Speaking of Obama and Israel, why is it America's job to babysit Israel? - Page 3

={FH}=Paddy · 11-07-08, 12:20 PM

Good point Mikhayl, my oversight, but until recent times The Lebanon was considered to be no more than a Syrian puppet state....................and even now, while the strings are not so defined as they once were, they certainly lead out of country! I shall leave you to speculate on to whom and where they lead………..….that’s not my call.

={FH}=Paddy · 11-07-08, 12:50 PM

A “BattleGround” state is an interesting manner in which to explain it, however, probably the most apt, albeit extremely sadly to have to do so.
Again as mentioned, the influence from Tehran, Damascus and Riyadh clearly indicates a puppet state to some degree. These strings leading out of country to entities of a somewhat dubious nature (understatement) and with often conflicting goals and interests would also most certainly remove The Lebanon from being realistically considered as a democracy.

={FH}=Paddy · 11-07-08, 01:30 PM

Very well put indeed Mikhayl and as you highlight, the US and Israel equally have their hand in the pie, for their personal reasons and interests too!
Sadly it really is a case of “watch this spot” and hope and pray that history doesn’t come back and haunt them again with another long and bitter civil war………….

Yes mate…..we are getting a little off topic here………but it’s an interesting discussion all the same!

PS: Etes-vous d'origine Francaise ou expatrié d'un pays anglophone vivant en France?

Sailor Steve · 11-07-08, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Christopher Snow

Now....everything I just said is premised entirely on the fact that the God of the Old Testament exists.

He might not exist too, so I might just be wasting my breath (and a few keystrokes)...and these few electronic bits it takes to put these ideas down on the internet. So peeps like you, stabiz (and subchaser12 too), shouldn't worrry at all if you DON'T believe this God exists.

Way to hedge your bets.:rotfl:

And I am just teasing, because I used to be a devout Christian, but the more I look at the evidence the more doubts I had. Note I said "doubts". I'm not an atheist by any means, for the same reason that I am no longer a believer. I have a long history of being wrong, and my doubts began while I still believed. I question people who feel they have to prove their faith (or that they even can), because isn't that what faith's all about - believing the unbelievable? Likewise I can't be a hardcore atheist because that also involves faith.

My final answer is always the same: "I don't know". Sometimes I add "And I don't think you do either", but that's because I don't trust people who display that kind of certainty. And I also don't know why I felt the need to tell you that, and didn't mean to wander off topic.

-'Sailor Steve' Bradfield

MothBalls · 11-07-08, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

My final answer is always the same: "I don't know". Sometimes I add "And I don't think you do either"

Classic.

I like CG's explanation ...

={FH}=Paddy · 11-07-08, 06:32 PM

@ Mikhayl: I grew up in Ireland until 9 and then moved to Brussels for 18 years. In-between the afore mentioned time, I was in the UK for 2 years, de retour en Irelande pour deux ans, then India and far east for one years, again back to Irelande! Then off to Spain for a year. In 2002 I moved to Tel Aviv where I lived and worked during the second Intifada for two years (while not Israeli or Jewish, I was following my heart!) until my return to Ireland in 2004, where I now work & live (with my little 1 year old gorgeous daughter). La vie est trops court pour avoirs des emerdes! Enchanté de fair votre conecance Mikhayl and your English is fantastic btw, my French is deteriorating daily now but I fait mon mieux! And all the best with your plans too btw……it’s a fascinating part of the world and deserves not only the best efforts from its respective peoples, but from us all too.
This old adage springs to mind, "Fighting for peace is like F*%$ing for virginity"!

={FH}=Paddy · 11-07-08, 07:22 PM

Good man Mikhayl - as is said, Insha'Allah & Allah Maak! And peace & shalom to all!

Now its time for my nest. La petite va bientot avoir faime!
Tot zeinz une fois dit!

={FH}=Paddy · 11-07-08, 07:24 PM

PS: Hippie? I know a great berber barber in Haifa!!

jpm1 · 11-07-08, 07:45 PM

when you need a country petroleum in the region your attack that country saying it's a threat for Israel . Israel having the nuclear bomb it's also a kind of permanent base for the US if needed . Each time Israel launches a missile it's a good thing for the US military industry . Israel has a 10 bn $ defence budget with US only equipement can't be a bad thing for the US economy

Task Force · 11-07-08, 07:47 PM

I think they need to let them sit in there slef pitty and try to make things better over here in the US.

