[WIP] Lighthouses mod

Originally Posted by gap

How should I use them? Do they require any previous patch? I see no particle library file in your patches, are the modified particle generators stored directly in materials.dat?

No, they don't require any previous patch, the particles generators are stored directly in LLH_LaPlate.dat and Materials.dat.

Originally Posted by gap

but in my case the flickering problem was caused by foam particles being flat and not following wave ripples.

That's my problem too ...

Originally Posted by gap

If that wasn't possible, I suppose that the second best solution would be making single foam particles quite small, and linking them to their particle generator as object particles, each of them with a floating object controller attached.

... even with floating objects.

Originally Posted by gap

As for textures, please have a look at the link below:

http://unigine.com/articles/procedur...ent-generation

We could extract a single frame from that big texture or, preferably, we could use it as a whole and set it as an amimated texture (has I have noticedm PG's support them). Should the resulting animation look too stuttering, we could extract just a few frames, and generate the intermediate frames with a morphing program

Very nice textures, but can be used only if they are following the waves' shape.

Originally Posted by gap

The best solution would be finding a controller forcing the game to render particles directly on the sea surface

Sure !

Originally Posted by gap

(provided that devs had thought about such a controller).

I think they didn't think about such a controller ...

Originally Posted by gap

Tests with this controller have not given univocal results so far: sometimes it seems to work, other times it seems not to have any effect, and some other times it seems to do things worse. The game randomizing environmental parameters every time the testing mission is loades, doesn't help either

Mmh. I set 0,5 for the light halo, and there is no visible change, the halo is not in front of the lantern as expected ...

Originally Posted by gap

I wonder how lighthouse keepers could live in those wet traps in days like those

A horrible noise preventing you to sleep, and the building quaking as if it was on the point to fall in the raging sea ...

Originally Posted by gap

I hope you guys aren't really aiming at mimicing that effect: wind speeds in SH games are limited to 15 m/s and such an huge splashes would be totally unrealistic even for the highest wave we can experience in game

True. Just a bigger splash effect when waves are 2 meters a. s. l.

Originally Posted by gap

The horizontal splash texture used for smaller waves is okay IMO

Precisely, it's not. I explain. This texture has not a round shape. And it's always looking at camera. So when you see it from the air, you see 'lines'. Don't know if I'm clear enough. This results in this problem :

Originally Posted by gap

I have increased placement nodes under request by MLF, who complained about the poor look of the splashes when seen from top.

So, we have to not use it.

Originally Posted by gap

Talking more in general, something we should do is setting PG's opacity/density scale far parameters appropriately. By doing that, we would save computer resources and improve the far look of splash effects (not being affected by haze, when seen from far distance our splashes stand a bit too much on the horizon).

Really don't understand what you're talking about.

PS : What do you mean with FX, SFX and PG's ?

Originally Posted by gap

The submerged wave sound could be improved too. Oddly, it sounds okay inside the sub, but I can hear some sound distorsion (like a clipping) at the end of the SFX when it is heard in free camera

Originally Posted by gap

During your absence I dealed mostly with effects, but now that you are back on duty I will leave them to you. Damage models are nearly ready. Below you can see how the top tower will look (more or less) after all the detachable eave pieces (12 in total) are blown up

Good work.

Originally Posted by gap

I only need to twist/smash up/rip away the rebar frame (most of it will be gone in the final version).

You mean the rusty metalic structure all around the top of the tower ?

Originally Posted by gap

Talking about effects and features that still need(ed) our attenction, I have reworked a bit your light effect. I have set its flashing period according to this graph:



light flashes duration: ca. 0.4 s
short dark pauses duration: ca. 0.3 s
long dark pausel duration: 4 s

All in all, flashes last a bit longer now, and they are more easily conted. I hope you don't mind me modifying your setting; tomorrow i will post here my update.

Yes, ok, no problem.

Originally Posted by gap

Still talking about the light effect, I have calculated that its range in the SH world, for the La Plate lighthouse, should be ca. 15 km (eqivalent of 8 nm at the same latitude in RW), and I have set effect's LOD distance accordingly. Despite that, in calm weather and with perfect visibility, the effect becomes invisible at a distance of ca. 9 km, whereas the lights of the generic lighthouse models you have added with patch 1 are visible from further away. I don't know if this difference is caused by the different sizes of the two light effect, or by the fact that 'unit' objects become invisible before 'terrain' objects. I have also read that SHIII's skydome is a 3d model, and that different mods have been released to increase the visible range of far objects; this limitation might also come in the picture. What do you know on the topic? What's the radius of the stock SHIII atmosphere, and what the rendering radius? Talking about the latter, as far as you know, is there any differenece between units and terrain objects?

