left out. Sorta like; looking for your keys in the trash.

It does seem as though the talent,doesn't want to mess with SHIV,& that is distressing to the potential we all see so clearly. Say a prayer we continue to be blessed with challenge loving talent,to improve game-play.To make it more rewarding.
GWX,is Atlantic defeat of political injustice.OH the cost! The Pacific is winning freedom from terrorist attacks for liberty.We just want the code to work logically.Now where did the code originate:hmm:

Quagmire · 08-08-07, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAdmiral

SH3 modding was a new concept and the modders spent much time to make it
what it is today. Now SH4 comes along and needs the same time spent to make
it the best. Modders now have to do the SAME thing all over again. Once is fun
but a do-over is getting dull....

Yeah that is what I am worried about. BURNOUT. It is I am sure a lot of work to create a GWX and as luck would have it, SHIV comes along just as the GWX team has finished their SHIII masterpiece. They really would have to start all over again to make a GWX for SHIV. A constant stream of modding from their perspective.

Hats off to our supermodders. I tried to mod the game myself and all I came up with was a mess of CTDs. I just don't have the gift. I am just trying to encourage those who do to keep the faith because it is greatly appreciated. I wish their was a better way to thank these folks other than congratulatory threads.

"Don't give up the ship!", as the USN would say, supermodders. WE NEED YOU!

.

joea · 08-08-07, 02:40 PM

How do you know we won't get NEW supermodders? Tater was not around for SH3 (I "knew" him from the Il-2 forums) and is doing great things for the campaign layers, Captain Cox is new, the gusy (sorry forgot his name) who did "living breathing ocean" is new and I am sure I missed many others. Don't dispair.

Quagmire · 08-08-07, 02:44 PM

I guess I am just being a bit selfish. My greatest wish would be for the GWX team to stop working on GWX and start working on SHIV.

But I understand that they deserve to enjoy the fruits of their labor.

I have the highest respect for them. In fact, I sometimes respect them more than the original devs of the game. How is it that a guy like Anvart can fix the periscopes in a week or so with no knowledge of the source code of the game, while the devs with all their inside knowledge can't seem to keep such errors out of a patch.

Do the devs actually play the game they develop???

.

Sailor Steve · 08-08-07, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joea

How do you know we won't get NEW supermodders? Tater was not around for SH3 (I "knew" him from the Il-2 forums) and is doing great things for the campaign layers, Captain Cox is new, the gusy (sorry forgot his name) who did "living breathing ocean" is new and I am sure I missed many others. Don't dispair.

And none of the great modders for SH2 had much to do with SH3. New folks come along, the game is still shiny and new, and who knows what it's going to look like two years down the line?

Patience is everything.

Ducimus · 08-08-07, 06:07 PM

Good points. Theres quite a few great mods that are made by people who never modded for Sh3. Realistically, i dont think its a good idea to count on the modders from Sh3 to be around long in general. Think about it, you spend Months, or years tooling around with one game, now you have to start over and do it all over again?! Yeah, right....

Modding this game is not hard. Once you learn the file structure and what files do what, your in a position to change most annoyances.

Ducimus · 08-08-07, 06:34 PM

You know, i woudlnt burn out so quickly and want to quit if i wasnt doing so much by myself. I'd love to just poke at a single problem, focus on it, kick it around for a couple weeks or months, off and on as time allowed. But since i chose to make a modpack, i don't have that luxury. I have a pressing need to "move on to the next item" sort of thing.

I have often thought about making a formal "team". Asking for volunteers, but i havent for many reasons:

1.) I dont want to alienate anyone.

2.) I like modding discussions in the open. A team often has a tendency to, (and sometimes a need to), discuss in private. I dislike this because it keeps knowledge and know how from the public, and the mod forum no longer an open forum. I dont want to form a cliche and factionalize the community, or set the foundations for a future mod war.

3.) Formal team means Commitment. Just how much commitment left do i have to give? I dont know.

Maybe theres another way? I dunno. An open agreement to work on the same collective project? But then comes an issue of "vision", "goals" and "intent". You have to pursue a singular goal, if you can't the end result will be watered down and dilluted.

tater · 08-08-07, 06:52 PM

When I was plugging alone on my campaign at my own pace, and attacking other things as I felt like it, it was entirely fun. To the extent I feel pressured to get somethign out the door quickly, it becomes "work."

Having all kinds of people use my campaign in TM indeed made it more on the work side because I hated to have a crappy camapign used by many people---and I do consider what I have beta because it doesn't match my vision for it by a long shot yet.

Getting a "good enough" version out there for TM frees me to work at my own pace again, and I'll happily try and modularize it when it's dialed in for TM.

I like that whole concept of modules, frankly. Different people have different interests.

To the extent you can muck around for fun, it's fun. As soon as you are compelled to "support" stuff it becomes work.

