Israel...Have the stakes just increased?

[Ducimus]

Originally Posted by JU_88

I know your heartless sometiem Ducimus But really how can you not care about several million human beings including woman and children being incerated alive in a matter of seconds? what was their crime exactly, not have the same values and beliefs as our own?
Its genocide mate, its the same thing hitler did, there is no justification.
Our own lives and well being are no more or less valuable than theirs mate.

For me it's easy. Firstly, im very good at compartmentalizing emotions. I learned that in the military, and got very good at it. Secondly, Iran to me, is just some scathole thousands of miles away that I'll (thankfully) never see. As the saying goes, "Out of sight, out of mind". Thirdly, last i heard, Iran is the country where the national past time is to shout "Death to America", and use the US flag as a foot mat. Combine that with above two points, and i find myself a bit strained to care about the idea of a nuked Iran.

[JU_88]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

For me it's easy. Firstly, im very good at compartmentalizing emotions. I learned that in the military, and got very good at it. Secondly, Iran to me, is just some scathole thousands of miles away that I'll (thankfully) never see. As the saying goes, "Out of sight, out of mind". Thirdly, last i heard, Iran is the country where the national past time is to shout "Death to America", and use the US flag as a foot mat. Combine that with above two points, and i find myself a bit strained to care about the idea of a nuked Iran.

To say that I find that type of mentality both disturbing and slighlty ignorant is an understatment, but the fact is that half the planet (or maybe more) has the same mindset as your own.
But then again you probably think I am bleeding heart liberal hippy with no spine.
Who am I to tell you that my set of morals are superior to your own?
So on that note we can agree to disagree I guess

[Ducimus]

Originally Posted by JU_88

To say that I find that type of mentality both disturbing and slighlty ignorant is an understatment,

You don't know my whole personal picture. Though I can understand if you find emotional compartmentalization disturbing. Ive questioned it myself many times.

but the fact is that half the planet (or maybe more) has the same mindset as your own.

That's people for you. An individual is smart, but People are dumb. That and in this day and age, i find myself only concerned about the well being and livelyhood of my own home, and not someone else's home. In this context, "home" meaning "Country." I live in the US, I don't live in Iran. Iranian problems are not, or should not be, my concern.

But then again you probably think I am bleeding heart liberal hippy with no spine.

Honestly, you strike me more as a benevolent humanist. There are some people in this world, who have not let malacious things in the world effect them or jade their spirits. I am not one of those types of people.

Who am I to tell you that my set of morals are superior to your own?

You have no idea how often ive pondered that subject. Nobody goes to war thinking their the bad guy. Not even the germans during WW2. Is there really a good guy? Is there really a bad guy? Who makes that determination, and by who's standards do they use to arrive at that determination? What makes those standards more correct then anothers?

I answered that dilemma for myself years ago. Right or as wrong it may be, ones country is ones home. Good or bad, for better for worse, its still home. You have to make a stand in this world somewhere, and home is always worth defending. Everything else is bunch of horsecrap.

[JU_88]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

You have no idea how often ive pondered that subject. Nobody goes to war thinking their the bad guy. Not even the germans during WW2. Is there really a good guy? Is there really a bad guy? Who makes that determination, and by who's standards do they use to arrive at that determination? What makes those standards more correct then anothers?

I answered that dilemma for myself years ago. Right or as wrong it may be, ones country is ones home. Good or bad, for better for worse, its still home. You have to make a stand in this world somewhere, and home is always worth defending. Everything else is bunch of horsecrap.

Very well said

[CCIP]

Can't condemn you for being pragmatic Ducimius. But - it does get a lot more difficult if you've ever known, worked with or became friends with actual people from Iran, as I have. They very often give me the same impression as the late Soviet era Eastern European intellectuals that I grew up among - no love for their regime, keenly aware of what's happening, and really, really good at passive resistance to a point where it doesn't put them or their families in jail (usually). However the regime is just too strong for them to get rid of - for now.
Their state may like yelling 'death to America', but there are many people who couldn't be any more opposed to the official stance. Just that their voices are easily silenced.

So if you know actual Persians/Iranians, it gets a lot more difficult to compartmentalize. Nor do I think it's fair to ignore the real human tragedy that'll happen as a result.

I think at this stage, it's not too late to avert the worst-case scenario anyway. Iran, like the Soviet system back in the 80s, may look strong on the outside but is in fact pretty rotten. Playing the right cards can - and should - result in its inevitable collapse. We're not at war yet. So it's not yet time to compartmentalize while we have time.