Las Vegas: 59 dead in Mandalay Bay shooting

[Red October1984]

Originally Posted by Reece

I think all automatic weapons should be banned, you don't hunt game with machine guns!!!
The gun laws here in Australia are the opposite, it is very hard to get a license for a single shot .22 for example, ridiculous when you live in a country area where the nearest house is a mile away!! (sorry about the rant)

For the USA at least, it is extremely difficult for the average person to get an automatic weapon. There's a TON of paperwork and licensing involved and even then it's still illegal to hunt with an automatic weapon. In Missouri, you can't hunt with an automatic gun or a gun with magazine capacity over 10 and Missouri has very loose legislation.

They're not banned necessarily...but it is illegal for the average person to have one.

To buy an automatic weapon you have to have a full ATF/FBI background screening, fully register the firearm federally, fingerprints, recent photo, chief law enforcement approval, etc etc and it takes a long time.

The only problem is that laws only apply to those that follow them. I've never heard of anybody defend owning an NFA/Automatic firearm by saying they hunt with it. It's usually collectors, history buffs, or EXTREME hobbyists in my experience.

There's also the bump fire modifications like the one linked above that's a bit of a loophole but still frowned upon. Thanks Julhelm for the video. I entirely forgot that the stocks exist that allow you to do that. Without modifying the gun, it is possible to fire quick bursts like that....but only in very quick bursts.

--

That surprises me a little bit about Australia. I would figure they'd be a little looser on gun legislation.

[Reece]

It is against the law here if you are caught with a spud gun, water gel guns, or any plastic pellet guns.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Reece

It is against the law here if you are caught with a spud gun, water gel guns, or any plastic pellet guns.

Yeah, the Aussie government decided after 35 were killed and 23 wounded that enough was enough. Between 1991 and 2001 the number of firearms related deaths in Australia went down by 47%.

Funny old world.

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by Red October1984

It's (ish, give or take) a 413 yard distance to be firing which is pretty difficult unless you're experienced with weapons. This wasn't an amateur for sure. Automatic weapons at that distance for that event, oh yeah. Planned for sure.

Well, it's fairly long range but he had 20,000 people packed shoulder to shoulder, he did not need to be accurate. With that much range, it was difficult for the people on the ground to know where the fire was coming from, I bet.

Originally Posted by Red October1984

For the USA at least, it is extremely difficult for the average person to get an automatic weapon. There's a TON of paperwork and licensing involved and even then it's still illegal to hunt with an automatic weapon. In Missouri, you can't hunt with an automatic gun or a gun with magazine capacity over 10 and Missouri has very loose legislation.

They're not banned necessarily...but it is illegal for the average person to have one.

To buy an automatic weapon you have to have a full ATF/FBI background screening, fully register the firearm federally, fingerprints, recent photo, chief law enforcement approval, etc etc and it takes a long time.

I'm interested in learning if he has a legal automatic, or illegally modified semi-auto. I don't go for all the homemade full auto gimmicks, that should be illegal.

Wasn't there a girlfriend/partner or some female person of interest? I've heard she was interviewed/in Tokyo. Nothing since this morning.

[eddie]

Only thing I know about her Neal is that she is out of the country, somewhere in SE Asia. Hard for me to believe she didn't know what kind of firepower he had purchased, but can't say she knew how he was planning to use it.

[vienna]

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

Well, it's fairly long range but he had 20,000 people packed shoulder to shoulder, he did not need to be accurate. With that much range, it was difficult for the people on the ground to know where the fire was coming from, I bet.

...

When the first videos of the shooting were shown on the news reports, I thought, at first, the seeming automatic fire was just the sound of the shots ricocheting off the adjacent buildings, making it seem like full auto; the news station here played the footage a couple of more times, and, on the second play it was very obvious it was full auto; I can only imagine what it must have been like to have been in the crowd hearing the sounds with no idea of what was really happening or where the shots were coming from...






<O>

[Sean C]

IMHO, when something like this happens, as little personal information if any should be released about the perpetrator. The media should just refer to them as "some psychopathic loser" and then focus on the victims. I think the attention one receives after committing an act like this, whether or not they survive, plays more than a small part in their motivation.

Depending on how horrific the act, the media may spend weeks, months or even years discussing it. If you have a manifesto, they'll plug it and it will likely be published so the world can hear what you were angry about. You'll probably get your own Wikipedia page and, if you're lucky, you'll even make the cover of Rolling Stone. You just have to do something a little more heinous than the last thing in recent memory and you're a star.

