The cartoon "Polygon"

[CCIP]

Originally Posted by Happy Times

My personal observations.

You can never fully understand them if you dont learn the language and live there.

You can try by reading their history especially from the time and end of the Mongol rule.
They are fatalistic and it seems to come from very tough times endured.

Individual Russians are usually very warm and welcoming persons.
But to be true friends with them is usually not so easy and they have a small but very loyal inner circle.
They really only trust these people.

Its when they are addressed as a nation or a group they are often a pain in the butt.
They have a practical sense about violence and war that conflicts with the western view.

They are often very curious about the outside world and its views towards them.
They are usually very proud of being Russian but still periodically have low esteem about themselfs.

All this combined explains a lot of the fatalistic attitude, dark humor and acceptance for authoritarian rule by small cliques.

As a Russian myself, I would have to say that's an extremely accurate general description. You definitely have a good understanding of the culture in this regard.

Otherwise as far as former republics, look, it's not the Russians that have to apologize. It's their unelected and oppressive leaders. While I completely understand that the republics and other countries of the "near abroad" have definitely been wronged and were relatively worse off under Soviet pressure/rule than independently, I disagree that they got the short end of the stick. If anyone did, it was almost always the Russians themselves. In fact day-to-day conditions in republics, from what I know, were better than the Russian SSR itself (and I know this from having relatives in Estonia myself) for most of Soviet rule. But again, perhaps Russians just had less to miss as far as freedom and prosperity goes...

That said, I'm personally sorry that it had to be that way. I wish those mistreated by Soviet authorities, however, would stop projecting their anger and disdain onto today's Russians (and at least to some extent today's Russian state, although it does deserve a fair amount of skepticism). Most of those complicit in the injustices of those days are dead or at least retired now. And I really wish that the new generation of Russians grows up without the impression that the rest of the world hates them for wrongs that they as individuals never really had a part in.

And that is a really great animation, by the way. Very original visual style, thoughtful (if indeed very glum) concept.

[Susexx]

Originally Posted by CCIP

As a Russian myself, I would have to say that's an extremely accurate general description. You definitely have a good understanding of the culture in this regard.

Otherwise as far as former republics, look, it's not the Russians that have to apologize. It's their unelected and oppressive leaders. While I completely understand that the republics and other countries of the "near abroad" have definitely been wronged and were relatively worse off under Soviet pressure/rule than independently, I disagree that they got the short end of the stick. If anyone did, it was almost always the Russians themselves. In fact day-to-day conditions in republics, from what I know, were better than the Russian SSR itself (and I know this from having relatives in Estonia myself) for most of Soviet rule. But again, perhaps Russians just had less to miss as far as freedom and prosperity goes...

That said, I'm personally sorry that it had to be that way. I wish those mistreated by Soviet authorities, however, would stop projecting their anger and disdain onto today's Russians (and at least to some extent today's Russian state, although it does deserve a fair amount of skepticism).

And that is a really great animation, by the way. Very original visual style, thoughtful (if indeed very glum) concept.

It agree completely.

[Happy Times]

Originally Posted by CCIP

As a Russian myself, I would have to say that's an extremely accurate general description. You definitely have a good understanding of the culture in this regard.

Otherwise as far as former republics, look, it's not the Russians that have to apologize. It's their unelected and oppressive leaders. While I completely understand that the republics and other countries of the "near abroad" have definitely been wronged and were relatively worse off under Soviet pressure/rule than independently, I disagree that they got the short end of the stick. If anyone did, it was almost always the Russians themselves. In fact day-to-day conditions in republics, from what I know, were better than the Russian SSR itself (and I know this from having relatives in Estonia myself) for most of Soviet rule. But again, perhaps Russians just had less to miss as far as freedom and prosperity goes...

That said, I'm personally sorry that it had to be that way. I wish those mistreated by Soviet authorities, however, would stop projecting their anger and disdain onto today's Russians (and at least to some extent today's Russian state, although it does deserve a fair amount of skepticism). Most of those complicit in the injustices of those days are dead or at least retired now. And I really wish that the new generation of Russians grows up without the impression that the rest of the world hates them for wrongs that they as individuals never really had a part in.

And that is a really great animation, by the way. Very original visual style, thoughtful (if indeed very glum) concept.

Thank you and in principal i agree, my beef is with the version of history promoted in Russia.

It is dualistic like many other things in Russia.
Government can condemn and promote Stalins time for example.
Russians desire to be excepted as European but at the same time want to hold that they are something different.

To me Russia is an matryoshka doll, enigma within enigma.
Often i understand some events or reactions after they have happened when i get past the Finnish mindset.

[UnderseaLcpl]

Thank you all for the interesting perspectives.

I have to admit, the Soviet Union still sounds like a living hell to me, but it's nice to get some perspective on the quality of life there. The only perspective I have comes from my Ukranian stepmother, who alternates between loving and hating the Soviet Union. When she has to pay for a doctor's appointment she loves the Union. When she goes to Wal-Mart she hates it.

As interesting as these perspectives are, I think I'm more comfortable with my Western lifestyle and mindset; "Better dead, than Red"

[antikristuseke]

Originally Posted by CCIP

As a Russian myself, I would have to say that's an extremely accurate general description. You definitely have a good understanding of the culture in this regard.

Otherwise as far as former republics, look, it's not the Russians that have to apologize. It's their unelected and oppressive leaders. While I completely understand that the republics and other countries of the "near abroad" have definitely been wronged and were relatively worse off under Soviet pressure/rule than independently, I disagree that they got the short end of the stick. If anyone did, it was almost always the Russians themselves. In fact day-to-day conditions in republics, from what I know, were better than the Russian SSR itself (and I know this from having relatives in Estonia myself) for most of Soviet rule. But again, perhaps Russians just had less to miss as far as freedom and prosperity goes...

That said, I'm personally sorry that it had to be that way. I wish those mistreated by Soviet authorities, however, would stop projecting their anger and disdain onto today's Russians (and at least to some extent today's Russian state, although it does deserve a fair amount of skepticism). Most of those complicit in the injustices of those days are dead or at least retired now. And I really wish that the new generation of Russians grows up without the impression that the rest of the world hates them for wrongs that they as individuals never really had a part in.

And that is a really great animation, by the way. Very original visual style, thoughtful (if indeed very glum) concept.

Dont´'t disagree with anything you have said here.

But I do project some disdain towards Russians here in Estonia who flat out refuse to learn the language, but still demand citizenship and other assorted problems from that contingent of people.

[CCIP]

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

Dont´'t disagree with anything you have said here.

But I do project some disdain towards Russians here in Estonia who flat out refuse to learn the language, but still demand citizenship and other assorted problems from that contingent of people.

Totally understandable. While I think many Russians are treated kind of unfairly in the Baltic just because they're Russian, I think some of the habits have to change. Russians have plenty to learn of good civic habits there anyway - I just wish both sides would tone down the nationalism a little. When I went to Estonia in the early 90s, it really struck me how much more civil, clean and quiet the place seemed than neighbouring Russia. Those things are worth protecting from too much Russian influence than national identity as such, I think.

I have a lot of relatives in Estonia (ironically, they're more German and Swedish by blood than Russian) and most of them, I would say, are doing pretty well. They're not stuck on national identity and are active members of their communities instead. I wish everyone could just do that.

[antikristuseke]

Agreed, rabbid nationalism does noone any good.