LuftWolf and Amizaur's Realism Mod Poll #10: The SLAM-Poon

[LuftWolf]

So you mean the weapon effectiveness of the various missiles and the ranges of the FCR's on the ships which carry them?

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Yeah, a quick temp patch job on that simply shouldn't take more than 90 minutes. Making it perfect is hard, making it better from its current state is ridiculously easy and would still be appreciated.

[LuftWolf]

Just to be sure we are on the same page...

What are the "obvious" ones?

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

Just to be sure we are on the same page...

What are the "obvious" ones?

OK.

0) Set a timer on your desk for 90 minutes (use your digital watch or something). Start.
Note: My timing assumes you use an automated editor like DWEdit.

1) Start by making the SS-N-22 and SS-N-25 Seaskimming - just change the doctrine used here.

2) In fact, make all of Russian SSMs Seaskimming. I thought the altitude set was 50 meters rather than 50 feet, but either way, even the -19 (presumably at least as low as -12), -12 (100 feet), -9 (130 feet) and upgraded -2s (50 feet) are a lot closer to the missile_skim alttitude setting than the missile setting. If you are really dedicated and the game allows it, make a whole bunch of new doctrines with various seaskimming altitudes to simulate different degrees of seaskimming ability. Quickie source and another quickie source here.

3) For extra fun, try turning on ECM for -12s and -19s (a flag). They are supposed to have jammers to improve their chances of making it through (those huge missiles are more like assault drones than missiles from the amount of features they have), and it'd be kind of neat to see how it'd work out, whether the game would even recognize such a thing.

4) Now, head to the SAMs - AAMs can wait. Think the SA-N-6 should only have a 60% effectiveness? If not, change it. Or maybe the SA-N-9 might be good, but it is hard to believe it is 100% effective (making it better than Aster)? Change that too. There aren't that many missile entries - going through the lot of them to check on one number in each should take only 15 minutes.

5) There aren't that many planes. Notice all of them have a radar and FCR SL of 67. Since we are aiming to make it better, not perfect this time, just do a quickie. Since missiles are around "50", set small planes like fighters for 60 and the big ones (bombers) say 70-80.

6) Head to sensors and bring up the radars. Start with the aircraft's search radars. Here is a quickie source you can use for coarse alignment until the time comes for the Big Renovation. Go to the FCRs for the fighters, and understand that they most definitely aren't cutting off at 36km! For today's coarse alignment, just assume tracking range is about 60% of detection, and set the values accordingly.

7) Head to ship FCRs. It is hard to get the right data, but at least ensure that the cutoff is longer than the range of the SAM involved! Specifically, I refer to cases Top Dome, who's hard cutoff is 36km when the database says it has 74km. You might also review cases like the SPG-51, which is used to direct SM-2s (at least earlier versions with range of only 70 or so km). Adjust the FCR range accordingly.

8) Just keep on doing what you can along these lines until the timer beeps.

Thank you very much. Now let's see if anybody appreciates this. I would.

[Molon Labe]

I thought most Russian SSMs where high altitude weapons with a terminal dive manuever.

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by Molon Labe

I thought most Russian SSMs where high altitude weapons with a terminal dive manuever.

Apparently not the ones I mentioned.

Actually, the -12 and -19 do have options for high flying profiles. Typical doctrine says that one flies high as a scout to designate targets for the rest, which fly low. I suppose that they can also be set for "all fly low" or "all fly high" depending on tactical situation.

However, that kind of thing would be hard to implement - just one flying high and all others low, with the low ones knowing to send ONE replacement when the high one gets shot down... certainly more than can be done in 90 minutes or even a week (as far as it can ever be done at all). Probably better overall just to adhere to the majority, and let them all fly low.

The -9 and -2s are medium range weapons and thus don't need anybody to fly high for target updating.

Even the AS-4 eventually received HI-LO and LO-LO variants in the 70s, but I have no idea how low "LO" is. Given these variants are supposed to be of similar vintage to Sandbox, and use a rocket engine with little fear of ingesting water, its flying altitude could have at least matched Sandbox, but I have no idea so would leave it at its present altitude, which is 500 feet (or is it 500 meters?)

