Religion 101 Final Exam

[geetrue]

Faith is faith ... you either believe or you don't believe.

Starting my car in sub zero weather takes a lot of faith lol

All analytical people seem to have the same problem ...

They are either right or wrong

[Stealth Hunter]

[A Very Super Market]

He-heh-heh

I love it!

[August]

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

"Christianity/Odinism Motivator picture

Yet Christianity has 2.1 billion members and all neo-pagan religions put together barely make up 1 million. Guess the cross beats the hammer by a 2100 to 1 margin.

[Stealth Hunter]

Originally Posted by August

Yet Christianity has 2.1 billion members and all neo-pagan religions put together barely make up 1 million. Guess the cross beats the hammer by a 2100 to 1 margin.

But my god has a hammer... a hammer that has the ability to cause the Earth to quake and shake at its very foundation; a hammer that can fill the land with a clamoring boom as it smashes all who oppose it.

[August]

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

But my god has a hammer... a hammer that has the ability to cause the Earth to quake and shake at its very foundation; a hammer that can fill the land with a clamoring boom as it smashes all who oppose it.

Bah demi-god kid stuff.

If my God wanted to hammer he'd hammer in the morning, he'd hammer in the evening, all over this land. He'd hammer out danger, he'd hammer out a warning, he'd hammer out love between my brothers and my sisters, all over this land.

[Stealth Hunter]

Originally Posted by August

Bah demi-god kid stuff.

If my God wanted to hammer he'd hammer in the morning, he'd hammer in the evening, all over this land. He'd hammer out danger, he'd hammer out a warning, he'd hammer out love between my brothers and my sisters, all over this land.

BAM!

[August]

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

BAM!

Pfft. Your god isn't even a pimple on the ass of my God:

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by August

If my God wanted to hammer he'd hammer in the morning, he'd hammer in the evening, all over this land. He'd hammer out danger, he'd hammer out a warning, he'd hammer out love between my brothers and my sisters, all over this land.

You do know Pete Seeger was a communist, don't you?

[Nisgeis]

Ah good, there's an expert with all the answers. Just what I need, as I was having a few questions about my faith.

What I don't get is why people say that proof denies belief, so that's why we don't get proof, because we have to believe. But, way back in ye olde bible days, God was popping up everywhere, speaking directly to people and demonstarting his power and all sorts of proof was going on. Was belief different back then? Did you need proof to believe then? I don't know, because there's all sorts of con men out there and how are we to know that they were the ones to hear the word of God, or see the proof of God's work. It's a bit of a stretch isn't it to say that everyone back then who said they talked to God, or saw a demonstration of God's power is truthful, but now if someone says that God made them do something, then it's straight to the nut house for them and they don't have to serve their time for the multiple murders they committed.

So, the question is, Why was proof back then OK, but it isn't now? What's God done, said OK, you humans have one chance and it's up to a bunch of people to convince evryone else that they're not making it up, but I'm not going to give them any help ever for at least another 2,000 years.

I have also read some accusations that aetheists want to prove that they are above God. Putting a different spin on it, why are we religous folk trying to put a 'we are above the animals' spin on it? The aethiests seem perfectly happy to accept they are an animal, but us religous folk don't seem to be happy to accept the same. I'm having trouble accepting that we were put here to rule over the animals. It seems trite to say that now. If there is an allegation of elevating one's status, then perhaps one side is more guilty than the other?

As a final word, i would like to say that a religion is a belief system and anyone who is an aetheist has that as their belief system. None of us have no beliefs. But some of us have open minds.

That anti-gay stuff being based on 'not casting your seed on infertile ground' I mean is that really still an issue, or have people backtracked from that? That could mean anything really. Like, say my wife can't have kids due to a medical problem. Is the bible telling me to not have sex with her ever? Who made her infertile? Why does God go around choosing who should and should not have sex? After all, it's not random is it? Is it? It can't be, we are told. So why did he select her for not having sex? EDIT: And how am I meant to know she is 'barren ground' beforehand? I mean, give me a sign... oh no, sorry, forgot you don't do that anymore, because that's in the past.

[August]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

You do know Pete Seeger was a communist, don't you?

So he really meant a sickle and hammer?

[CaptainHaplo]

Actually Aramike - you could take that "empty" box and open it and say HA - no diamonds - to which a person of faith could point out that the air inside said box contains portions of carbon - the same substance of which diamonds are made. While it may not be VISIBLE to you, diamonds do exist in the box. They are simply not in a form you RECOGNIZE as diamonds.

Spiritually/metaphysically/whatever other term you want to use - the facts are no matter how much you may see - the building blocks are ENERGY. The positive proton, the neutral neutron, and the negative electron. Each atom working in concert with each other - and we still don't understand how or why exactly. But the fact is that if you took an atom with one p/e pair, added another p/e pair - you changed what that atom "is" - and all you really did was modify its mass and electrical charge. *Don't even get me started on Ions and such*

If you see everything as simply energy - the rock is the same as water - just in a different form - or electrical state. Sure this is a VERY basic explanation, but when you get down to the low levels of substance structure - they are made up of the same stuff. Its all energy in motion - just different "charges" or speeds.

