SH3 vs SH4 Atlantic campaign comparsion

[csengoi]

First of all: I was a big big fan of SH3. I loved it. When SH4 arrived, I was amazed of the new shiny graphics, and got excited, but the Pacific theater with american Uboats prevented me from playing. Them I've started to wait patiently for the Atlantic/German release. When I heard UBoot mission is coming I cheared, but it was a disappointment. I've started to wait again, this time for the community (mainly GWX team) to give us back the great Atlantic dynamic campaign. And now it is on it's way to become true.
So could someone enumerate the things are worse/missing from SH4 (OP munsun) compare to SH3?

[Rockin Robbins]

No.

OK, just one. The lookouts in Op Monsun allied warships cannot visually see 30 km like they can in modded SH3.

[csengoi]

And what about KM grid on the Atlantic, and type XXI uboot? Will them also implemented?

[tHy]

They propably will, sometime...

and not a single mod shows the awesome depth of the "big" SH3 mods like GWX which in their latest versions are so filled with scenic depth and accuracy giving the game "the real feeling". That's something you can't get for SH4 atm in a package, you have to do the dirty work yourxelf and mix up masses of mods to achieve a somewhat close atmosphere.

Don't get me wrong, I also started playing SH4 for real again only after OM finally arrived, and finally some terrific visual and audial mods are avaible too to bring immersion in a technical way completely unable to achieve with SH3 engine, but the detailed and long work on campaigns and subs is missing up to now (understandable, the SH3 community now had several more years of time to work on it , and I have no doubt that SH4 will be enhanced and kept alive by the modding community for also several years (better said, at least until SH5 arrives ).

[Pablo]

MODERATOR HAT ON:

Howdy folks!

I can understand how the title of this thread could make it tempting for folks with a certain mindset to take potshots at other mods. Please keep in mind that Neal has set the moderators' sensors to high sensitivity with regard to these types of posts, no matter how veiled or general you think your references to Operation Monsun or GWX are, by the way.

So, how to keep this thread on track while staying clear of the moderators? Well, it might be good to keep in mind that Operation Monsun is not finished, GWX V3 has just started development, and that there may be a lot of other folks out there who may be contemplating or working on mods that haven't yet been made public.

I therefore suggest bringing up things constructively that you would like to see in any Atlantic-related campaign: stay away from "rivet counting" and think in terms of the overall campaign, and let modders (current and future) take a look at your wishlist and see what it is you folks would like to see.

Thanks!

Pablo

[Jaeger]

Originally Posted by csengoi

And what about KM grid on the Atlantic, and type XXI uboot? Will them also implemented?

what about the grid? are there any chances to get this really appreciated feature in the atlantic theatre in sh4?

[Rockin Robbins]

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

Not in SH3 either, looks like you didn't play it in a while RR :p

Yup, you're right! It's been several months. Sensors have been rebalanced? I know that is always a struggle the way really bothersome parameters are hardcoded. You end up making an unrealistic adjustment in something you CAN adjust to make a desired effect on what you can't. All mods have it somewhere. Operation Monsun surely has compromises somewhere and I'll bet Lurker will be bright enough to let us discover them by accident.

Compromises do not detract from a mod. They reveal the ingenuity that lies beneath the surface.

[Rockin Robbins]

Originally Posted by tHy

They propably will, sometime...

and not a single mod shows the awesome depth of the "big" SH3 mods like GWX which in their latest versions are so filled with scenic depth and accuracy giving the game "the real feeling". That's something you can't get for SH4 atm in a package, you have to do the dirty work yourxelf and mix up masses of mods to achieve a somewhat close atmosphere.

Don't get me wrong, I also started playing SH4 for real again only after OM finally arrived, and finally some terrific visual and audial mods are avaible too to bring immersion in a technical way completely unable to achieve with SH3 engine, but the detailed and long work on campaigns and subs is missing up to now (understandable, the SH3 community now had several more years of time to work on it , and I have no doubt that SH4 will be enhanced and kept alive by the modding community for also several years (better said, at least until SH5 arrives ).

I just hope that SH3 does not suffer for the U-Boat addition to SH4. I consider these games co-equals, but it is apparent that Ubi does not, and sees SH4 as a replacement for SH3. I think that's a very unfortunate decision. I would have purchased SH3½ in a flash if the intent was to equalize the graphics levels of the two games.

[TDK1044]

The GWX guys (and many others) have done an amazing job with Silent Hunter 3, but there comes a point where without enhancements offered from the publisher, the game reaches the 'as good as it gets' stage. I think Silent Hunter 3 is pretty much at that point.

The U Boat development of Silent Hunter 4 on the other hand is in its infancy. Lurker's Beta mod is a big step in the right direction, and he and the GWX guys deserve a lot of credit for the work they are doing with Silent Hunter 4.

To have both a Pacific fleet boat campaign and a U Boat Atlantic campaign within the same game is awesome to me. I look forward to many future mods.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by tHy

They propably will, sometime...

and not a single mod shows the awesome depth of the "big" SH3 mods like GWX which in their latest versions are so filled with scenic depth and accuracy giving the game "the real feeling". That's something you can't get for SH4 atm in a package, you have to do the dirty work yourxelf and mix up masses of mods to achieve a somewhat close atmosphere.

That is in the process of changing; and I'm not talking about the fact that the GWX guys are starting to look at SH4, though that's a part of it.

Remember when SH3 was a year old. Many mods had been made, and the first supermods like RUB were out. That got advanced and taken far beyond its original self in NYGM, the first GW was released, and now we have even further advance versions of those plus the brilliant WAC.

Monsun, Trigger Maru, RSRD and RFB are all great, but from what I've seen SH4 really is still in its early stages. The people who continue to develop those are the pioneers, and look at what Rubini, Racerboy and friends did after they looked at SH4 and said "Hey! We can make that work in SH3 too!" Now people are asking which would be more beneficial: try to back-date SH4's crew management and transparent water into SH3 or just apply that knowledge, talent and experience to SH4 and be done with it? And the GWX team working in SH4 can't hurt, either.

Having access to the internal workings would be a nice thing for UBISoft to grant, but even if that never happens the future of this game system is just beginning, and looking very bright. I just hope I'm around to have fun with most of it.

[Wilcke]

Thanks Steve, for also naming the other great additional mods available for SH3. I personally think NYGM is an astounding achievement. This man's opinion and I have been there and tried them all.

At this time SH4 also offers the simmer a great experience in Fleet Boats and in U-Boats. My advise jump in and try them all you cannot go wrong. The best thing is that there are some really neat things coming down the pipeline for SH4! Well 'nuff said and keep it all on the positive side.

Happy Hunting guys!

[tHy]

I'm sorry if my post appeared to be rude towards certain mods or something. I tried to make clear that the difference in quality is only natural, looking at the additional years the modders had with SH3.

I'm totally aware (and I think I stated so) that SH4 has a tremendous potential (even though there are many flaws in the engine which make modding difficult. I'm eagerly awaiting the masses of cool mods and modpacks surely to come . Constructive criticism is reserved for the mod-related threads, a "Critize whatever you wish in whatever mod you wish" seems very unhelpful as probably no modmaker would read all that...

[Adriatico]

Originally Posted by csengoi

First of all: I was a big big fan of SH3. I loved it. When SH4 arrived, I was amazed of the new shiny graphics, and got excited, but the Pacific theater with american Uboats prevented me from playing. Them I've started to wait patiently for the Atlantic/German release. When I heard UBoot mission is coming I cheared, but it was a disappointment. I've started to wait again, this time for the community (mainly GWX team) to give us back the great Atlantic dynamic campaign. And now it is on it's way to become true.
So could someone enumerate the things are worse/missing from SH4 (OP munsun) compare to SH3?

I am sure that the most of us have the same mixed feelings...

One thing is still unclear:

- Are there any GWX projects for SH4 ?
- Do they still exist as a team ?
- Is it just "giving a hand" to a new SH4 Atlantic creators, on personal bases ?

Wolfpack is "running silent"... and "alpha male" seems to be retired ?

[Rockin Robbins]

Originally Posted by Adriatico

One thing is still unclear:

- Are there any GWX projects for SH4 ?
- Do they still exist as a team ?
- Is it just "giving a hand" to a new SH4 Atlantic creators, on personal bases ?

Wolfpack is "running silent"... and "alpha male" seems to be retired ?

Please reference Mark Twain's comments on the same subject, commenting on rumors of his demise...

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by Adriatico

One thing is still unclear:

- Are there any GWX projects for SH4 ?
- Do they still exist as a team ?
- Is it just "giving a hand" to a new SH4 Atlantic creators, on personal bases ?

Wolfpack is "running silent"... and "alpha male" seems to be retired ?

Already announced weeks ago; GWX for SH4 is in developement and updates will be very few if any before the release.