DW vs Harpoon 3

[SeaQueen]

Originally Posted by kozowh

Anyone care to do a comparative review? Which one do you prefer and why?

Thanks for any input.

I don't really prefer one over the other. In fact, sometimes I will create a scenario in both DW and Harpoon and play it from two different perspectives.

Dangerous waters is a tactical simulation in the sense that have a small number of platforms (usually just one or two) and they fight a series of engagements in a single battle.

Harpoon is a step up into the operational level. So you might fight a series of battles to accomplish a broader goal than is typical in DW. Harpoon also does the tactical level quite well, but compared to DW, things are a little bit abstracted. In Harpoon, you don't fiddle with active sonar modes, or look out the bridge wing with a pair of binoculars. All of that is assumed to be handled by your little people.

I think both of their sensor models are pretty sophisticated. Harpoon has a much better weather model. Harpoon's radar model is better than DWs. That's important for surface warfare especially. Harpoon is also better if you want to do anything involving aircraft carriers. I don't like how DW handles them.

Harpoon's database of ships, aircraft and land platforms is HUGE and there's no distinction between a "playable" platfom and an AI. All platforms are potentially playable.

DW is fun for different reasons, though. In Harpoon target motion analysis is abstracted. Areas of uncertainty and what not are calculated automatically, and you don't need to worry about doing things like following bearing rates or other important factors in TMA. In DW, though, you have to concern yourself with these kinds of details. You really have to get into the details of it in DW to be excellent. In Harpoon, the most it's really useful to think about is things like whether you're on a lead or a lag LOS.

Harpoon games tend to emphasize cruise missiles and aircraft. Dangerous waters games tend of emphasize ASW. I think that's often the fault of scenario designers, though, and the fact that Harpoon's radar model is a little more sophisticated.

Dangerous waters really does a good job of capturing the feel of being on a ship. I remember when I got back from a short cruise aboard an FFG and marveling at how well they'd captured the way a ship moves underneath one.

All in all, I use Harpoon when I want to experiment with a whole fleet, performing complex operations with multiple platforms. I use DW when I want to experiment with actions by single ships or small groups in detail.

[kozowh]

SeaQueen--

Thank you for your detailed and very informative discussion of H3 and DW.

-Bullet