F███ that. Stop making these pieces of filth famous. Wipe their names and memories from history and focus on helping the survivors and the victims' families. It may not stop all of the wack jobs out there, but at least it will give them one less reason to commit murder. After all, who wants to be remembered for five minutes as "some douche who couldn't handle life"?

Personally, I don't care who this s███head was or what his problems were. The authorities can look into that and if they feel there is something that can be done in the future to prevent a similar incident, they can suggest it and we can consider it and vote on it. That should be the only "legacy" these scum leave behind.

[/rant]

[Mr Quatro]

Originally Posted by Nathaniel B.

I think the attention one receives after committing an act like this, whether or not they survive, plays more than a small part in their motivation.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

F███ that. Stop making these pieces of filth famous. Wipe their names and memories from history and focus on helping the survivors and the victims' families. It may not stop all of the wack jobs out there, but at least it will give them one less reason to commit murder. After all, who wants to be remembered for five minutes as "some douche who couldn't handle life"?

[/rant]

I agree Nathaniel, but that won't change the way the news media does things ... perhaps when they come up with a subscription to the news without advertising revenue being involved ... perhaps then we will see a change in news coverage, but until then all we have is our remote control.

I like guns in fact I love guns and had planned to travel to Nevada to purchase an Italian semi-auto 9 shot shotgun, but not now ... I'll just stay at home and pay more here.

Look at the laws in Nevada ... are they to blame?

[vienna]

On the subject of better ideas:





Funny thing about ideas: they require thought, consideration, and ultimately, action to be effective; re: Congress and Trump... don't hold your breath...







<O>

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Red October1984

The only problem is that laws only apply to those that follow them.

And that is the core of it, everything else in the guns-'n-rifles controversy revolves around this.

In Germany, the gun laws are hilariously tight, I would even call them and the generla German attitude towards firearms hysterical. You are not allowed to just own a pistol, you have to be a sport club mmeber, you must conduct 18 shooting sessions per year which must be documented in writing and must be confirmed by a club president, and you have to participate in tournaments regularly, to illustrate your "need" of why you must hold a weapons license. You are not allowed to just own a pistol, not even just in yourhousehol, not carried in public. My father, age 73, quit sport shooting early this year and refused to obey to all that paternalism, and gave back his full license then. He was pissed. - Want to see a German popping up like corn? Tell him you want to have a pistol, its as if you press a button: plopp! We have some of the very tightest gun laws ince the world, and still they want to tighten the screws whenever somebody did somehting with a firearm. That over 99,9% of criminal deeds involving firearms, are done with illegal firearms, nobody cares for. It gets completely ignored, completely. They cannot get the criminals, so they relieve their steam at the cost of sport shooters and the right for private property. On the other side a documentary some days ago showed how easy you can get an illegal pistol in Germany if you know how. Police says (police!) in Berlin it takes you two hours, then you can have one, if you want.

And then there is the darknet.

Tightening gun laws on and on, just does not work. You hit the wrong crowd by that, to over 99.9%. You declare them all to be under general suspicion, and that they must prove their innocence - and they must prove it time and time and time again. And even then the public opinion and mainstream media nevertheless are hostile to them. You are expected to not wantintg to have a firearm, you are expected to just tick right, you are expected to be a good boy. And a servile victim. Being victim instead of defending yourself, declares your deüendency and indifference, and that are much wanted qualities nowadays.

The rate of deaths by car accidents trumps amok runs anyway, easily. But no outcry.

[Dowly]

Weapon count is now up to 23 found in the hotel room, also two bump fire stocks have been found.

[Onkel Neal]

So, confirmed no full autos? Maybe we need to tighten up on bump stocks and trigger cranks, etc.

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

So, confirmed no full autos? Maybe we need to tighten up on bump stocks and trigger cranks, etc.

I didn't see any specifics being mentioned about the weapons, just that two bump stocks were found.

But yes, something that effectively turns your semi-auto into full-auto probably should not be very easy to get.

[STEED]

Why shares in gun firms rose after Vegas horror

http://news.sky.com/story/why-shares...orror-11065560

I am speechless.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by STEED

http://news.sky.com/story/why-shares...orror-11065560

I am speechless.

But not postless