My mate walks into a pub.....

[flag4]

.....we all know what effects alcohol can have on people.


I'll drink to that.


maybe someone knows of this troop ship cum passenger liner that went down with 7000 (seven thousand) american troops. if we can trace that we can trace a little more of the authenticity of this gentlemans story....

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by flag4

.....we all know what effects alcohol can have on people.


I'll drink to that.


maybe someone knows of this troop ship cum passenger liner that went down with 7000 (seven thousand) american troops. if we can trace that we can trace a little more of the authenticity of this gentlemans story....

as I recall there was a big US troop ship sunk somewhere off scotland in '42, I only recall this because it was alleged that one of the bodies was used in Operation Mincemeat (you'd know it better as "The Man Who Never Was") as the corpse they'd originally intended to use was rapidly decaying. As for the details of the loss of that ship, I've no idea.

[Captain Nemo]

Originally Posted by flag4

.....we all know what effects alcohol can have on people.


I'll drink to that.


maybe someone knows of this troop ship cum passenger liner that went down with 7000 (seven thousand) american troops. if we can trace that we can trace a little more of the authenticity of this gentlemans story....

A quick bit of research has thrown up a couple of possibilities. The first is the USAT Dorchester sunk by U-223 on 3 February 1943. Out of the 904 on board 674 perished more info here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USAT_Dorchester .

The second and more likely the one referred to by the old geezer is the SS Leopoldville sunk on 24 December 1944 in the English Channel. A quote from Wikipedia states "Of the 2,235 American servicemen on board, approximately 515 are presumed to have gone down with the ship. Another 248 died from injuries, drowning, or hypothermia."

In neither case was all hands lost.

As has been mentioned before, Heinz-Wilhelm Eck of U-852 was the only u-boat commander convicted and executed for war crimes for machine gunning survivors of the SS Peleus.

Nemo

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by Captain Nemo

A quick bit of research has thrown up a couple of possibilities. The first is the USAT Dorchester sunk by U-223 on 3 February 1943. Out of the 904 on board 674 perished more info here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USAT_Dorchester .

The second and more likely the one referred to by the old geezer is the SS Leopoldville sunk on 24 December 1944 in the English Channel. A quote from Wikipedia states "Of the 2,235 American servicemen on board, approximately 515 are presumed to have gone down with the ship. Another 248 died from injuries, drowning, or hypothermia."

In neither case was all hands lost.

As has been mentioned before, Heinz-Wilhelm Eck of U-852 was the only u-boat commander convicted and executed for war crimes for machine gunning survivors of the SS Peleus.

Nemo

The fact he was the only one convicted doesn't 100% rule out that other machine gunning events took place. However, while that is the case I would prefer to think that most U-boat captains had more humanity than that, just because they fought for their country doesn't mean they fought for the twisted ideology practised by her leaders. At least in the west we've sought more to apologise and atone for what happened during the war, which is more than could ever be said about the Japanese who to this day lie to their children about what really happened.

[Ancient Mariner]

Can't work out to quote but @ Ford Prefect,in a perfect world we can all think that Uboat commanders were humanitarian in their conduct,unfortunately the harsh reality of WW2 was that many of them did share the ideologies of the Nazi Regime To the last point correct me if I am wrong if the Japanese lie to their kids about WW2 & the west sought to atone for their "sins" as such,why is there a blank space in German history?

Yes war is atrocious in all forms but to leave out the historical significance of what happened in that specific timeframe?!?

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by Ancient Mariner

Can't work out to quote but @ Ford Prefect,in a perfect world we can all think that Uboat commanders were humanitarian in their conduct,unfortunately the harsh reality of WW2 was that many of them did share the ideologies of the Nazi Regime To the last point correct me if I am wrong if the Japanese lie to their kids about WW2 & the west sought to atone for their "sins" as such,why is there a blank space in German history?

Yes war is atrocious in all forms but to leave out the historical significance of what happened in that specific timeframe?!?

The germans admit to what they did, the death camps etc. The japanese choose to ignore their forced labour camps, torture (including putting rice in prisoners ears and inducing it to grow) and all the other stuff they did.