As for secrets.. I have a post waiting to be made regarding new camapign stuff, but it's fun to keep it a little on the hush hush side since they are fun things that are more fun for not knowing ahead of time exactly what they are.

tater

08-08-07, 12:45 PM	#1
FAdmiral Pacific Aces Dev Team Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA, USA Posts: 1,079 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	SH3 modding was a new concept and the modders spent much time to make it what it is today. Now SH4 comes along and needs the same time spent to make it the best. Modders now have to do the SAME thing all over again. Once is fun but a do-over is getting dull.... JIM __________________ If you\'re not taking losses, you\'re not doing enough. RAdm. Kelly Turner, USN ********************************** www.fairtax.org

08-08-07, 02:38 PM	#3
donut The Old Man Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: The Shifting, Whispering Sands, NM Posts: 1,463 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	The file system in SHIV. It is more complex,takes time to learn,& is full of leftover files from SHIII that clutter,& confuse.Because they are connected,or unconnected to nodes that were intended features that were rushed, & or,left out. Sorta like; looking for your keys in the trash. It does seem as though the talent,doesn't want to mess with SHIV,& that is distressing to the potential we all see so clearly. Say a prayer we continue to be blessed with challenge loving talent,to improve game-play.To make it more rewarding. GWX,is Atlantic defeat of political injustice.OH the cost! The Pacific is winning freedom from terrorist attacks for liberty.We just want the code to work logically.Now where did the code originate:hmm: Last edited by donut; 08-08-07 at 03:17 PM.

08-08-07, 02:44 PM	#6
Quagmire Watch Officer Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 335 Downloads: 52 Uploads: 0	I guess I am just being a bit selfish. My greatest wish would be for the GWX team to stop working on GWX and start working on SHIV. But I understand that they deserve to enjoy the fruits of their labor. I have the highest respect for them. In fact, I sometimes respect them more than the original devs of the game. How is it that a guy like Anvart can fix the periscopes in a week or so with no knowledge of the source code of the game, while the devs with all their inside knowledge can't seem to keep such errors out of a patch. Do the devs actually play the game they develop??? . __________________ The day publishers figured out that they could sell flashy first person shooters to teenagers in numbers greater than sand on a beach was the day that quality simulations died. --Col. Tibbets UBI SHIV Forums I guess they should have made SH4 an open boat where we run around inside and shoot each other a 1000 times. They seem to handle those games with numerous patches. --Longam UBI SHIV Forums A sad day has dawned...

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08-08-07, 01:13 PM	#2
SteamWake Rear Admiral Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,224 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Well I know of at least one modder that got sick and tired of the constant brow beating from the community at large. Another case of biting the hand that feeds you. I do know that Duminicus, Tater, and others (sorry Im not real active in the dev community) are still working on things and discovering things on a daily basis.

08-08-07, 02:40 PM	#5
joea Silent Hunter Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: At periscope depth in Lake Geneva Posts: 3,512 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	How do you know we won't get NEW supermodders? Tater was not around for SH3 (I "knew" him from the Il-2 forums) and is doing great things for the campaign layers, Captain Cox is new, the gusy (sorry forgot his name) who did "living breathing ocean" is new and I am sure I missed many others. Don't dispair.

08-08-07, 06:07 PM	#8
Ducimus Rear Admiral Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 12,987 Downloads: 67 Uploads: 2	Good points. Theres quite a few great mods that are made by people who never modded for Sh3. Realistically, i dont think its a good idea to count on the modders from Sh3 to be around long in general. Think about it, you spend Months, or years tooling around with one game, now you have to start over and do it all over again?! Yeah, right.... Modding this game is not hard. Once you learn the file structure and what files do what, your in a position to change most annoyances.

08-08-07, 06:34 PM	#9
Ducimus Rear Admiral Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 12,987 Downloads: 67 Uploads: 2	You know, i woudlnt burn out so quickly and want to quit if i wasnt doing so much by myself. I'd love to just poke at a single problem, focus on it, kick it around for a couple weeks or months, off and on as time allowed. But since i chose to make a modpack, i don't have that luxury. I have a pressing need to "move on to the next item" sort of thing. I have often thought about making a formal "team". Asking for volunteers, but i havent for many reasons: 1.) I dont want to alienate anyone. 2.) I like modding discussions in the open. A team often has a tendency to, (and sometimes a need to), discuss in private. I dislike this because it keeps knowledge and know how from the public, and the mod forum no longer an open forum. I dont want to form a cliche and factionalize the community, or set the foundations for a future mod war. 3.) Formal team means Commitment. Just how much commitment left do i have to give? I dont know. Maybe theres another way? I dunno. An open agreement to work on the same collective project? But then comes an issue of "vision", "goals" and "intent". You have to pursue a singular goal, if you can't the end result will be watered down and dilluted.

08-08-07, 06:52 PM	#10
tater Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 9,023 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 2	When I was plugging alone on my campaign at my own pace, and attacking other things as I felt like it, it was entirely fun. To the extent I feel pressured to get somethign out the door quickly, it becomes "work." Having all kinds of people use my campaign in TM indeed made it more on the work side because I hated to have a crappy camapign used by many people---and I do consider what I have beta because it doesn't match my vision for it by a long shot yet. Getting a "good enough" version out there for TM frees me to work at my own pace again, and I'll happily try and modularize it when it's dialed in for TM. I like that whole concept of modules, frankly. Different people have different interests. To the extent you can muck around for fun, it's fun. As soon as you are compelled to "support" stuff it becomes work. As for secrets.. I have a post waiting to be made regarding new camapign stuff, but it's fun to keep it a little on the hush hush side since they are fun things that are more fun for not knowing ahead of time exactly what they are. tater