Escort see me without pinging

[Kielhauler1961]

Originally Posted by allievo

Keep in mind that from '42/43 the chances were against the U-boats so historically it's completely accurate being detected and sunk by escorts no matter what you do. In the late war returning to base is considered a success and should be rewarded with the Knight Cross.

I'd go further and suggest that anyone willingly leaving port after 1942 needs to have their head examined.

I only do it because Doenitz knows where I live. The escort vessel follows us out to make sure we leave...

KH

[u crank]

Originally Posted by Kielhauler1961

I only do it because Doenitz knows where I live. The escort vessel follows us out to make sure we leave...

Very good.

[aya]

I play starting at 1939 (now on Jan 1940) and here's my bit of advise....

One. Avoid engagements in shallow water! That includes the English Channel and the North Sea. There are times you can't dive below 50 metres and you risk scraping your boat on the seabed. That way, you won't get locked on by a Destroyer, ensuing a bloody surface battle or a psychological (and deadly) game of sub vs depth charges. Do it on the Atlantic where you have 100+ metres of deep water to work with.

Two. I've learned this one when I went against a convoy at night. I fired a complete salvo of torpedoes (4 against a very large merchant and 2 stern against another boat behind me). I was in the middle of them all with destroyers actively searching. As soon as I fired all of them, I dived to 100 m at flanking speed and headed the opposite direction. As expected, the escorts followed me and they started depth charging me. I ran silent, dived deeper to 160 m, altering on flanking speed and 1 kts depending on the situation. 20 kabooms later and after going into another direction, I've successfully lost them without damage.

Moral. Depth is the key.

And oh, poke your periscope when you're not moving - it creates a wake that can be seen on clear waters. I retract it when I need to correct my positioning.

[RussaX37]

Originally Posted by aya

I play starting at 1939 (now on Jan 1940) and here's my bit of advise....

One. Avoid engagements in shallow water! That includes the English Channel and the North Sea. There are times you can't dive below 50 metres and you risk scraping your boat on the seabed. That way, you won't get locked on by a Destroyer, ensuing a bloody surface battle or a psychological (and deadly) game of sub vs depth charges. Do it on the Atlantic where you have 100+ metres of deep water to work with.

Two. I've learned this one when I went against a convoy at night. I fired a complete salvo of torpedoes (4 against a very large merchant and 2 stern against another boat behind me). I was in the middle of them all with destroyers actively searching. As soon as I fired all of them, I dived to 100 m at flanking speed and headed the opposite direction. As expected, the escorts followed me and they started depth charging me. I ran silent, dived deeper to 160 m, altering on flanking speed and 1 kts depending on the situation. 20 kabooms later and after going into another direction, I've successfully lost them without damage.

Moral. Depth is the key.

And oh, poke your periscope when you're not moving - it creates a wake that can be seen on clear waters. I retract it when I need to correct my positioning.

this things are very good known. but for periscope I dont use it a lot I'm basing on hydrophone so periscope for me is only to find interesting targets and after to select them when firing torpedo but also I'm using periscope at very low height that mean I dont see whole time because of waves so this helps a lot. so they ofthen never see my periscope but for engaging my targets in convoy and escape I'm using different techinq

[Paulebaer1979]

Originally Posted by RussaX37

this things are very good known. but for periscope I dont use it a lot I'm basing on hydrophone so periscope for me is only to find interesting targets and after to select them when firing torpedo but also I'm using periscope at very low height that mean I dont see whole time because of waves so this helps a lot. so they ofthen never see my periscope but for engaging my targets in convoy and escape I'm using different techinq

This is a very good idea. But as i know, within GWX the visible height for the peri is 0 cm. That means, that anyone can see your peri when it´s higher than 1cm above the water. LSH and CcoM changed this to 15 or 20 cm.

The other aspect is your noice. If you not running in absolute silent mode (Schleichfahrt) and with very low speed the escorts can hear you without pinging. In some mods you can see it on nav map - there is a half circle in front of some destroyers. Inside they are able to listen for your sub.

In real live it´s very difficult to find a peri if the sub below drives less than 4kn. I had often the chance to try it out, when i was in the german navy. In these cases i did know the area the sub was inside - i only found the peri in two of ten times. The commander of the sub did use his peri only fpr 20 seconds and lowers it than.

[RussaX37]

Originally Posted by Paulebaer1979

This is a very good idea. But as i know, within GWX the visible height for the peri is 0 cm. That means, that anyone can see your peri when it´s higher than 1cm above the water. LSH and CcoM changed this to 15 or 20 cm.

The other aspect is your noice. If you not running in absolute silent mode (Schleichfahrt) and with very low speed the escorts can hear you without pinging. In some mods you can see it on nav map - there is a half circle in front of some destroyers. Inside they are able to listen for your sub.

In real live it´s very difficult to find a peri if the sub below drives less than 4kn. I had often the chance to try it out, when i was in the german navy. In these cases i did know the area the sub was inside - i only found the peri in two of ten times. The commander of the sub did use his peri only fpr 20 seconds and lowers it than.

Point is to stay undetected with silent running and clever manevours. Also while engaging more then 1 target at the same time priority is to try hit both targets at the same time giving other target no chance to defensive manevour

Exactly point is to use periscope as short as possible when enemy is closer then 4-3km.
It is hard to find but you need to take that there is not only 1 person who is watching for submarines and periscope.

Look at this one sonar escape

[Paulebaer1979]

Originally Posted by RussaX37

Exactly point is to use periscope as short as possible when enemy is closer then 4-3km.
It is hard to find but you need to take that there is not only 1 person who is watching for submarines and periscope.

I had a very good navy-glass (Zeiss) when searching the peri and the sub was in a circle with maximum 2km. 20% is a very well result in this case. The periscopes in the old days were a little bit smaller then now. So in the past the peris were very hard to see if the commander used it quickly.

In the game they start to search for the sub, if they get any reason. If you don´t show your peri or conning tower they do not search you until the first torp hits a target - or someone with passive sonar is able to hear your sub. That´s it. In 9 of 10 cases i´m able to go inside a konvoy with my sub until 1942 (VII or IX). Later it´s nearly impossible. I play LSH5.1 at 82% realism.