Mumbai assessment

[Rockstar]

Assessment:

It is obvious that the raid had the support and assistance of Pakistan’s ISI security services. The ISI is filled with covert supporters of either the Taliban or Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda. Until Pakistan’s overnight ‘conversion’ in 2003, the ISI was the Taliban’s liaison with the Pakistani government. The ISI supplied money, materiel, recruits and training to both al-Qaeda and the Taliban dating back to the 1980’s. But it is just as obvious that Pakistan didn’t plan to invade and capture Bombay with just ten guys. The raid on Bombay didn’t provide Pakistan or the ISI with anything of strategic value — just the satisfaction of inflicting harm on a hated enemy. But what it provided to al-Qaeda was invaluable. Bombay is India’s New York City. Some of the terrorists were already inside the harbor city; the rest infiltrated by boat with additional weapons and explosives. The terrorists were undoubtedly al-Qaeda affliates; their tactics were mujahadeen tactics; fight to the death inflicting as much damage as possible in the process. Their chosen victims were Westerners — particularly Americans - and Jews. During the campaign, Senator Joe Biden hinted darkly at a ‘test’ that will present itself to the Obama administration within six months of his taking office. Homeland Security is as prepared as it can be for attacks using airliners, dirty bombs, nuclear materials, etc.

But Mumbai, a city twice the size of New York City, was paralyzed by ten determined young men armed with nothing but small arms and field explosives for more than sixty hours. Why Mumbai? To see if it would work. Ten guys paralyzed the city for sixty hours and killed or wounded more than four hundred people. It was a tactical success. On January 20th, 2009, thousands upon thousands of people will be crowded into coastal Washington D.C. to attend the Obama inaugural.

Please join me in prayer that America’s defenders learned as much from the Mumbai massacre as America’s enemies did.

[August]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Please join me in prayer that America’s defenders learned as much from the Mumbai massacre as America’s enemies did.

Sure, I can agree with this sentiment.

[GoldenRivet]

the difference is - on January 20th there will be countless military and civilian security personnel waiting around every corner for something like that to happen.

point so much as a rude gesture and your going to draw attention.

point anything that resembles a weapon and your going to draw fire

[caspofungin]

It is obvious that the raid had the support and assistance of Pakistan’s ISI security services

that's a doozy of an assumption to make. why not wait until all the facts are in?

Their chosen victims were Westerners — particularly Americans - and Jews.

their chosen victims? So far, of all the dead, there were 22 foreign nationals -- not just yanks, but candians, europeans, etc. the vast majority of the dead were indian.

But Mumbai, a city twice the size of New York City, was paralyzed by ten determined young men armed with nothing but small arms and field explosives for more than sixty hours. Why Mumbai? To see if it would work.

more than ten guys. and also, i think it's unfair to compare the state of mumbai's security with that of washington dc -- mumbai was unprepared, the response was piecemeal and uncoordinated.

(edit for spelling)

[Skybird]

The ISI's sympathy and assistance for Islamic terrorism is documented since decades. It dates back into the early 70s. The Pakistani military also has strong symoathies for Islamists, and namely the Taleban. They created them.

The intended choosen victims for which the assassins actively searched , were Jews, and owners of American and British passports. Says the surviving ratman, and is verified by eye witness reports. Ratman also said they aimed at killing as many people as possible.

India since long rates as a Satanic power for islamic terrorists, comparable to the role of America, since it is formally democratic by state system, and a strong oppositionto islamic attempts to raise Islamic influence in the region. It also is a dominant regional military power.

[caspofungin]

How did the isi create the taleban?

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by caspofungin

How did the isi create the taleban?

I quote myself from "Trapped in the Afghan Maze", written November 2006. I give the surrounding context as well, to illustrate the links between the Green legion, the Taleban, and the original strategic interest behind it.

In the war against the Russians, a certain Saudi named Osama Bin Laden was contacted and sup-ported by the CIA that became aware of him as a leading financial supporter of the resistance and even militia commander in the field. It is relatively un-known to the public that the CIA already was active in Afghanistan since longer time before the Soviet invasion began, an invasion that Moscow absolutely started hesitantly and was not enthusiastic about. and one can only speculate that at that time, in the late 70s, the CIA had it’s hand’s in drugs, like it had in other parts of the world as well: in order to raise financial funds that it needed for it’s hidden operations somewhere else, and that it does not want the public to know about, so they better should not be listed in any balances checked by political control committees. According activities with regard to Middle America and the Contras are well-known by now (For a good description of this see Gary Webb: “Dark Alliance: The CIA, the Contras, and the Crack Cocaine Explosion”. - On Gary Webb in brief, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Webb Webb won the Pulitzer Award and got killed in mysterious circumstances in 2004.), and the drugs being smuggled into the US by the Contras to use the profits for buying weapons – all this with help and assistance by the CIA that even hindered law enforcement by federal authorities and made local police accepting drug distribution - certainly were not the only source of incomes of this agency. Together with the Pakistani ISI, the CIA had started to form a so-called “green legion” of Mohammedan volunteers from all over the Mohammedan world that was trained, equipped and sent to Afghanistan to fight against the Russians. Afghans did not trust these foreigners and never allowed them to stick their noses into Afghanistan’s internal businesses, and today, only some remains of the green legion’s social aid work still has survived in the country, while their fighters (many Afghans thought of them as mercenaries and strangers) left voluntarily soon after the Russians withdraw, or were kicked out of the country. Interestingly, like the green legion was never loved by Afghans, most tribes and village communities never had heard of Al Quaeda or did not like and accept them at all, again seeing them as strangers that had no business in Afghanistan and were not welcomed. The CIA-ISI operation constituted the basis of those personnel structures and networks that later became known as “Al Quaeda”, and provided material/financial and intel support for Bin Laden’s group, misjudging the nature and essential motivations of these people, and the long-term implications of their faith. On 11th September 2001 at the latest, this choice of allies turned out to have been a most stupid one. It already was not the first, but at least the third attack of Bin Laden on the United States.

Instead of supporting the forming of a governmental structure and helping to rebuilt essential sectors of civilian life in Afghanistan, after the Russian’s drive out the American interest quickly shifted away from the country’s well-being and the Mujaheddin and towards rich natural resources in Kazachstan, Uzbekistan, and Azerbaijan, and to bring the flow of oil under American control, which meant to sign exclusive contracts with these countries as well as to redirect the oil traffic through pipelines under Russian influence, and build a new giant pipeline to replace them. Many of the military assignments and much of the US base-building in the region more or less openly are strategically aiming at securing this oil transportation project. The new pipe was/is planned to lead from Turkmenistan and the Kaspian Sea to Harat, Kandahar and Belochistan and further to the Indian Ocean. Afghanistan was a territory of major importance for that project. The brilliant CIA-idea: let the ISI recruit and equip volunteers in the many Pashtun refugee camps (harbouring some 5 million Pashtuns) along the border between both countries, and from 1994 on sent them to Afghanistan to bring the country under control for the American corporations controlling the events from the hidden background. The militant faction known as the “Taliban” in today’s understanding was born. Their predecessors in fact had been raised and funded and trained by the Pakistani since the 70s, as a tactical option in their ongoing fight with the Indians for Kashmir. This history also explains the strong internal ties between the Taliban and the ISI, which Musharaf today tries so hard – but in vain - to hide. What became of these Taliban is known by now. The American demands from the 90s very much took the existing predecessors of today’s Taliban as a fundament and encouraged the ISI to turn them into what they are today. American intentions and assessments may have changed since then – but the system still lives by the old rules - a classical case of the magician-apprentice losing control of the ghosts that he conjured.