So many try to say "Well you can't prove God exists" - or "Well you can't prove He/She/It doesnt", that they lose the beauty of this realm with wasted arguments. I don't have to prove God exists, not to Angus or anyone else. I have enough proof for ME personally, and thats all I need. I see that proof in the things that science can not only NOT explain, but those things that defy every known law of science observed since humanity has been able to record scientific findings. Look at the power of splitting a mere atom - look at the fact that by rights, atoms themselves defy scientific explanation under currently understood physics (since a positive and negative charge would attract and thus cancel each other out - instead of one continually orbiting the other....), etc etc. I need look no further than science to see the wonderful DESIGN of this universe and realize that its complexity is well beyond the human mind to be fully understood. Science is a quest for knowledge - and religion is often the same. They need not be mutually exclusive - though many Athiests feel they should.

The reason Athiests so want to deny a Deity, is because that would make them less than the penultimate being. Pride is a stumbling block for many, but for those that would deny Deity, I would simply point to this world and say, my - how we have so created a paradise by being the "highest being". It is a hard and bitter pill, but if nothing else - humanities failures and we still exist is also a wonderful example of a "higher" hand.

Edit - for those that want to quote science - allow me to remind you of the Law of Conservation of Matter and Energy - no matter or energy can be created or destroyed - it simply changes form. This law is an amazing statement on the spiritual soul and its relationship to your "living" consciousness - you WILL exist after your physical body dies - so science itself has claimed. One can argue whether or not "you" (being the consciousness in some form) will exist - but there is no way science can prove or disprove that. It simply states that some form of you will exist for all time. People of faith simply expect that form to be one that has a level of awareness in some way. Before you ridicule that, you may want to realize that even things that were deemed "not conscious" years ago (like plants) - have been found to communicate and even reactions that denote intellegence without a known scientific explanation.
See http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/content/view/1160/ for an example. Just because science has a theory on something yesterday, or today, or tommorow - does not mean that understanding cannot mature. Do not ridicule just because you cannot fathom it. Your mind is finite. Seek knowledge - and you will find. Be it science, or theology. The wise man seeks to learn, and not merely mock.

[antikristuseke]

CaptainHaplo, your knowlege of particle physics is out of date by a few decades.

As for your last point, you are wrong. I as an atheist, and all atheists I have spoken to, are not disbelievers because we want to belive to be the highest form in existance but because there simply is no evidence for any diety. That is all there is to it, I am not saying that there can be no god, I am saying there is no reason to belive that there is a god, though should evidence come to light I will change my position. This is the position of any self respecting atheist.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

As for your last point, you are wrong. I as an atheist, and all atheists I have spoken to, are not disbelievers because we want to belive to be the highest form in existance but because there simply is no evidence for any diety. That is all there is to it, I am not saying that there can be no god, I am saying there is no reason to belive that there is a god, though should evidence come to light I will change my position. This is the position of any self respecting atheist.

Originally Posted by Bewolf

Atheists hardly ever consider themselves more important without a god.

Christians like to call atheism 'The Godless Religion'. Most of the atheists I have spoken to also feel the same way as you two. The problem comes with a vocal few (isn't that always the case?) who come off sounding like religious fanatics. Ellen Johnson, the recently deposed head of the American Atheist Society, was one of those. Her attitude always seemed to be "There is no god, and you are an idiot to believe in one!"

I see a bit of that here as well. Like any fanatical belief, that attitude only adds fuel to the fire. I agree: I've looked long and hard, and can find no evidence for the existence of any superior being, let alone a supreme one. But I'm not a devout atheist either, possibly because I'm afraid to wholly let go of former beliefs; but I like to think it's because I'm keeping a truly open mind on the subject.

On the other hand, if you accept that there's a God, you then have to deal with the problem that every True Believer on the planet is convinced that his God is the right one, the only one, and if you don't believe him you're going straight to hell without a chance of parole. So which one do you choose?

[Aramike]

. ....is bullocks. Atheists hardly ever consider themselves more important without a god.

This statement is true for SOME. There are indeed others who approach the issue with a sense of self-importance.

after christians went into the offensive the last couple years, trying to force me into their morale standarts, trying to bring their private and personal affairs into the open and public big time. As long people stay at home with religion I have zero problems with it. But as soon they come out and try to make my life harder with their often hypocritical morale views, then it's time to fight back. By now christians in general made such a bad impresion on me, especially american ones (sorry, but these are the most vocal ones)

I am curious as to how your life has been made harder...

What makes a bad impression upon me (someone who's wholly agnostic) is when atheists claim things such as a Ten Commandments display makes their lives harder...