Hardcore playing and the chronometer

[Payoff]

I agree with the OP. The stop watch works fine for me manually, which is all I care to do with it. The problem as I see it is the lack of ship lengths in the on board recognition manual without relying on a mod for this information.

[btaft]

Quote:
When confronting a convoy, we don't have the time to to do all the necessary calculations and/or funtions ourselves, (without pausing the game anyway). And pausing kinda takes away from realism in the first place. So, I feel the chronometer is an important feature and it is an "advertised" feature of the game and I feel Ubi has broken a contract if it is not implemented.

I do not understand this post here. Convoy tracking can take hours to set up properly. The nessary calculation are not that difficult. You have plenty of time to set it up. All the vessels are making the same kts, all are at the same AOB(relative) the only difference is range for each vessel. In all reality you are not going to sink the entire convoy in one afternoon. It takes days of end rounds. Expect to sink at least 2-4 vessels at best. Retreat and regroup. So you send of 2 torps, swing scope to next vessel in line, check range fire 2 torps and use the final 2 torps for the next vessel in the line after range check. All you are changing is the range. Go deep and wait!

As a feature, chronometer is broken. I tried it. Is it a game killer, no...IMHO.

Not only that but for most Convoy intercepts (particularly in SH4) you are told the convoy's speed anyways via a message. Under these circumstances I don't even bother with the clock.....just take a few sightings to establish the course.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Payoff

I agree with the OP. The stop watch works fine for me manually, which is all I care to do with it. The problem as I see it is the lack of ship lengths in the on board recognition manual without relying on a mod for this information.

Part of the 1.3 fix per Dan if I'm not mistaken. Let see how that goes.

[AVGWarhawk]

Not only that but for most Convoy intercepts (particularly in SH4) you are told the convoy's speed anyways via a message. Under these circumstances I don't even bother with the clock.....just take a few sightings to establish the course.

Winging it for the love of sinking vessels. Not only that, get close...reeeaaaalllyy close. Leaves room for some error that will not affect intended outcome If you do not see men walking the deck through your scope....you're not close enough!

[DJSatane]

I noticed they plan to finally fix the broken feature of chronometer speed estimation in 1.3. I am ready to celebrate.

[Soundman]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

I do not understand this post here. Convoy tracking can take hours to set up properly. The nessary calculation are not that difficult. You have plenty of time to set it up. All the vessels are making the same kts, all are at the same AOB(relative) the only difference is range for each vessel. In all reality you are not going to sink the entire convoy in one afternoon. It takes days of end rounds. Expect to sink at least 2-4 vessels at best. Retreat and regroup. So you send of 2 torps, swing scope to next vessel in line, check range fire 2 torps and use the final 2 torps for the next vessel in the line after range check. All you are changing is the range. Go deep and wait!

As a feature, chronometer is broken. I tried it. Is it a game killer, no...IMHO.

Yes I understand the point you are making here, and I mostly agree with you but let me explain...What I'm refering to is after you hit a ship and the convoy begins to break up, they often change speed or even appear to stop completely. I say "appear" because I found out the hard way that from a distance they do seem to be stopped, but they may be slowing to only a knot or two, and if you are firing from a distance and set your speed to zero, you will miss. I'm not speaking of the "setting up" but how much of a scramble it can be when the convoy starts to break up. I suppose we may be splitting hairs here, but my point is, many of us would find the game more enjoyable with a chrono fix and I don't feel using a working chrono is a cheat, rather an enhancement. Sometimes I may wish to do the calculations myself, other times I just want to play captain and give bearing and range and let the crew calculate speed. Bottom line is....everyone has differing opinions on how the game should be played, however MANY of us DO feel short changed without the chrono fix and that is where this issue should lay.

[AVGWarhawk]

Yes I understand the point you are making here, and I mostly agree with you but let me explain...What I'm refering to is after you hit a ship and the convoy begins to break up, they often change speed or even appear to stop completely.

That is the part that is kind of good IMHO. That is why I only choose a few to target, get off as many torps as possible at them so the all hit around the same time. Makes for a bit more of a challenge. Helps prevent the solution from being bad once the ships slow. Some should slow if the torp trail is detected. Actually the AI should be speeding up and zig zagging like mad and this too will ruin your solution. Pick a few and send as many torps to get the job done, regroup and return after the end round.

I say "appear" because I found out the hard way that from a distance they do seem to be stopped, but they may be slowing to only a knot or two, and if you are firing from a distance and set your speed to zero, you will miss.

Been there and done that brother! Discouraging for sure. I now just redial the speed to 1-2 kts and let the torps go! Sometimes you have to throw caution to the wind and let them swim at the best solution you can figure, especially if the convoy has one of the veteran DD. Again, the vessels should be going like mad. I read in another thread the slowing vessels is a bug(per Dan) and looks to be worked on in this patch. Either way, fast or slow vessels, your going to be guessing at this point as you do not have a lot of time to calculate their new speed.

I'm not speaking of the "setting up" but how much of a scramble it can be when the convoy starts to break up. I suppose we may be splitting hairs here, but my point is, many of us would find the game more enjoyable with a chrono fix and I don't feel using a working chrono is a cheat, rather an enhancement.