={FH}=Paddy · 11-07-08, 08:54 PM

there slef = their self, i guess? (a dabble or two from the crew's rum rations maybe?) tut tut

:rotfl:

={FH}=Paddy · 11-07-08, 09:04 PM

@jpm1: furthermore, as we all know the annual overseas investment from the US to Raphael Israel Armaments Development Authority is primarily so that the US can patent Israeli born ideas, claim them as their own weapon systems (with minor amendments) and manufacture them en gross, something the Israeli's, due to global sanctions can neither nor afford or permit them selves to do. Of course a 10B$ hand out in this scenario is made viable by the US, but without the top honchos in Washington who are in primary slots of power within the US echelon of business, finance etc and of the Diaspora vote, this 10B$ would not be a case in point and hence the support (or "babysitting" as put by our esteemed kaleun "subchaser12") be a necessity for any American “residing” or "wannabe" president to take in to consideration.

The world’s waves wash on many shores other than our own, but the ripple of which, is felt far and wide! Petroleum is but a dabble for now; fresh water will be the trophy of the future and though the source of life, shall produce death in magnitudes to those who seek its source.
Just look at a map of the ME.

FIREWALL · 11-07-08, 09:55 PM

I'd like to see where this topic would go if the Avon Lady were still here. :p :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

AngusJS · 11-08-08, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Christopher Snow

In practical terms, you win a war by taking the venue of battle onto HIS terrain, and at the earliest possible opportunity.

GWB did just that when he moved into Iraq. To his everlasting credit.

That's an unintended consequence. We were supposed to be greeted as liberators - no or very little resistance after the fall of Saddam was expected.

And all the terrorists we're killing - how many are Al Qaeda and other int'l groups, and how many are Iraqis (say former Iraqi Army, wisely disbanded by Bremer

[way to lead, Bush]) who wouldn't have cared less about attacking us if we weren't there in the first place?

Buddahaid · 11-08-08, 02:03 AM

[/quote]
That's an unintended consequence. We were supposed to be greeted as liberators - no or very little resistance after the fall of Saddam was expected.
[/quote]

Two more cents, well maybe four. Iraq was founded by the British and her people had had enough of foreign rule. Why would the US in its arrogance, or ignorance, believe another would be welcome? As much as Saddam was a somewhat cruel leader, it takes one to unite, if that's the word, a country with religious factions perfectly content to murder each other over how to worship the same God. That goes for the whole of the ME in my view. My God is the only true God and you either see it my way or die infidel. Until people can see beyond that concept, it will never end. Now what of the other billions of people that worship Buddha. Are they in need of conversion by death? Why can't we all agree to accept that others may find God in their own way already? And, why are we so arrogant to think the almighty omnipotent one needs any help?

Buddahaid

By the way, I'm not a Buddist. Sheesh, I can't even spell it.:rotfl:

11-07-08, 12:20 PM	#31
={FH}=Paddy Electrician's Mate Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Dublin - Ireland - 53° 15′ 54.36″ N, 6° 6′ 49.32″ W Posts: 136 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Good point Mikhayl, my oversight, but until recent times The Lebanon was considered to be no more than a Syrian puppet state....................and even now, while the strings are not so defined as they once were, they certainly lead out of country! I shall leave you to speculate on to whom and where they lead………..….that’s not my call. __________________ ={Draft beer not people}=

11-07-08, 12:50 PM	#32
={FH}=Paddy Electrician's Mate Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Dublin - Ireland - 53° 15′ 54.36″ N, 6° 6′ 49.32″ W Posts: 136 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	A “BattleGround” state is an interesting manner in which to explain it, however, probably the most apt, albeit extremely sadly to have to do so. Again as mentioned, the influence from Tehran, Damascus and Riyadh clearly indicates a puppet state to some degree. These strings leading out of country to entities of a somewhat dubious nature (understatement) and with often conflicting goals and interests would also most certainly remove The Lebanon from being realistically considered as a democracy. __________________ ={Draft beer not people}=

11-07-08, 01:30 PM	#33
={FH}=Paddy Electrician's Mate Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Dublin - Ireland - 53° 15′ 54.36″ N, 6° 6′ 49.32″ W Posts: 136 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Very well put indeed Mikhayl and as you highlight, the US and Israel equally have their hand in the pie, for their personal reasons and interests too! Sadly it really is a case of “watch this spot” and hope and pray that history doesn’t come back and haunt them again with another long and bitter civil war…………. Yes mate…..we are getting a little off topic here………but it’s an interesting discussion all the same! PS: Etes-vous d'origine Francaise ou expatrié d'un pays anglophone vivant en France? __________________ ={Draft beer not people}=

11-07-08, 06:32 PM	#36
={FH}=Paddy Electrician's Mate Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Dublin - Ireland - 53° 15′ 54.36″ N, 6° 6′ 49.32″ W Posts: 136 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	@ Mikhayl: I grew up in Ireland until 9 and then moved to Brussels for 18 years. In-between the afore mentioned time, I was in the UK for 2 years, de retour en Irelande pour deux ans, then India and far east for one years, again back to Irelande! Then off to Spain for a year. In 2002 I moved to Tel Aviv where I lived and worked during the second Intifada for two years (while not Israeli or Jewish, I was following my heart!) until my return to Ireland in 2004, where I now work & live (with my little 1 year old gorgeous daughter). La vie est trops court pour avoirs des emerdes! Enchanté de fair votre conecance Mikhayl and your English is fantastic btw, my French is deteriorating daily now but I fait mon mieux! And all the best with your plans too btw……it’s a fascinating part of the world and deserves not only the best efforts from its respective peoples, but from us all too. This old adage springs to mind, "Fighting for peace is like F*%$ing for virginity"! __________________ ={Draft beer not people}=

