Thermal Layer - Sweet Spot?

Murphy · 03-14-08, 12:01 PM

Has anyone found the 'sweet spot' in the thermal layer.
Exactly how far up or down, from the notification?
I'm laying about 4-5 feet below the depth the crewman identifys as the thermal layer....but I'm guessing. Anyone know for sure?

M. Sarsfield · 03-14-08, 12:24 PM

Depends on where they had the sensor on the sub... or in our case, where the game notifies you. I would recommend going about 60 feet below the thermal to get the whole boat below it. I'm guessing that you get the alert based on the depth under the keel reading.

Midnight Hunter · 03-14-08, 12:31 PM

Agreed... I just assumed when they called the thermal layer it was reading off the keel as well. Better safe than sorry I always say

Rockin Robbins · 03-14-08, 02:59 PM

The deeper the better! This also buys you time to run out from under the ashcans as they fall.

I yo-yo in the evasion phase too. Every once in awhile I'll come all the way up to periscope depth, poke a scope up and see if I can catch a DD stopped and listening for me. If he's there, point and shoot! AoB zero, speed zero, aim the scope, press send bearing/range (range doesn't matter) and swim a fish his way.

Bet he's surprised! Go deep again and enter evasion stage 2. You'll notice the remaining bad guys are a bit more timid now. And you only used one torpedo!

Murphy · 03-14-08, 04:37 PM

Ya know Rocky....I been reading your stuff.
I've never tried this in SH4....I used to shoot like that in SHIII, but I don't remember how I did it so fast.
Have to give this a try.....sounds simple. But I've just mastered the time consuming plot, spot, and keep adjusting till it's right in the battle/nav screen....then shoot. But it's a real time consuming job, and I've been taught to be sitting and waiting for them when they pass by.....so shooting has to be done fast.....to kill more than one tanker. So I'm going to give your method a try....I'll let you know.

About the thermal layer.....I thought you had to be right 'at' the line, not dozens of feet below it. This is good news.

Yup....I'll be knockin' up the difficulty level soon....

Kapitan_Phillips · 03-14-08, 08:52 PM

The bad thing about poking your head up and shooting a torpedo at them is the fact that a good deck watch on the enemy ship can follow a torpedo wake to the source.

And since underwater maneuverability is limited (particularly in early boats), you might be sending them one hell of a hint as to where you are.

V.C. Sniper · 03-15-08, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murphy

Has anyone found the 'sweet spot' in the thermal layer.
Exactly how far up or down, from the notification?
I'm laying about 4-5 feet below the depth the crewman identifys as the thermal layer....but I'm guessing. Anyone know for sure?

Deeper

Murphy · 03-15-08, 12:10 AM

Roc - I tried that out, I understand the concept....I just couldn't get the AI to sit still for it....lol.....I kept missing. The torp went where I shot....but I shot where the boat didn't go. All in all, it was a day at the range...I fired a lot of ammo. And I'm sure it will save me some day from a persistent DD or sub chaser coming straight down the pipe....but for shooting straight running troop transports and carriers in a convoy, I hit better with a plot.

I don't use the range finder overlay, I see you don't like it either...I adjust the distance manually, after measurement and verify by going to the nav/attack map....when it's on, I shoot. Same with the AoB, a quick measurement, and verify. Speed I get in three minutes, way ahead of time. I don't usually miss...but it takes time. And I leave the zig zag shots to the guys with more torpedo's than I have....seems when I shoot zig....he zags. And the Captains right....they do get offended, when you miss.

Murphy · 03-15-08, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by V.C. Sniper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murphy

Has anyone found the 'sweet spot' in the thermal layer.
Exactly how far up or down, from the notification?
I'm laying about 4-5 feet below the depth the crewman identifys as the thermal layer....but I'm guessing. Anyone know for sure?

Deeper

Well...yea, why not risk a guess as to the 'best' deeper?

10' below the layer is as good as 110' below?

Or is there a sweet spot?
Anyone ever checked?