In stock game, the radius of the sky is 8 km. In GWX, it's 16 km. So, if the object is more than 8 km away from you, it will disappear.

The 'rendering radius' is controlled by the fog parameters.

[gap]

Originally Posted by Kendras

No, they don't require any previous patch, the particles generators are stored directly in LLH_LaPlate.dat and Materials.dat.

Okay, I will test them right after replying your other remarks

Originally Posted by Kendras

That's my problem too ...

... even with floating objects.

Very nice textures, but can be used only if they are following the waves' shape.

Sure !

I think they didn't think about such a controller ...

Okay, let me see if by digging stock files I can find any useful controller. If we don't, I think that animated particles might make the flickering lesser obvious. If also that trick doesn't work, we can always scrap the effect, though not seeing any foam on the sea surface after those big splashes, would be a bit unnatural

Originally Posted by Kendras

Mmh. I set 0,5 for the light halo, and there is no visible change, the halo is not in front of the lantern as expected ...

You might try some higher values, what do you want to achieve? On my system, after restoring the dummy 3D model linked to the same node as the light effect, the light is normally in front of the lantern (its glass looks illuminated) unless I move the camera too close to the lantern, in which case, depending on the angle, the light pops on the back of the lantern. When this happens, clicking again on the free camera (eye) icon, resets the effect and moves it back in front of the glass

Originally Posted by Kendras

A horrible noise preventing you to sleep, and the building quaking as if it was on the point to fall in the raging sea ...

I hope they were well paid for having to go through such an horrible experience throughout their lives

Originally Posted by Kendras

True. Just a bigger splash effect when waves are 2 meters a. s. l.

Originally Posted by Kendras

Precisely, it's not. I explain. This texture has not a round shape. And it's always looking at camera. So when you see it from the air, you see 'lines'. Don't know if I'm clear enough. This results in this problem :

During my tests I have never noticed anything similar to what you are describing, and I find that texture pretty appropriate as main particle for low-medium waves, but to be honest my comments are only relative to side views of the effect: I don't care too much how the overall effect looks from the top, as we will rarely see it from that perspective anyway

Originally Posted by Kendras

Really don't understand what you're talking about.

Originally Posted by Kendras

PS : What do you mean with FX, SFX and PG's ?

FX = effects
SFX = sound effects
PG = particle generator

Originally Posted by Kendras

Good work.

Thanks

Originally Posted by Kendras

You mean the rusty metalic structure all around the top of the tower ?

Exactly. Except for being rusty, that framework looks like it has been just set up and waiting for fresh concrete to be casted around it. I must try and imagine how the same structure would look after an explosion, with entire portions of it ripped away together with the eaves it supported, and the remaining portions badly twisted due to the explosion

Originally Posted by Kendras

Yes, ok, no problem.

You can copy/paste the reworked effect from the dat file linked below:

https://www.mediafire.com/file/5cpmf...ghthouse_FX.7z

I also suggest you to copy the light halo material embedded in the same file: it represents a light glow with rays not sticking out from the glow (as in the stock texture), but being part of the glow itself. The effect is best appreciated against a dark background, as the sea surface.

Originally Posted by Kendras

In stock game, the radius of the sky is 8 km. In GWX, it's 16 km.

The 16 km atmosphere mod is a separate mod of GWX, but during my tests I didn't enable it. I will for my next tests and I will let you know the results

Originally Posted by Kendras

So, if the object is more than 8 km away from you, it will disappear.

This radius is actually longer than 8 km; a little more than 9 km measured on the nav map. After that limit the light disappears. What is strange, is that the effect linked to the generic models is visible from a longer distance...

Originally Posted by Kendras

The 'rendering radius' is controlled by the fog parameters.

I am talking about the radius beyond which any unit is treated in game as a dimensionless point on the map and information of its damage and remaining ammo storage is reset to standard values. This value in stock SH5 is equal to ca. 20 km and it is hardcoded (though there is a patch by TheDarkWraith for setting it at wish); I suspect it replaced the soft-coded atmosphere radius of older SH games.

Still talkin about SH5, dunno about SHIII and IV, fog parameters are only for player's visual, and they have nothing to do with the actual rendering radius (as far as an unit is within 20 km from the player, it will be treated as a physical object, whether the player can see it or not depending on weather conditions and fog settings).

Talking about our mod, I think the highest and most powerful lighthouses emit a light signal that, at best visibility conditions, can be seen as far as 60 km away from their source. I wish our mod to reflect those nominal ranges, but I am afraid that setting in-game rendering/atmosphere radius to 60 km, will be beyond the possibilies of the game engine and of our poor machines.
I am wondering what could be a good alternative. Scaling down the ranges by a factor 4-5 maybe, so that the longest ranged lights will be visible from a distance of 15-12 km, and shorter lights as La Plate will be visible within a radius of only 4-5 km? what do you think?

[MLF]

Originally Posted by gap

Talking about our mod, I think the highest and most powerful lighthouses emit a light signal that, at best visibility conditions, can be seen as far as 60 km away from their source. I wish our mod to reflect those nominal ranges, but I am afraid that setting in-game rendering/atmosphere radius to 60 km, will be beyond the possibilies of the game engine and of our poor machines.
I am wondering what could be a good alternative. Scaling down the ranges by a factor 4-5 maybe, so that the longest ranged lights will be visible from a distance of 15-12 km, and shorter lights as La Plate will be visible within a radius of only 4-5 km? what do you think?

The range of La Plate is 8 Miles (13km) - modern chart in screenshot shows characteristic as:
A group of 9 very quick flashes over a 10 second period, 19m high (as you said gap) with a range of 8 Miles (13km)

Link to abbreviations and symbols - still searching for 1940's era symbols.

http://www.yachter.fr/shom/html5/sym...ndex.html#56/z

Regards,

MLF

[gap]

Originally Posted by gap

Talking about our mod, I think the highest and most powerful lighthouses emit a light signal that, at best visibility conditions, can be seen as far as 60 km away from their source. I wish our mod to reflect those nominal ranges, but I am afraid that setting in-game rendering/atmosphere radius to 60 km, will be beyond the possibilies of the game engine and of our poor machines.
I am wondering what could be a good alternative. Scaling down the ranges by a factor 4-5 maybe, so that the longest ranged lights will be visible from a distance of 15-12 km, and shorter lights as La Plate will be visible within a radius of only 4-5 km? what do you think?

@ Kendras

I have noticed that Hitman had created a 20-km environment mod, but unfortunately the link is down

I have also seen that you had a 30-km environment mod planned. Did you make any progress with it?

A set of optional long-range environment mods especially developped for this mod would be a cool addition to it, but I am afraid their settings are a bit tricky

Originally Posted by MLF

The range of La Plate is 8 Miles (13km) - modern chart in screenshot shows characteristic as:
A group of 9 very quick flashes over a 10 second period, 19m high (as you said gap) with a range of 8 Miles (13km)

I have followed an empirical method in order to calculate (more or less) the equivalent range of 8 miles in the SHIII world.

What I have done, is plotting that 8-nm range on a nautical chart. Radius length on map was calculated based on the length of one degree of latitude/longitude at Raz de Sein's latitude. There are many on-line calculators that you can get this data from; I used the one below:

http://www.csgnetwork.com/degreelenllavcalc.html

The next step was squeezing the nautical chart I was drawing on, so that one minute of latitude was as long as one minute of longitude (as in the SH world). After doing that, La Plate's circular range became an ellipse.

I then measured the length of major and minor axes of this ellipse (real range), and I calculated the radius of the best-fitting SHIII range as the square root of the square of ellipse's semimajor axis plus the square of ellipse's semiminor axis. This is the result after drawing the SHIII radius on map:

 

Legend:
Red ellipse - 'squeezed' real radius
Yellow circle - SHIII radius (calculated for maximizing overlapping over non-overlapping areas)
Orange area - overlapping area between the two ranges

At this point, knowing that in SHIII one minute of latitude/longitude is always equal to 2 km, calculating the desired in-game radius was a simple math. My result is 15,107 metres, with an ecceptable margin of error caused by the approximations used

Originally Posted by MLF

Link to abbreviations and symbols - still searching for 1940's era symbols.

http://www.yachter.fr/shom/html5/sym...ndex.html#56/z

Still looking forward to them

[MLF]

If only all these converters were available when I was at sea

I'll resume the search for chart 5011 symbols mid-september. Off and away now Leave you in peace

Regards,

MLF

[gap]

Originally Posted by MLF

If only all these converters were available when I was at sea

Were you in the navy?

Originally Posted by MLF

I'll resume the search for chart 5011 symbols mid-september. Off and away now Leave you in peace

Enjoy your holidays mate, when you are back you will find us here

[MLF]

Originally Posted by gap

Were you in the navy?



Enjoy your holidays mate, when you are back you will find us here

18 years

Thank you gap.

regards,

MLF

Originally Posted by gap

@ Kendras

I have noticed that Hitman had created a 20-km environment mod, but unfortunately the link is down

I have also seen that you had a 30-km environment mod planned. Did you make any progress with it?

No, I am stuck on this. The sky is always black, and I don't know why ...

I've found a photography showing the aspect of La Vieille lighthouse during the 1930-1940s years.

And if it can help you, there are also drawings with precise measures.

http://mnesys-portail.archives-finis...he_grandpublic

[MLF]

Admiralty Charts of Scottish coasts, 1795-1963



http://maps.nls.uk/coasts/admiralty_charts_list.html

Browsing these gives an idea of chart symbols in use in 1940 on admiralty charts.

Regards,

MLF

[JeromeHeretic]

Originally Posted by gap

@ Kendras

I have noticed that Hitman had created a 20-km environment mod, but unfortunately the link is down

I know, that im answering about a year old post, but im reading this thread from first post...
If you want 20 km environment, install M.E.P. 6 (im not sure, but i think it was in v. 4.2 and later)
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...=229333&page=4

[gap]

Hi guys, sorry for the late replies,

unfortunately Kendras can't answer any longer on this thread since, apparently, an infraction by him was sanctioned with what now seems a permanent ban from subsim. You can get in touch with him on his personal forum:

http://kendras-sh3-modding.forumactif.com/

Since our last update here, we have made little progress with this mod: the Ile-de-Sein was added to the SHIII world (though I think Kendras wasn't too happy with its last layout), new lighthouse icons have been created, and together with several unfinished lighthouse models, I have worked on a port light model that I sent to Kendras for him to add it to the French ports. After that, there was a long stand-by caused by real life engagements.

As some of you already know, I have now started a new project for SH5 which deals mostly with therrain/tree textures, but among its features there are also terrain shape improvements, more realistic ports, and the modelling of natural and human-made landmarks, including daymarks and lighthouses. I am in constant touch with Kendras, and be sure that whatever I do will be passed on to Kendras for porting to SHIII

@ Seaowl:

Glad to read your comments on this thread too!

@ JeromeHeretic:

Thank you for your information mate. I will save it for future reference. In the meanwhile you might find interesting the following website gathering information on lighthouses worldwide:

https://www.ibiblio.org/lighthouse/

[JeromeHeretic]

Registration to forum doesn't work to me. E-mail with code never come...


BTW: Also exist 20km unfficial patch for GWX: ftp://Maik:Woelfe@hartmuthaas.no-ip....phere_Unood.7z


Try it too... Im not sure now, but i have strong feeling, that in one, or in second environment is not changed values for visibility in binoculars and so (it's in zones.cfg i think.. not sure when i try remember now).
So... in case of some problems you can diff this files and get correct one, or just change needed values.


And THX for that link, but i already know it. :-) I have ready list with about 2000 lighthouses (but still there are bugs, i know it and slowly repairing) and written scripts for automatic generating of LND.mis, locations.cfg, SCR.mis. (because script recognition lightouses and lightboats)
I'm only waiting if you both will finish some more lighthouses, so i can generate world with different lighthouses on different places. Now i'm using just one lighthouse and GWX lightboats.


When we are talking about this, i have few ideas, but i don't know how to do it. Sure it is possible, but maybe it is needed for every mutation add new dat file to game, so only some reduced amount of variations is possible to add to game.
But if it is possible, i think it will be enough even in this reduced form.

I was looking to previously posted page: http://www.sailingissues.com/navcourse9.html and i got idea, that i like to have:


- Lighthouse with red light (as a marker to port side of route into the ports)
- I think, that "common" lighthouse used in game can be lighthouse which i have, with normal, long blinking white light.
But on the long coastal lines, where are a lot of lighthouses in some distances i want sometimes some specific lighthouse, from
which i can recognize where exactly i am. I know it already from transatlantic travels, that error of my position after transatlantic route is so big, that even if i find a lighthouse on horizont, im never sure which one it is...
So... idea is have few "morse" blinking lighthouses. I think that 4 "bit" table must be enough for everyone.
So when we look into morse code table, there are this possibilities for lighthouses:
B -...

C -.-.

F ..-.

H ....

L .---

Q --.-

V ...-

X -..-

Y -.--

Z --..
With lighthouse which i already have (lets call him "slow blinker") and when can be speed of blinking changed to quick, we have table of 12 unique lights (+ red one)!


So when i get the markings from that page, we can have FL, Q, MoB, MoC, MoF, MoH, MoL, MoQ, MoV, MoX, MoY, MoZ and Iso R.
Now question for you is, if it is possible? (Im sure just only about changing color of light, even if i don't know how to do it.)

EDIT:
Ah yes, i almost forget. In GWX are tugboats near lightboats. This is not looking much realistic, but it is great idea, because when you go on high TC and watch crew see a ship, TC falls to 1, so you know that you are near that lightboat!
Would be nice, if can be implemented, that watch crew reactions on lighthouse is the same as for ship. (Daesn't matter if crew say "ship spotted", it's not important that lighthouse is not a boat, is important, that i know about it and that TC falls to 1)
Is this possible? (Im afraid not... because it is "land unit", but better ask, than be silent and lost this functionality if it is possible)