[QUE] Boycott / mass dynamic things not allowed?

[urfisch]

Originally Posted by Webster

because it is seen as being promoted by subsim if it is allowed to be done here.

its guilt by association thing so we must remain objective and not seen to promote a protest


im sure neal with speak better on this then i can because i am not as well spoken

but if you cut these opinions off, you seem to promote the other side...thought about that?

thin line...

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by urfisch

but if you cut these opinions off, you seem to promote the other side...thought about that?

thin line...

I dont know "Subsims" official position on the matter of Silent Hunter 5, but if it were up to me to come up with an official statement it would go like this.

"Silent Hunter 5 is the result of a lot of hard work on the part of many individuals at Ubisoft, their hard work is appreciated by all of us here at subsim! As we close to release date, we have heard much of the good, the bad and the ugly, some of it has been fact, some of it has been unsubstantiated rumor, but we will reserve our judgments of SH5 for a later date when we are able to officially review the released product.

Furthermore, as Subsim.com is a place for the promotion of submarine simulations and the companies / individuals that develop them, we feel that our forums are not the place for discussion or suggestion of boycott or any other actions which work against the development of present or future submarine simulations."

[Letum]

actions which work against the development of present or future submarine simulations.

Who says it would work against the interest of submarine simulations?

Would the point be that it would work in the interest of long-term subsim development?

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by Letum

Who says it would work against the interest of submarine simulations?

Would the point be that it would work in our interest?

thats just what I would say if it were me.

However, when people start talking "boycott" on a product that they have never even gotten hands on, we have a problem.

now if Ubisoft came out and said

"Our game discs will be made of 100% pure crushed eagle beaks and baby seal bones. and the pages of our manuals will be written by child slave labor."

the whole "boycott" argument might have some legs to stand on.

but just because a company tries to protect its own rights by some means that we dont necessarily agree with, or because some content we really wanted didnt make it into the final build... those are some pretty stupid reasons to start picketing Ubisoft HQ

Originally Posted by Letum

If Ubi wasn't boycotting Subsim by refusing to provide a review copy
before release, we would already have read that official review you
place so much importance on.

and what source do you have that says they wont provide us with one?

we are a month out or more

what source do you have that says they HAVE a review ready copy for subsim?

what makes you think subsim.com is entitled to a review copy??? (no offense to Neal)

[Letum]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

those are some pretty stupid reasons to start picketing Ubisoft HQ

Just because these things are not important to you, doesn't mean that
other peoples grievances are "stupid".

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by Letum

Just because these things are not important to you, doesn't mean that
other peoples grievances are "stupid".

they in fact ARE important to me

I AM rather upset about a lot of it

difference is...

im just being fair and unbiased

[urfisch]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

they in fact ARE important to me

I AM rather upset about a lot of it

difference is...

im just being fair and unbiased

FAIR, is a word, that not seems to count very much these days in business...

[Safe-Keeper]

Wow. Over-reacting much?

I can perfectly well understand why Subsim is shutting down stupid "boycott" threads, and Subsim is a private forum, free to be run as it pleases the owner.

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

Furthermore, as Subsim.com is a place for the promotion of submarine simulations and the companies / individuals that develop them, we feel that our forums are not the place for discussion or suggestion of boycott or any other actions which work against the development of present or future submarine simulations."

Wow, you wanna job?

Simply this, guys: boycotts are the nuclear weapon of community activism. People as individuals can determine for themselves if they want to buy a game or not.

Originally Posted by Letum

But SubSim wouldn't be waging such a war.

No more than subsim is waging a war against 'political party x' when
someone in General Topics says people shouldn't vote for them.

You are right, but the core mission statement for Subsim has always been, to support sub game developers and the people who play subsims. Politics and sub games are apples and oranges.

[Letum]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

People as individuals can determine for themselves if they want to buy a game or not.

Exactly....so why the need for censorship?

[longam]

Originally Posted by Letum

Exactly....so why the need for censorship?

See Post #28

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by longam

See Post #28

because the buck stops at Neal's desk

thats the reason

[urfisch]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

Wow, you wanna job?

Simply this, guys: boycotts are the nuclear weapon of community activism. People as individuals can determine for themselves if they want to buy a game or not.



You are right, but the core mission statement for Subsim has always been, to support sub game developers and the people who play subsims. Politics and sub games are apples and oranges.

Supporting developers of sub games? Or developers of subsims? Nice rhetoric, Neal. I understand your point of view and in the core you are right. But wheres the objective differentation in this topic? You cant say, we are just supporting all of them.

Cause

in this whole discussion i miss one important point: What about the facts in progress and information with this game? And the rating of this behavior? Maybe from this point of view a support for such manner is no longer appropriate...

Look

Most of us follow the development of sub games since more than 10 or 20 years. Me too (my first subsim was silent service and wolfpack). And we are a very passioned and skilled community, which made SH3 to one of the most worthful subsims ever. We all are not dumb and have our opinion about, how the 5th part of this series should be - analysing the former versions. So UBI noticed that...and we where all made very hopeful, with a lot of big words (UBI in summer 2009: Now, we are doing all different, New ways in creation, We will have a special community developer, the community really counts for us. Be sure, to get a really nice game, to your long term needs, etc.) and now we all see, not to get most of anything from that, what has beeing promised and proclaimed...adding a really unfair kind of information policy (e.g. why didnt got neal the preview version first, before any press got it???)...and all this beside the facts of semi dynamic game content, only one boat, a limited time line, an console optimized gameplay and interface...and things like non-local savegames, permanent net connection...etc.

So, is there still the need of politeness in supporting the studio, which just follows the orders from UBI HQ?