11-07-08, 07:22 PM	#37
={FH}=Paddy Electrician's Mate Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Dublin - Ireland - 53° 15′ 54.36″ N, 6° 6′ 49.32″ W Posts: 136 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Good man Mikhayl - as is said, Insha'Allah & Allah Maak! And peace & shalom to all! Now its time for my nest. La petite va bientot avoir faime! Tot zeinz une fois dit! __________________ ={Draft beer not people}=

11-07-08, 07:24 PM	#38
={FH}=Paddy Electrician's Mate Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Dublin - Ireland - 53° 15′ 54.36″ N, 6° 6′ 49.32″ W Posts: 136 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	PS: Hippie? I know a great berber barber in Haifa!! __________________ ={Draft beer not people}=

11-07-08, 07:45 PM	#39
jpm1 Captain Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 544 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	when you need a country petroleum in the region your attack that country saying it's a threat for Israel . Israel having the nuclear bomb it's also a kind of permanent base for the US if needed . Each time Israel launches a missile it's a good thing for the US military industry . Israel has a 10 bn $ defence budget with US only equipement can't be a bad thing for the US economy

11-07-08, 07:47 PM	#40
Task Force Rear Admiral Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: SPACE!!!! Posts: 10,142 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	I think they need to let them sit in there slef pitty and try to make things better over here in the US. __________________ Task Force industries "Taking control of the world, one mind at a time"

11-07-08, 08:54 PM	#41
={FH}=Paddy Electrician's Mate Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Dublin - Ireland - 53° 15′ 54.36″ N, 6° 6′ 49.32″ W Posts: 136 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	there slef = their self, i guess? (a dabble or two from the crew's rum rations maybe?) tut tut:rotfl: __________________ ={Draft beer not people}= Last edited by ={FH}=Paddy; 11-07-08 at 08:54 PM.

11-07-08, 09:04 PM	#42
={FH}=Paddy Electrician's Mate Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Dublin - Ireland - 53° 15′ 54.36″ N, 6° 6′ 49.32″ W Posts: 136 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	@jpm1: furthermore, as we all know the annual overseas investment from the US to Raphael Israel Armaments Development Authority is primarily so that the US can patent Israeli born ideas, claim them as their own weapon systems (with minor amendments) and manufacture them en gross, something the Israeli's, due to global sanctions can neither nor afford or permit them selves to do. Of course a 10B$ hand out in this scenario is made viable by the US, but without the top honchos in Washington who are in primary slots of power within the US echelon of business, finance etc and of the Diaspora vote, this 10B$ would not be a case in point and hence the support (or "babysitting" as put by our esteemed kaleun "subchaser12") be a necessity for any American “residing” or "wannabe" president to take in to consideration. The world’s waves wash on many shores other than our own, but the ripple of which, is felt far and wide! Petroleum is but a dabble for now; fresh water will be the trophy of the future and though the source of life, shall produce death in magnitudes to those who seek its source. Just look at a map of the ME. __________________ ={Draft beer not people}= Last edited by ={FH}=Paddy; 11-07-08 at 09:18 PM.

11-07-08, 09:55 PM	#43
FIREWALL Eternal Patrol Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: CATALINA IS. SO . CAL USA Posts: 10,108 Downloads: 511 Uploads: 0	I'd like to see where this topic would go if the Avon Lady were still here. :p :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: __________________ RIP FIREWALL I Play GWX. Silent Hunter Who ???

11-08-08, 02:03 AM	#45
Buddahaid Shark above Space Chicken Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 9,334 Downloads: 162 Uploads: 0	[/quote] That's an unintended consequence. We were supposed to be greeted as liberators - no or very little resistance after the fall of Saddam was expected. [/quote] Two more cents, well maybe four. Iraq was founded by the British and her people had had enough of foreign rule. Why would the US in its arrogance, or ignorance, believe another would be welcome? As much as Saddam was a somewhat cruel leader, it takes one to unite, if that's the word, a country with religious factions perfectly content to murder each other over how to worship the same God. That goes for the whole of the ME in my view. My God is the only true God and you either see it my way or die infidel. Until people can see beyond that concept, it will never end. Now what of the other billions of people that worship Buddha. Are they in need of conversion by death? Why can't we all agree to accept that others may find God in their own way already? And, why are we so arrogant to think the almighty omnipotent one needs any help? Buddahaid By the way, I'm not a Buddist. Sheesh, I can't even spell it.:rotfl: