[TEC] Observation about zones.cfg

U-Bones · 04-07-07, 04:32 PM

I am using blackberry, pardon terse replies until Monday.

I wanted to figure out what compartment mapped to the deck watch so I tagged each piece of equip (not just compartments) with a diff value. I then saved a sub and looked in the save file. I was shocked that each compartment used the exact same value - and one not even from a compartment. I repeated with 3 more subs and ran out of time.

All I am saying is that all compartments use a single value from zones.cfg for crit float. I was not drawing any conclusions so much as throwing out a million new questions... We are not in Kansas anymore Toto.

I now wonder how everything else is mapped.

As for odd damage, I do not think it is related - the saves I have looked at indicate undisplayed hull damage - it just unfortunately has weird ways of appearing to be heavy without flooding - no other compartments have to be showing unrepaired damage when this happens (of course sometimes it does). Damage Control has several bugs I think, but before we get a good handle on it mapping out the variables is neccessary.

Crit floatation is simply the damage percentage at which compartment flooding started in SH3 - I would hesitate to assume it does the same thing in SH4 until I look at a bunch of saves.

I will not be able to test more until Monday night, but I am pretty sure there is more to come now we know zones.cfg is being used in such an unconventional manner.

shad43 · 04-08-07, 07:56 AM

Hmmm, me thinks me smell a good fix on the horizon

U-Bones · 04-08-07, 10:54 PM

I got home early and had time to poke about a bit more.

I was somewhat wrong. It seems that a given sub is not locked down to the same setting all the time. I have seen Gar and Porpoise change and my current working theory is that every sub load randomly interacts with zones.cfg like this

1. Selects either the Attack or Obs periscope.

2. Get CriticalFloatation from Critic Floatation.

3. Set FloodingSpeed, formula is (1 / FloodingTime)

Interestingly, stock 1.1 had identical data in both periscopes, so they were not using the randomization potiential they build in.... OR the nasty alternative is that none of this is intended and everything is broken and that is the cause of all the spastic damage - but I do not think that is the case.

IF the engine is loading any other Sub data from zones.cfg, I do not think it is coming from the sub section

So basically, I think that the fruit of this excercise is

1. We now know that each compartment no longer has its own flooding threshold or speed - it is set globally on the sub.

2. We now know how to set these global variables.

3. With two known sources for the data, we can introduce a little uncertainty here. Maybe one setting floods slowly at 33% damage, the other much faster at 66%.. or similar scenarios, you get the idea. You would not know which you get on a given patrol unless you peek in your save.

4. The extent of the random selection is yet to be determined - I will have to look at a lot more saves before I can absolutely say there are no other sections looked at besides periscopes (not so far that I have observed). My expectation is that it only looks at the two periscopes.

5. The criteria for the random selection is yet to be determined. I looked for and excluded two sub/type and general early/late patterns. All I have noticed is that it seems to randomise in short runs of 1 to 6. My expectation is that it is purely random in that it does not depend on anything user selectable.

6. A big question that this brings up is - how does this impact other vessels ? aircraft ? do they also use zones.cfg differently than they did in SH3 ? I know that I will not be using ships imported from SH3 until this is understood better... not like there is a shortage anyway.

7. Another question. Why was this hidden so weirdly ? Why didnt these two simply get placed into the new UPC files ? Time crunch ? Oversight ?

8. Starting values set by stock 1.1 zones.cfg are
CriticalFloation = 0.300000 (direct from Critic Floation)
FloodingSpeed = 0.016667 ( from 1 / FloodingTime which was 59.999996)

9. I am still assuming that Crit Floatation means what it did in SH3. I will test that tomrrow night.

This also explains why some of my early testing re flooding was so wacky - I was tweaking stuff that had no effect on the game.

Hope this all makes better sense now.

FAdmiral · 04-09-07, 02:45 PM

Bump - This thread may just help fix some of the problems guys are
having with damage control....

JIM

Redwine · 04-09-07, 03:17 PM

Wonderful... even when i cant understand very well.. it looks as a preludo of a great discover and new mod...

Medal for U-Bones !

Make it sticky please !

Ducimus · 04-09-07, 03:46 PM

U-Bones · 04-09-07, 03:52 PM

I don't think this discovery has anything to do with damage issues, but I intend to come out with a Reduced Flooding mod that may help get a handle on the weird damage. Hopefully. I just want to check a couple more things.

I really don't think there is anything profound that will come out of this.

04-09-07, 02:45 PM	#4
FAdmiral Pacific Aces Dev Team Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA, USA Posts: 1,079 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	Bump - This thread may just help fix some of the problems guys are having with damage control.... JIM __________________ If you\'re not taking losses, you\'re not doing enough. RAdm. Kelly Turner, USN ********************************** www.fairtax.org

04-09-07, 03:17 PM	#5
Redwine Sea Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: San Martin de los Andes, Neuquen, , Argentina. Posts: 1,962 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Wonderful... even when i cant understand very well.. it looks as a preludo of a great discover and new mod... Medal for U-Bones ! Make it sticky please ! __________________ . "SH III and SH IV Mods" "Manual TDC Tutorial" "SH2 Downloads Selection"

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04-07-07, 04:32 PM	#1
U-Bones Grey Wolf Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Treading Water Posts: 847 Downloads: 56 Uploads: 0	I am using blackberry, pardon terse replies until Monday. I wanted to figure out what compartment mapped to the deck watch so I tagged each piece of equip (not just compartments) with a diff value. I then saved a sub and looked in the save file. I was shocked that each compartment used the exact same value - and one not even from a compartment. I repeated with 3 more subs and ran out of time. All I am saying is that all compartments use a single value from zones.cfg for crit float. I was not drawing any conclusions so much as throwing out a million new questions... We are not in Kansas anymore Toto. I now wonder how everything else is mapped. As for odd damage, I do not think it is related - the saves I have looked at indicate undisplayed hull damage - it just unfortunately has weird ways of appearing to be heavy without flooding - no other compartments have to be showing unrepaired damage when this happens (of course sometimes it does). Damage Control has several bugs I think, but before we get a good handle on it mapping out the variables is neccessary. Crit floatation is simply the damage percentage at which compartment flooding started in SH3 - I would hesitate to assume it does the same thing in SH4 until I look at a bunch of saves. I will not be able to test more until Monday night, but I am pretty sure there is more to come now we know zones.cfg is being used in such an unconventional manner.

04-08-07, 07:56 AM	#2
shad43 Frogman Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: six feet under Posts: 301 Downloads: 21 Uploads: 0	Hmmm, me thinks me smell a good fix on the horizon

04-08-07, 10:54 PM	#3
U-Bones Grey Wolf Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Treading Water Posts: 847 Downloads: 56 Uploads: 0	I got home early and had time to poke about a bit more. I was somewhat wrong. It seems that a given sub is not locked down to the same setting all the time. I have seen Gar and Porpoise change and my current working theory is that every sub load randomly interacts with zones.cfg like this 1. Selects either the Attack or Obs periscope. 2. Get CriticalFloatation from Critic Floatation. 3. Set FloodingSpeed, formula is (1 / FloodingTime) Interestingly, stock 1.1 had identical data in both periscopes, so they were not using the randomization potiential they build in.... OR the nasty alternative is that none of this is intended and everything is broken and that is the cause of all the spastic damage - but I do not think that is the case. IF the engine is loading any other Sub data from zones.cfg, I do not think it is coming from the sub section So basically, I think that the fruit of this excercise is 1. We now know that each compartment no longer has its own flooding threshold or speed - it is set globally on the sub. 2. We now know how to set these global variables. 3. With two known sources for the data, we can introduce a little uncertainty here. Maybe one setting floods slowly at 33% damage, the other much faster at 66%.. or similar scenarios, you get the idea. You would not know which you get on a given patrol unless you peek in your save. 4. The extent of the random selection is yet to be determined - I will have to look at a lot more saves before I can absolutely say there are no other sections looked at besides periscopes (not so far that I have observed). My expectation is that it only looks at the two periscopes. 5. The criteria for the random selection is yet to be determined. I looked for and excluded two sub/type and general early/late patterns. All I have noticed is that it seems to randomise in short runs of 1 to 6. My expectation is that it is purely random in that it does not depend on anything user selectable. 6. A big question that this brings up is - how does this impact other vessels ? aircraft ? do they also use zones.cfg differently than they did in SH3 ? I know that I will not be using ships imported from SH3 until this is understood better... not like there is a shortage anyway. 7. Another question. Why was this hidden so weirdly ? Why didnt these two simply get placed into the new UPC files ? Time crunch ? Oversight ? 8. Starting values set by stock 1.1 zones.cfg are CriticalFloation = 0.300000 (direct from Critic Floation) FloodingSpeed = 0.016667 ( from 1 / FloodingTime which was 59.999996) 9. I am still assuming that Crit Floatation means what it did in SH3. I will test that tomrrow night. This also explains why some of my early testing re flooding was so wacky - I was tweaking stuff that had no effect on the game. Hope this all makes better sense now.

04-09-07, 03:46 PM	#6
Ducimus Rear Admiral Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 12,987 Downloads: 67 Uploads: 2

04-09-07, 03:52 PM	#7
U-Bones Grey Wolf Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Treading Water Posts: 847 Downloads: 56 Uploads: 0	I don't think this discovery has anything to do with damage issues, but I intend to come out with a Reduced Flooding mod that may help get a handle on the weird damage. Hopefully. I just want to check a couple more things. I really don't think there is anything profound that will come out of this.