Motorcycle Helmets Save Lives? Who'da thunk?

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by McBeck

I agree that adults have the experience to make the choice for themselves.

However, you are also rolemodels.
Imagine that its your own son who has the choice and half the adults do not wear helmets. Wouldn't you wish that all bikers wore helmets?

I do wish that all bikers wore helmets. I also wish that all drivers wore seatbelts. That doesn't give me the right to force them to.

I also agree about the "role models" part. But parents have always said "Do as I say, not as I do", and always will. The line has to be drawn somewhere. The problem is that there are many lines, and very few people can agree on where any of them should be.

[McBeck]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

I also agree about the "role models" part. But parents have always said "Do as I say, not as I do", and always will.

If that will not change, then we will not learn.
Kids are imitating us and we have to set the bar high, so they also do so.
The whole "Do as I say, not as I do" is just another way of not taking responsibility for your job as parrent.

i dont get it, how can a law that protects the safety the general public who drives motorcycles impair the freedom of choice?

you can not interpretate your rights to the extreme, its like saying a speed limit near a school impaires your freedom of choice.

freedom of choice is about being able to plan your life as an individual

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by nonverba

i dont get it, how can a law that protects the safety the general public who drives motorcycles impair the freedom of choice?

you can not interpretate your rights to the extreme, its like saying a speed limit near a school impaires your freedom of choice.

freedom of choice is about being able to plan your life as an individual

Totally wrong. We make laws to protect ourselves from each other. The school speed limits protects our children from other drivers. The helmet law attempts to protect us from ourselves. You're right: Where freedom is concerned, you don't get it.

You also don't understand rights. I have the right to do anything I want, as long is it doesn't infringe anyone else's right to do the same.

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

Totally wrong. We make laws to protect ourselves from each other. The school speed limits protects our children from other drivers. The helmet law attempts to protect us from ourselves. You're right: Where freedom is concerned, you don't get it.

You also don't understand rights. I have the right to do anything I want, as long is it doesn't infringe anyone else's right to do the same.

when you read my post again , and compare to yours i say exact the same thing. My language is not english , so the sentence may not be as fluid but it implies the same thing. try to read and understand the meaning of a sentence before attacking people

ow yeah , you talk about how you are "forced" in an earlier post. Lawmaking bodys in states have that authority in a democrasy. As long as certain basic principles are folowed. these principles protect us ,but we have to give up some freedom. that is called the "social contract" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_contract


also i live in western europe, not the uk. We have continental law, where us and commonwealth have the common law system. There are some differences, but the basis is the same.

[Sailor Steve]

I guess I'm still not understanding. Do you think helmet laws are good; that people should be forced to wear helmets?

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

I guess I'm still not understanding. Do you think helmet laws are good; that people should be forced to wear helmets?

jes i think that law is good.

You are a grandpa, someone with life experience and wisdom. So you must understand that the lawmakers do not intend to attack your freedom of choice, but to protect the general public. you included. and that goal (general publics healt)"outdoes" your individual choice, as described in the social contract.

so why do you feel forced?Maybe you are thinking " yeah but first helmets and what else is next!"

and you are right , a lawmaking body can abuse his authority. But then the other powers come in play to control that power who abuses his authority. This is the idea behind "the trias politica" or separation of power. For example in the US you have the impeachement procedure.

so in the end we do give up a tiny bit of freedom in general, but we get a liveable society in return. That is the idea of the social contract.

i must add that my knowledge of common law is more restricted then continental law, but i do know the basics are in every western country the same,common or continental law.