I'm in the position of having family from both side of the conflict, one of my great aunties grew up in hitler's german, through the girls version of the hitler youth and lived through the war, her brother(s) fought on the eastern front and still, long after the war, uptil she died, her mother would still call anything marked "product of israel" "juden Scheiße" (or something along those lines) as if it were the most normal thing in the world. No covering up there of what feelings there had been in germany pre and during the war. My auntie though turned out a very normal person despite it all and to the best of my knowledge she's still going. A wonderful old lady who bought the best presents in typical german fashion that would have made the ahnenerbe proud. The boys always got tool kits or microscopes, practical toys. The girls got dolls and cookery sets. It's amazing how echoes of this time live on, the Olympic torch for example....

[DaveU186]

With regard to the ship in Narvik:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2113/...8e13316646.jpg

That it?

The George Thiele, if so.

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by DaveU186

With regard to the ship in Narvik:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2113/...8e13316646.jpg

That it?

The George Thiele, if so.

Thats the bugger aye, I couldn't get that close to it at the time as the area is owned by the electricity board as they have a sub station nearby so it's all fenced off. Apprently for a long time at low tide you could still see the swastika on the bow deck. I'm not sure how true this is, did they even sail into battle with them painted on?

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Ancient Mariner

To the last point correct me if I am wrong if the Japanese lie to their kids about WW2 & the west sought to atone for their "sins" as such,why is there a blank space in German history?

May I ask what blank space we are talking about?

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

May I ask what blank space we are talking about?

ah, but you're german so if there is one how are you going to know?








just incase the sarcasm didn't hit you, I am just kidding.

[flag4]

"To the last point correct me if I am wrong if the Japanese lie to their kids about WW2 & the west sought to atone for their "sins" as such,why is there a blank space in German history?"


"May I ask what blank space we are talking about? "


"ah, but you're german so if there is one how are you going to know?








just incase the sarcasm didn't hit you, I am just kidding. "



.....Enlighten him....

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by flag4

"To the last point correct me if I am wrong if the Japanese lie to their kids about WW2 & the west sought to atone for their "sins" as such,why is there a blank space in German history?"


"May I ask what blank space we are talking about? "


"ah, but you're german so if there is one how are you going to know?








just incase the sarcasm didn't hit you, I am just kidding. "



.....Enlighten him....

well it all started in eighteen hundred and nineteen thirty nine, on septimbre the 43rd germany declared war in all directions *BANG*
Mass writing of war memoir began europe wide, leading to many a film of the book of the tram being made. England was mobilised and recruits were rushing to the recruiting depot at the rate of one a year. In 1942, a critical year for Britain, with British Generals slaving away at their autobiographies, the germans came up with "Operation Burnbaum", smuggling a secret agent with a spraygun of secret liquid into the Great British Military Shirt Factory near Leicester where he sprayed all the shirt tails. When the wearer of the shirts sat down the heat from the body caused the shirt tail to explode!
After a series of explosions the British intelligence caught on and called up Major Bloodnok who knew more about exploding shirt tails than any other. Bloodnok was instructed to test the shirts to see what was causing the explosions, he was offered the reward of Several plastic OBEs and a drip-dry statue of Jane Mansfield and a ticket to Hampstead Fairground. After some testing Neddie Seagoon was sent into germany in an attempt to discover the origin of the shirt exploding fluid. Unfortunately Neddie was captured by Trader Horn on his way to germany and taken to the POW camp at Rhinegold Castle, Fnutt. The prison was full of British Officers who had sworn to die rather than be captured. Finally though he and his fellow agent were able to escape. Ned and his party made their way to the great German Chemical Works at Schatz. By using the short-wave cardboard secret horse-hair and mattress telephone, they were able to contact London by speech. It was then they learnt the name of the chemical that exploded the shirt-tails. It was called Gerschattzer. A supply of cupboards was dropped by air as neddie and his party were surrounded by the germans. After an exchange of fire pronounced gerbang neddie was saved by the american 5th cavalry which had also saved the television.



There, I hope that has filled in the missing knowledge of world war two as brought to us by men who served in it, namely spike milligan, peter sellars and harry seacombe, aka the goons.