[Mau]

Hi everybody!

Yes I would like for sure to help in that field.
(however I would only be able to give a window of ranges and speed ( I am sure you understand what I mean..)

The AS-4 Kitchen for sure will only be launch at high altitude from a long distance. I don't think we should go with the high altitude probe directing the others to a lower altitude.
The AS-4 will be launch at something not lower than 20000 feet. It is not just in the Harpoon database (which is excellent) but as well as per ''RL''.
The AS-4 (as per the SS-N-12 and 19) will and shall be on our SPS-49 from the moment they launch. Believe me.

It should/shall be read 50 feet and not 50 meters. By definition a seaskimmer is 50 feet and less.

Most of the FCRs are 30 + NM capable. That is mainly true for a frigate size equiped with FCRs (i.e. STIRS). For the SPG-51/60 of Destroyers and Cruisers (guiding the SM-2s) we are looking at 100Nm +

Now we have to be careful about the FCRs range and the radar horizon in the game. The Seaskimmers (even with the SPG-51/60) shall be only detecting those ones at something inside (or no more than) 20 NM.
An Aircraft or missile above 1000ft would go to the maximum of the FCR range (I would say to simplify a bit for the doctrine in the game).

The AS-9/11 and pretty much all the AS family are high diver (so some 20 to 40 deg angle of dive). So for those ones we shall see the separation of the missile from the Aircraft on our radar.

For Seaskimmer, the only indication shall be an Aircraft making turn tail and then seeing later appearing something inside 20 Nm. (It is pretty much weel done in Harpoon and Fleet Command.

Hope this help a bit

[LuftWolf]

Don't worry about HOW it could be done... just tell me how it should BE.

Thanks for the information guys, I'm going to shoot to have this done in a day or two, so keep it coming.

(BTW, the radars respect the earth curvatures if we set them to and the game engine already has built in plenty of features to account for different detection ranges against targets with varying radar profiles)

Adding the high diving capability is like adding a whole new class of weapons so that might have to wait, although I can easily make their cruise altitude higher than other missiles, as well as make all the seaskimmers actual seaskimmers.

[LuftWolf]

Still chewing on this one (slowly).

So for LWAMI 3.03 aka The Big Cheat:

1) Finish adding ASuW capability to the SLAM-ER and correct AI P-3 loadout

2) Adjust UUV sensor sensitivity and cavitation profile

3) Adjust FCR's for surface and air platforms.

Anything else you guys want to completely unbalance the game and promote cheap, underhanded playing styles, with plenty of shady loopholes for cheaters?

Sorry, I just think its funny as f--k.

[Driftwood]

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

Anything else you guys want to completely unbalance the game and promote cheap, underhanded playing styles, with plenty of shady loopholes for cheaters?

Yea, a cup holder in the Con of my Seawolf.....for my depth charge ration(s) :rotfl:

You are greatly appreciated my friend!

[LuftWolf]

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

Still chewing on this one (slowly).

So for LWAMI 3.03 aka The Big Cheat:

1) Finish adding ASuW capability to the SLAM-ER and correct AI P-3 loadout

2) Adjust UUV sensor sensitivity and cavitation profile

3) Adjust FCR's for surface and air platforms.

4) Good news for you guys, the Advanced Torpedo Control Mod will be added for LWAMI 3.03.

http://www.subsim.com/phpBB/viewtopi...=48430&start=0

[TLAM Strike]

Any update on the RBUs? Since reading Dangerous Ground I want working ones more!

[LuftWolf]

The RBU's have to be completely rebuilt from the ground up, including scripting a doctrine from scratch.

It's a lot of work, but not TOO much work... I'll look at it. Technically that would fall into the same lot as the UAV and the DSRV... things that are more or less completely broken and have to done all over, but not exactly crucial gameplay aspects.

I'll probably do those as a group along with adding some neat new weapons like the CAPTOR mine for the P-3 to replace the 1000lbs mine, since they are all sizeable projects.