Suicidal ASW ships

[Wreford-Brown]

Has anyone else noticed Allied ships that depth charge themselves in shallow water? I ran into an ASW trawler inside Dover and it blew itself up (and about 200ft into the air!). I also got caught by four DDs inside Scapa after sinking the Illustrious. Three of them blew their own depth charge crews off the boat (which meant they couldn't depth charge me) and the fourth sunk itself doing the same thing. The three without charges then ran themselves ashore on an island allowing me to pick two of them off while the third holed itself on the island and sank.

I was happy to escape, but didn't think that DD crews were this suicidal. If it keeps happening, I'll risk the mines and nets and you'll find me building up tonnage inside Allied ports every mission!

[KeptinCranky]

Yes they tend to do that, unfortunately, you can get them to do this in deep water too by staying very shallow and dodging at the absolute last moment.

It's just one of those AI problems... I try not to exploit it too much, although I did during testing, repeatedly , had to check those ports out

Realistically those ASW trawlers and other improvised warships weren't really capable of making enough speed to get away from their own DCs in such ocassions.

a quote(ish) from an American I saw on discovery channel on patrolling early 1942

"the yacht we were on had 2 depthcharges strapped to the stern, I'm glad we never saw an actual uboat, because if they hadn't blown us away we would have blown ourselves up..."

:hmm:

[Wreford-Brown]

Originally Posted by KeptinCranky

Yes they tend to do that, unfortunately, you can get them to do this in deep water too by staying very shallow and dodging at the absolute last moment.

It's just one of those AI problems... I try not to exploit it too much, although I did during testing, repeatedly , had to check those ports out

Realistically those ASW trawlers and other improvised warships weren't really capable of making enough speed to get away from their own DCs in such ocassions.

a quote(ish) from an American I saw on discovery channel on patrolling early 1942

"the yacht we were on had 2 depthcharges strapped to the stern, I'm glad we never saw an actual uboat, because if they hadn't blown us away we would have blown ourselves up..."

:hmm:

It's the dodging at the last moment that's the difficult bit . I found that DDs try and approach from the stern so going from silent running to full ahead and executing a 180 degree turn usually means you're out of depth charge range (just) when they go into the water. Took some damage to rear torpedo tubes but only lost 6% hull during the chase with 4 DDs.
If it's historically accurate then all's well, but I think I'll join you in not exploiting it too much.

[KeptinCranky]

Minor but fairly significant caution: don't do this with DDs, they're too fast, try it with DEs and Corvettes and trawlers and such, ideally in rough weather

the dodging as follows:

Set depth 17 meters, he won't be able to ram you, Go to 5 knots, he knows where you are anyway...

when he begins his run, set to flank, set rudder 10 degrees away from his course, watch with a periscope... then when he's almost on top of you, you can see the bow, go hard port or starboard away from the ship. and dive hard...this will usually result in the DCS missing you or causing slight damage to the stern but taking the DD out.

Oh and if he has Hedgehogs you're toast, but then you knew that

this is about 50% succesful in taking out his dc racks, but probably won't sink the ship, I've seen that only once

[Wreford-Brown]

I was more successful in forcing them to run aground. Some of the islands inside Scapa have 15m depth within 100m of them, so by turning hard on the corners they ran themselves ashore as they try to follow me.
I've had similar results inside most ports, only leaving me with the stationary warships to sink before going for the merchants with deck gun. It works fine early on, but I'm sure it will be suicidal later in the war when merchants are armed.

[KeptinCranky]

Ummm, I do NOT surface in enemy ports, ever, at all, well except Liverpool, once, to get some air, but that was during beta testing and doesn't count, no Dead is Dead

The reason for my caution will become apparent very quickly if you do, but I'll leave that for you to find out....

[Wreford-Brown]

I'm only into May 1940 so the port defences are still weak.
Dead is Dead, so I'll take the advice of a more experienced Kaleun and stick to torpedoes if I decide to do another run into port.

Thanks for the advice - you may have saved my bacon!

[trongey]

I've had a few patrol boats sink themselves in the Channel, but I was busy at the moment and didn't see exactly how they accomplished the feat. They weren't DCing so I was wondering if there's some way that they can shoot themselves with the machine gun.

[Wreford-Brown]

There were three MTBs inside Portsmouth and I managed to get them to fire at each other by positioning my u-boat at a distance with the observation periscope up. Two of them were sunk by 'friendly fire' leaving the third for my deck gun from a distance.

The bottom line is - the AI in GWX 2.0 is not concerned about shooting their own side.

[Jonathan]

Is this why I have seen PT boats blow up and run on the beach for no apparent reason? I know that I am awesome...but I did not reckon that I was good enough to make boats blow up using "mind bullets"

[Wreford-Brown]

I've just been checking a similar thread and you can also get surface ships to engage each other.
If you are being chased by a number of warships and surface briefly next to one of them, you will be fired at but there is a good chance that the ship you've surfaced next to will also get hit. This ship will automatically think that the one that fired at it is an enemy and shoot back. Other Kaleuns have used this to escape from multiple ships as they will take each other on until there is only one (usually badly damaged) left.
Not a good idea if you play Dead is Dead as it really is your last option.

[bigboywooly]

Originally Posted by Wreford-Brown

The bottom line is - the AI in GWX 2.0 is not concerned about shooting their own side.

Tis hardcoded from stock

[Blacklight]

I once surfaced in a neutral harbor and found an allied ship docked there, parked next to another ship. I accidentally hit the other ship with my deck canon. Next thing I know, there are several ships (mostly armed trawlers) shooting cannons at me from all directions. Apparently, one ship hit another and the hit ship went on a rampage shooting at the ship that shot it. With all the shots going between those two ships, eventually, other ships in the port were hit and pretty much all the harbor defenses were all shooting at each other in a free for all. So much so that I was able to drive out ON THE SURFACE without them noticing.

[joea]

Originally Posted by bigboywooly

Tis hardcoded from stock

Yes, I recall complaints from when SH3 first came out as well!!

[bigboywooly]

Originally Posted by joea

Yes, I recall complaints from when SH3 first came out as well!!

Twas evident from the academy
Cant remember which training mission but the 2 Brit escorts open fire on each other for no reason in that