Defence departments love it: 92,000 documents on Afghanistan operations leaked

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by August

Yeah ok. Like any government ever has provided a higher level of access to ongoing military operations than the US has.

And that's because the people always pressed for it. It would not continue if every person simply blindfaiths into the military propaganda.

Perhaps you define "selfish" as not wanting to risk the lives of our soldiers as well as those who are working with us by giving our enemy detailed insight into our day to day operations.

No that's altruistic. What's strange is how you can only think about such motives when it comes to the US military, while for its critics you can only come up with selfish ones.

As for half-assed editing, again, they are having a much higher hit rate on these 92000 documents than the US military.

If you want to say that given that it is impossible to guarantee perfection, and given the high consequences of an error, it would be better to withold the information, that's at least a defensible, if tactical position. To say that they are incompetent for failing to meet an impossible standard isn't.

[August]

Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II

As for half-assed editing, again, they are having a much higher hit rate on these 92000 documents than the US military.

What do you mean "higher hit rate"? The US Military is not deliberately releasing this information, the media is. These documents were stolen by a traitor who i hope they hang for his betrayal and your darlings in the international media are publishing it where our enemies can read it for no other reason than to make a profit.

So you can defend the media all you want but doesn't change the fact that they are amateurs playing with peoples lives for money and they are aiding the very people we're trying to defeat.

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by August

What do you mean "higher hit rate"? The US Military is not deliberately releasing this information, the media is.

In a society that is supposedly democratic and respectful of free speech ... etc, the default state of all information, certainly all of potential public interest is Free-flow, and the decision to stop and keep stopping something of potential public interest from being released is in itself a proactive decision which can be judged on its merits.

One can even go as far as to say that all Wikileaks is doing is liberating 76,000 documents (out of 92,000) to their natural state in democratic, open, free-speech loving America, a set of decisions that was overwhelmingly correct. Yes, it is possible a few informers might get revealed and popped - that's a possibility I took into account from the beginning.

After all, it is not like American PGMs have never inflicted collateral damage and casualties, but no one (at least of your political orientation) says the bombs are a mistake - it is accepted as a reasonable cost.

Now, I'm not such an idealist as to think that the parties involved in this release are entirely altruistic, but neither am I so politically indoctrinated (maybe it helps here I'm not American) as to think that the American generals and politicians are keeping data classified for purely altruistic or even operational (in the military sense) motives.

[August]

Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II

Yes, it is possible a few informers might get revealed and popped - that's a possibility I took into account from the beginning.

So the bottom line is you hardly care if a few people and their families get killed. You even attempt to marginalize them by calling them "informers". Heck you should have just swung for the fences and called them "collaborators" or even go old school and call them "Quislings".

Let me clue you in on something dude. The "default state" of classified military intelligence reports is just that, classified. You, Assange. Manning, or the NYT do not have a right to decide which of it is ok to give to our enemies.

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by August

So the bottom line is you hardly care if a few people and their families get killed. You even attempt to marginalize them by calling them "informers". Heck you should have just swung for the fences and called them "collaborators" or even go old school and call them "Quislings".

If you twist my words like that, by analogy, when the US bombs people, they don't care if a few people get killed, since as we all know precision-guided bombs are not perfectly reliable, as are the intelligence used to target them.

Let me clue you in on something dude. The "default state" of classified military intelligence reports is just that, classified. You, Assange. Manning, or the NYT do not have a right to decide which of it is ok to give to our enemies.

Wrong. The default state of information in the military is unclassified. Then someone places a Classified stamp on it. Don't confuse the sequence of events.

Now, here's a question for you: If this whole story had involved the operational details of another country, say perhaps it was 92,000 reports of Russian activities in Chechenya, would you be saying good job to whoever leaked it?

[antikristuseke]

I am more inclined to agree with August on this one, the default state of information in the military is classified.

[August]

Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II

Wrong. The default state of information in the military is unclassified. Then someone places a Classified stamp on it. Don't confuse the sequence of events.

No, it's you who is wrong. An Intelligence Report, which is what we're talking about, is classified from the moment that the writer puts pen to paper. All notes and material associated with the report, every picture, every draft, unfinished, incomplete, spelled wrong, or whatever has to be handled according to regulations governing classified information.

Now, here's a question for you: If this whole story had involved the operational details of another country, say perhaps it was 92,000 reports of Russian activities in Chechenya, would you be saying good job to whoever leaked it?

No I wouldn't. Would you feel the lives of some poor village headman and his family are worth having a few more details to things you already knew?

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by August

So you can defend the media all you want but doesn't change the fact that they are amateurs playing with peoples lives for money

Strange that by their record in Afghanistan I think exactly the same way about the political leadership, yours and ours, Bush's and Obama's, Schroeder's and Merkel's - just that often they do not even do it for money anymore, but home-located political power- and party-interest.

As long as the war keeps running, the debate on whether or not it was worth it, and who was responisble for what, will run very muted, at best. And that is the reason why some want to run the war forever, no matter it's lacking perspectives. Troops risk their lives for preventing this debate. They should not wear their nation's emblems, but symbols and colours of the political parties at home.

[August]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Strange that by their record in Afghanistan I think exactly the same way about the political leadership, yours and ours, Bush's and Obama's, Schroeder's and Merkel's - just that often they do not even do it for money anymore, but home-located political power- and party-interest.

I do not necessarily disagree with any of that Skybird. The point I am trying to make is that putting sensitive classified information in the hands of yet another group of incompetents, especially ones who have even less concern for the peoples whose lives they are risking than your average politician is not helping anyone but our enemies.

You even attempt to marginalize them by calling them "informers".

Can you think of another word?
Informant would be the one used by the bodies involved and it means informer.
So how is it attempting to marginalize when he is using the very word the politicians and military have been using?

[heartc]

Nice to see all the "peace lovers" having no problems with families getting butchered now. Shows their true face, if there was any doubt in the first place. They are no peace lovers - they are either closet commies / nazis or Islamist sympathizers, rooting for the downfall of our system and way of life, because they themselves can't deal with it and need some sicko pseudo political apparition / leader. They care about peace and lives no more than Stalin did.

[Skybird]

Herr Assange

Mr. Assange. He was born in Australia and he is of Australian nationality.