I never mentioned it was a cheat. I don't know how that got into the conversation and we will leave it at that. The chrono was used during the war and it is a help because, as you said, you are only one person. No hair splitting at all. What is needed is the weapons officer assist like SH3. In SH4 it is all or nothing. I loved weapons officer assist in SH3. Always used it as that what he was there for. Sure, the game might be more enjoyable if the chrono was fixed but after the first vessel is hit, the chrono is pretty much useless. Ships speed up and slow down, to accurately determine speed, you need time to observe the distance covered from point A to point B. The longer you can take the reading the better your calculation. Sometimes hard to do with DD looking for you. So sometimes you just have to give it your best guess.

Sometimes I may wish to do the calculations myself, other times I just want to play captain and give bearing and range and let the crew calculate speed. Bottom line is....everyone has differing opinions on how the game should be played, however MANY of us DO feel short changed without the chrono fix and that is where this issue should lay.

This last one here is were weapons officer assist should come into play. My feeling here is the chrono idea is going south and some assist type interface to calculate speed. Something will be done but I'm not sure at this point. Everyone plays a certain way, never said anyones way is the wrong way, just stated I did not need the chrono and not a game killer for me. Do I feel cheated? No because I can bring up the clock, observe my target, set the clock in motion and then make my second observation when ready. Also, the PK once set up should look the same as what you are seeing in the scope after a period of time. If not, your solution is incorrect and you need to adjust. If the PK showing the outline of the vessel remains constant to your visual, then you are good on solution. If you set up that PK and is dead on you can put the scope down and simply watch the PK. Once in good range fire the torps. So in essense, I really did not know that a broken watch was such an upsetting event concerning the game. Hope they fix it for you.

Anyway, there is some motion to correct something with speed calculation, we just have to sit and wait.

[Soundman]

AVGWarhark,

My apologies.

1) I never meant to imply that you said using the chrono was a cheat. Simply that in reading the forums, some people seem to feel that it is.

2) Thank you for your thorough response to my post. I do find it insightful and helpful.

3) I agree with you 100% that in a certain aspect, the way the convoys presently break up is actually interesting, and although most people may feel it is not realistic in its current state and wish for all ships to speed away and zigzag, I think something in between might be more interesting. In other words, complete randomness. After all, someone in that situation may panic and freeze, who knows?

4) Yes, I also agree with you that the chronograph is going south. The post seems to imply a different kind of implementation for calculating speed, rather than fixing the chronograph. That is perfectly fine with me, as long as there is a reasonable substitute.

5) Thanks for the PK tip, I will keep that in mind, and again, thanks for the thorough reply.

[AVGWarhawk]

1) I never meant to imply that you said using the chrono was a cheat. Simply that in reading the forums, some people seem to feel that it is.

To simply call it a cheat is incorrect in two senses. The watch was used by the real men who were there and calculating speed. Also, as we stated, we are but one person and to handle it all(calculations, navigations, sonar) assistance is nice. This is why I like the weapons officer assist. The sonar man is limited and does not say, hey chief DD on a run to drop DC. We simply can not scream out AOB, speed, range and hope someone does this on the TDC while we steer the sub, etc. You could scream it out but people would look at you funny

2) Thank you for your thorough response to my post. I do find it insightful and helpful.

Sometimes my wife lets me think and be insightful. Not to often....

3) I agree with you 100% that in a certain aspect, the way the convoys presently break up is actually interesting, and although most people may feel it is not realistic in its current state and wish for all ships to speed away and zigzag, I think something in between might be more interesting. In other words, complete randomness. After all, someone in that situation may panic and freeze, who knows?

Randomness is key here. They do need implement the full ahead and zig zag as part of the randomness. I like the mix of good DD and dumb DD. You do not know what you are going to get. Believe me, the good DD know what you are going to get

4) Yes, I also agree with you that the chronograph is going south. The post seems to imply a different kind of implementation for calculating speed, rather than fixing the chronograph. That is perfectly fine with me, as long as there is a reasonable substitute.

Looks like something coming.

5) Thanks for the PK tip, I will keep that in mind, and again, thanks for the thorough reply.

That PK is a very useful tool. As you, my speed calculations (guess) just suck. If that top outline of the target changes ahead or behind my set AOB, my speed is off. Make a 1-2 kt adjustment slower or faster depending on how drastically the outlined target has changed. Observe in a few minute again. If all looks to be the same, you are dead on. Drop the scope, watch your range close and send the torps when comfortable with it. Very cool when you time it with the chrono and hear the hits.

[greyrider]

elanaiba

you know the bugs and you will fix them i have no doubt.

but i would just like to say thanks for two great sub sims.

the trim and ballast systems work the nuts in sh4, and the very hard level is just that, VERY HARD!

i love it!

i have been kamakazied twice now, sub destroyed, but i love it!

you guys have done so good! just a few more fixes, and sh4 will be great!

i never use the watch, nor do i use the tbt at all, and im able to sink between 60 to 80k in an s-boat.

people around here should realize that not everything works in combat,

your rifle jammes in sand, wont shoot, what are you gonna do?

adapt and adjust