Rockin Robbins · 03-15-08, 08:20 AM

Rocky huh? Let me try that one out: That's not a rabbit, Bullwinkle! Yeah, works pretty good!:rotfl:

Escorts are nasty to shoot at. If you're doing the down the throat or up the poop chute attack they're so small! And a spread is three probable misses instead of one. Then, the noses of DDs are overly armored in SH4 so you might not stop them even if you hit. Shooting at those guys is something you do as a last resort.

If you can catch one stopped, then it is no longer last resort, but as kapitan says, they'll follow the trail, so dive immediately when you shoot. Go deep! Don't hang around to look at the pretty explosion, you'll still hear the boom if you hit and you'll still get credit if you're submerged. Take a course away from the torpedo's course too!

It's all a risk/benefits thing. If you can hit one, the others will be less aggressive for awhile, letting you escape. If you have brain-dead escorts up there to begin with, there's less gain. If they're smart there's more risk but more payoff too.

There are no clear answers, maybe just personal preferences. I usually choose to retain the initiative as long as possible. When forced to go deep, I'm looking for an opportunity to return to periscope depth to regain the initiative. When I'm at periscope depth I'm looking for a free shot to take out a pursuer, then to escape, do a new end-around and attack the convoy from the other side. The escorts will stick around your last reported position maybe long enough to let you hit paydirt!

Deeper means one foot before your sub gets crushed like a cockroach.

I exaggerate, but you get the idea. I take my Balao below 500' lots of times. Gives you more time to maneuver out of the way of falling depth charges.

Murphy · 03-15-08, 09:02 AM

Good advice Roc....

Snap shooting will definately come in handy when I'm runnin' for my life.....I'll thank you now for the save, a little ahead of time.

I just started, so I'm in a tambor, "500 feet" would be my grave right now....I'm working on impressing the admiralty and getting a new boat to take me deeper, 1943 campaign out of Brisbane, wonder how long it'll take to impress 'em :hmm: .

03-14-08, 12:01 PM	#1
Murphy Watch Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Michigan, U.S.A. Posts: 28 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Thermal Layer - Sweet Spot? Has anyone found the 'sweet spot' in the thermal layer. Exactly how far up or down, from the notification? I'm laying about 4-5 feet below the depth the crewman identifys as the thermal layer....but I'm guessing. Anyone know for sure? __________________ "Murphy's Law"

03-14-08, 12:24 PM	#2
M. Sarsfield Ace of the Deep Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Tulsa, OK Posts: 1,016 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Depends on where they had the sensor on the sub... or in our case, where the game notifies you. I would recommend going about 60 feet below the thermal to get the whole boat below it. I'm guessing that you get the alert based on the depth under the keel reading. __________________ MJS USS Batfish Volunteer/Reenactor www.ss310.com www.ussbatfish.com Communism killed over 100M people and all that I got was this lousy signature.* *http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/COM.ART.HTM

03-14-08, 02:59 PM	#4
Rockin Robbins Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: DeLand, FL Posts: 8,900 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 52	For difficulty of detection..... The deeper the better! This also buys you time to run out from under the ashcans as they fall. I yo-yo in the evasion phase too. Every once in awhile I'll come all the way up to periscope depth, poke a scope up and see if I can catch a DD stopped and listening for me. If he's there, point and shoot! AoB zero, speed zero, aim the scope, press send bearing/range (range doesn't matter) and swim a fish his way. Bet he's surprised! Go deep again and enter evasion stage 2. You'll notice the remaining bad guys are a bit more timid now. And you only used one torpedo! __________________ Sub Skipper's Bag of Tricks, Slightly Subnuclear Mk 14 & Cutie, Slightly Subnuclear Deck Gun, EZPlot 2.0, TMOPlot, TMOKeys, SH4CMS

03-14-08, 04:37 PM	#5
Murphy Watch Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Michigan, U.S.A. Posts: 28 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Ya know Rocky....I been reading your stuff. I've never tried this in SH4....I used to shoot like that in SHIII, but I don't remember how I did it so fast. Have to give this a try.....sounds simple. But I've just mastered the time consuming plot, spot, and keep adjusting till it's right in the battle/nav screen....then shoot. But it's a real time consuming job, and I've been taught to be sitting and waiting for them when they pass by.....so shooting has to be done fast.....to kill more than one tanker. So I'm going to give your method a try....I'll let you know. About the thermal layer.....I thought you had to be right 'at' the line, not dozens of feet below it. This is good news. Yup....I'll be knockin' up the difficulty level soon.... __________________ "Murphy's Law"

03-14-08, 08:52 PM	#6
Kapitan_Phillips Silent Hunter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Swansea Posts: 3,903 Downloads: 204 Uploads: 0	The bad thing about poking your head up and shooting a torpedo at them is the fact that a good deck watch on the enemy ship can follow a torpedo wake to the source. And since underwater maneuverability is limited (particularly in early boats), you might be sending them one hell of a hint as to where you are. __________________ Well, here's another nice mess you've gotten me into.

03-14-08, 12:31 PM	#3
Midnight Hunter Mate Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 56 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Agreed... I just assumed when they called the thermal layer it was reading off the keel as well. Better safe than sorry I always say

03-15-08, 12:10 AM	#8
Murphy Watch Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Michigan, U.S.A. Posts: 28 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Roc - I tried that out, I understand the concept....I just couldn't get the AI to sit still for it....lol.....I kept missing. The torp went where I shot....but I shot where the boat didn't go. All in all, it was a day at the range...I fired a lot of ammo. And I'm sure it will save me some day from a persistent DD or sub chaser coming straight down the pipe....but for shooting straight running troop transports and carriers in a convoy, I hit better with a plot. I don't use the range finder overlay, I see you don't like it either...I adjust the distance manually, after measurement and verify by going to the nav/attack map....when it's on, I shoot. Same with the AoB, a quick measurement, and verify. Speed I get in three minutes, way ahead of time. I don't usually miss...but it takes time. And I leave the zig zag shots to the guys with more torpedo's than I have....seems when I shoot zig....he zags. And the Captains right....they do get offended, when you miss. __________________ "Murphy's Law"

03-15-08, 08:20 AM	#10
Rockin Robbins Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: DeLand, FL Posts: 8,900 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 52	Hehehehe! Rocky huh? Let me try that one out: That's not a rabbit, Bullwinkle! Yeah, works pretty good!:rotfl: Escorts are nasty to shoot at. If you're doing the down the throat or up the poop chute attack they're so small! And a spread is three probable misses instead of one. Then, the noses of DDs are overly armored in SH4 so you might not stop them even if you hit. Shooting at those guys is something you do as a last resort. If you can catch one stopped, then it is no longer last resort, but as kapitan says, they'll follow the trail, so dive immediately when you shoot. Go deep! Don't hang around to look at the pretty explosion, you'll still hear the boom if you hit and you'll still get credit if you're submerged. Take a course away from the torpedo's course too! It's all a risk/benefits thing. If you can hit one, the others will be less aggressive for awhile, letting you escape. If you have brain-dead escorts up there to begin with, there's less gain. If they're smart there's more risk but more payoff too. There are no clear answers, maybe just personal preferences. I usually choose to retain the initiative as long as possible. When forced to go deep, I'm looking for an opportunity to return to periscope depth to regain the initiative. When I'm at periscope depth I'm looking for a free shot to take out a pursuer, then to escape, do a new end-around and attack the convoy from the other side. The escorts will stick around your last reported position maybe long enough to let you hit paydirt! Deeper means one foot before your sub gets crushed like a cockroach. I exaggerate, but you get the idea. I take my Balao below 500' lots of times. Gives you more time to maneuver out of the way of falling depth charges. __________________ Sub Skipper's Bag of Tricks, Slightly Subnuclear Mk 14 & Cutie, Slightly Subnuclear Deck Gun, EZPlot 2.0, TMOPlot, TMOKeys, SH4CMS

03-15-08, 09:02 AM	#11
Murphy Watch Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Michigan, U.S.A. Posts: 28 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Good advice Roc.... Snap shooting will definately come in handy when I'm runnin' for my life.....I'll thank you now for the save, a little ahead of time. I just started, so I'm in a tambor, "500 feet" would be my grave right now....I'm working on impressing the admiralty and getting a new boat to take me deeper, 1943 campaign out of Brisbane, wonder how long it'll take to impress 'em :hmm: . __________________ "Murphy's Law"