Ex-LAPD policeman surrounded in cabin in Big Bear, CA

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

So should we do away with the laws? That would be pretty silly.

Laws exist to allow society to punish bad acts. If laws prevented criminal acts then "Thou shall not steal" would have ended theft.

Outlawing something does not prevent someone from doing or possessing it, it only allows society to punish that person.

Preventing said person from doing or possessing something bad for society in the first place is the responsibility of society; first to indoctrinate the individual on the societal norms they are expected to uphold and second to warn society if an individual poses a danger to said society. It is in the second stage that legislation takes effect allowing society to deal with a wrongdoer.

Now implementing new laws to prevent something that old laws failed to prevent is well... whats the definition of insanity? Doing something over and over again expecting a different result. It does not seem sufficient for some to have for example murder outlawed they must outlaw everything remotely connected to the act, or conversely one single item connected to it. Such thinking does not address the problem of what caused the murder to occur in the first place.

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike

Laws exist to allow society to punish bad acts. If laws prevented criminal acts then "Thou shall not steal" would have ended theft.

Outlawing something does not prevent someone from doing or possessing it, it only allows society to punish that person.

Preventing said person from doing or possessing something bad for society in the first place is the responsibility of society; first to indoctrinate the individual on the societal norms they are expected to uphold and second to warn society if an individual poses a danger to said society. It is in the second stage that legislation takes effect allowing society to deal with a wrongdoer.

Now implementing new laws to prevent something that old laws failed to prevent is well... whats the definition of insanity? Doing something over and over again expecting a different result. It does not seem sufficient for some to have for example murder outlawed they must outlaw everything remotely connected to the act, or conversely one single item connected to it. Such thinking does not address the problem of what caused the murder to occur in the first place.

Okay, so you are now backing away from your original concept that opposition to X is responsible for the cause of X. This is a good thing, because that statement was completely indefensible. I suspect that you started to see that after you posted it.

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

Okay, so you are now backing away from your original concept that opposition to X is responsible for the cause of X. This is a good thing, because that statement was completely indefensible. I suspect that you started to see that after you posted it.

I think you misunderstood what I said. I never said that opposition to gun violence causes gun violence, what I said was support of gun control caused gun violence; at least in this case. That would be a X causes Y situation.

In the case of Chris Dorner we have a man who couldn't control his temper over being fired from the LAPD (over a case of using excessive force), latching on to an idea that assault weapons are bad. An idea that has filled the media in recent weeks, along with the constant media coverage and indeed glorification of those who commit murders with firearms.

We have society that does not condone violence while we have a media that makes famous those who do commit violence. For a disturbed individual such mixed messages are dangerous, especially if they see themselves as betrayed by society or somehow better than it.

[Armistead]

Much of what happens in the media is politically motivated, such is the case with guns. It will be interesting to see if Dorner used the gun control theme, knowing it would help give him a good guy image to many. It's shocking how the liberal media hates guns, but glossing this guy over.
This is how we create copycat Killers.