US should stay out of land wars: Defense Secretary Robert Gates

[yubba]

The United States need's too stay out of wars until we learn how to fight one, WW 2 didn't last this long.

[MH]

Originally Posted by yubba

The United States need's too stay out of wars until we learn how to fight one, WW 2 didn't last this long.

US knows how to fight.
It just confuzed about the objectives.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by MH

US knows how to fight.
It just confuzed about the objectives.

It's about having weak leaders on the civillian side.Fighting wars "half assed" does not work.Iraq was bumbled because they went in light for a "shock and awe" Afghanistan has been mismanaged as well.Going in light rarely, if ever, works.

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

It's about having weak leaders on the civillian side.Fighting wars "half assed" does not work.Iraq was bumbled because they went in light for a "shock and awe" Afghanistan has been mismanaged as well.Going in light rarely, if ever, works.

I would answer with 2 questions:

1. What leader in the past 40 years would you consider 'strong'?

2. Having answered that, when in the last 40 years has America's foreign policy in the Middle East been successful in promoting our ends of our national security?

The answer to question one can and will be skewed towards political preference, but the answer to question two is an unequivocal 'never'. 'Nation building' is a fool's errand, strongman or not.

[Castout]

So is he saying Iraq is a mistake [but a worthy mistake while Afghanistan is not a worthy one]?

Is there any irrefutable proof that Osama Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda was directly behind 9/11?

I mean Gaddafi is also saying AL-Qaeda to be responsible with the uprising in his country.

Or that wikileaks a terrorist organization? Terrorism is a convenient excuse these days huh?!

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by Castout

Is there any irrefutable proof that Osama Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda was directly behind 9/11?

Yes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plannin...ber_11_attacks

[Castout]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

Yes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plannin...ber_11_attacks

Umm nice story but it's still a story until proven in court of law.

So who have been charged for conceiving, planning, funding, plotting and carrying out 9/11?

I'm just saying that reaction to 9/11 may have been blown out of proportion and without any real sense of direction and goal. More than 9 years and 2 wars later Osama Bin Laden whereabout is never clear and Al-Qaeda remains mostly spoken about instead seen.

Now I just hope the implication of these 2 wars would not reduce US capability to project and commit to war when war MUST be fought. Otherwise if I were Osama I'd say now is the time for another big attack or some belligerent nation to gamble on the notion that US is so hesitant to commit a new war. But ultimately I must admit each nation in the end is fully responsible and must be capable of defending its own country without outside help. I'm referring to South Korea and the probability of escalated tension from the part of North Korea.

[gimpy117]

Originally Posted by yubba

The United States need's too stay out of wars until we learn how to fight one, WW 2 didn't last this long.

we need to stay out of gurella wars you mean. were not set up to fight those kind of wars. our military is designed to fight the Russians on the open plains of Europe.

But we need to stay out of wars that don't involve us. Afghanistan was one thing...but why was saddam our problem? a little fat checking would have shown all those "WMD's" were just made up illusions.

[goldorak]

Originally Posted by yubba

The United States need's too stay out of wars until we learn how to fight one, WW 2 didn't last this long.

Charles de Gaulle once said : "You may be sure that the Americans will commit all the stupidities they can think of, plus some that are beyond imagination"

The truth is somewhere in between or maybe not.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by goldorak

Charles de Gaulle once said : "You may be sure that the Americans will commit all the stupidities they can think of, plus some that are beyond imagination"

The truth is somewhere in between or maybe not.

That coming from a French General....who would have never marched in Paris again if not(in large part, not forgetting other Allies who saved France) for Americans.Unwarranted arrogance by the French, typical.

What is the first thing they teach new recruits in the French Army? How to say "I surrender" in German.(old one, but a good one)

[stabiz]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

That coming from a French General....who would have never marched in Paris again if not(in large part, not forgetting other Allies who saved France) for Americans.Unwarranted arrogance by the French, typical.

What is the first thing they teach new recruits in the French Army? How to say "I surrender" in German.(old one, but a good one)

Meh, historically the French have the right to be arrogant. You dont have to be a history buff to know the French can fight.

[goldorak]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

That coming from a French General....who would have never marched in Paris again if not(in large part, not forgetting other Allies who saved France) for Americans.Unwarranted arrogance by the French, typical.

What is the first thing they teach new recruits in the French Army? How to say "I surrender" in German.(old one, but a good one)

You know what the french say : we love to hate americans. Its a love hate kind of relationship.
Maybe its because we are so similar at a deep level.
And for the record, were it not for french troups, you would still be a british colony. But I suppose the first thing you americans learn in school is that you gained the independence all by yourselves.

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by goldorak

But I suppose the first thing you americans learn in school is that you gained the independence all by yourselves.

Generally, yes, that is what is taught in US schools, at least superficially. And as you said, the truth is, shall we say, far more complicated.

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by goldorak

And for the record, were it not for french troups, you would still be a british colony. But I suppose the first thing you americans learn in school is that you gained the independence all by yourselves.

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

Generally, yes, that is what is taught in US schools, at least superficially. And as you said, the truth is, shall we say, far more complicated.

And don't forget Cuba/Spain. They also helped us in the revolutionary war.

We had a lotta help.

[krashkart]

I think de Gaulle was predicting that the US would make many (if not all) of the same mistakes that great empires tend to make. And he was right.