[GWX] planes.. aarghhh

johan_d · 05-11-07, 07:53 AM

Now in 1943, and lets say, destroyers are peanuts when you are been hunted with the bloody RAF planes..
They got me more than once, and there are a lot of them, now finally after more going submerged than on the surface, reaching northern Spain.
I wonder how far they can fly from England, and if anyone know their range ?

And, any surving suggestions.. I mean its about time now to fire a torpedo in stead of cat and mouse games with those buzzing flees.

Oh, the creators of this.. damn you!! :rotfl:

rb4door · 05-11-07, 07:56 AM

sounds like some U-Flak retribution is needed

ReallyDedPoet · 05-11-07, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johan_d

Now in 1943, and lets say, destroyers are peanuts when you are been hunted with the bloody RAF planes..
They got me more than once, and there are a lot of them, now finally after more going submerged than on the surface, reaching northern Spain.
I wonder how far they can fly from England, and if anyone know their range ?

And, any surving suggestions.. I mean its about time now to fire a torpedo in stead of cat and mouse games with those buzzing flees.

Oh, the creators of this.. damn you!! :rotfl:

Later in the war, planes were hell

RDP

Jimbuna · 05-11-07, 08:39 AM

Sounds like the in game realism is just about right

ReallyDedPoet · 05-11-07, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimbuna

Sounds like the in game realism is just about right

Yeah big-time, remembering back to when I first played GWX in December, loved this feature, still do. For the first time I felt like I was in an Iron Coffin.

RDP

GoldenRivet · 05-11-07, 09:27 AM

The best strategy i have used is to submerge through most of the biscay crossing... the shallow waters preclude crash dives.

secondly, when your in deeper waters stay submerged to about 40 meters just long enough to use up about 25% of your battery... only surfacing to recharge that 25%.

get the snorkel as soon as you can and stay submerged using the snorkel in short 10 minute bursts to recharge. The allies knew that the U-boats covered a lot of ground on the surface and that by using airplanes to keep them submerged the range and attack capability of the U-boats was greatly impacted. any look at U-bot fates in U-boats.net will reveal that most U-boats were victims of air attacks.

U-Flak is good too but only if you are faced with something like a swordfish bomber. on the other hand if you try and use the U-flak against a couple of mosquitoes you will be woefully dissapointed in how quickly your U-boat sinks after a rocket attack.

Umfuld · 05-11-07, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johan_d

I wonder how far they can fly from England, and if anyone know their range ?

The map that comes with SHIII shows the air coverage in 1943 to be quite extensive. Again, that's just the stock air coverage.

STEED · 05-11-07, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rb4door

sounds like some U-Flak retribution is needed

Your joking they will inflict nasty damage and I know that for a fact.

Jimbuna · 05-11-07, 12:55 PM

Quote:

any look at U-bot fates in U-boats.net will reveal that most U-boats were victims of air attacks.

I beg to differ kaleun

It was a close run thing but ships were the biggest causation factor according to your source :hmm:

http://uboat.net/fates/losses/cause.htm

Avatar · 05-11-07, 01:34 PM

I'm new to sh3 and have been on 3 patrols, I dont know if you know this, but the map that came with the game is in the upper left-hand corner of the chart table. You just have to click and drag it so that you can view the entire map. This was wonderful to discover as the convoy routes are listed and the a/c patrol ranges are listed.

Jimbuna · 05-11-07, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avatar

I'm new to sh3 and have been on 3 patrols, I dont know if you know this, but the map that came with the game is in the upper left-hand corner of the chart table. You just have to click and drag it so that you can view the entire map. This was wonderful to discover as the convoy routes are listed and the a/c patrol ranges are listed.

Thanks for the 'heads up' but it has been mentione in the past

johan_d · 05-11-07, 03:29 PM

Great advise, but it still doesnt make them go away! lol..

Well, I do not wish to use the 25% rule, I stick to the 50% rule. Why? what if I encouter destroyers of targets? 25% is too less to survive. Keeping that extra 25% ready for emergencies is my tactic now.

The problem is, with all those planes my batteries cannot recharge, every time they recharge to the point I was before, another plane comes in. dive, use battery power, plane goes away, surface, recharge, bang.. another plane.

The flak.. well I learned my lesson, never use them, useless. I only want to use it when diving isnt an option due drained batteries.. otherwise, dive dive dive.. euh. TAUCHEN!

Main issue, is that it is hard to travel a reasonable distance. Last night I was forced to give up a persued on some merchants due the bloody planes. Can I ever fire a torpedo?

They DO fly at night, not as regulary, but they are plenty..

So, from now on its no more fun I guess!

PS: Jimbuna, I hate you!, you spoiled my greed for tonnage!

Kpt. Lehmann · 05-11-07, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johan_d

Great advise, but it still doesnt make them go away! lol..

Well, I do not wish to use the 25% rule, I stick to the 50% rule. Why? what if I encouter destroyers of targets? 25% is too less to survive. Keeping that extra 25% ready for emergencies is my tactic now.

The problem is, with all those planes my batteries cannot recharge, every time they recharge to the point I was before, another plane comes in. dive, use battery power, plane goes away, surface, recharge, bang.. another plane.

The flak.. well I learned my lesson, never use them, useless. I only want to use it when diving isnt an option due drained batteries.. otherwise, dive dive dive.. euh. TAUCHEN!

Main issue, is that it is hard to travel a reasonable distance. Last night I was forced to give up a persued on some merchants due the bloody planes. Can I ever fire a torpedo?

They DO fly at night, not as regulary, but they are plenty..

So, from now on its no more fun I guess!

PS: Jimbuna, I hate you!, you spoiled my greed for tonnage!

Welcome to the painful world of being a U-boat captain.

At least when we die in-game... it doesn't hurt.

I recommend getting a snorkel as soon as it is available. However, even that is not radar-proof.

If your batteries are taxed from having to stay submerged for long periods of time... it sounds like we've done our job properly.

johan_d · 05-11-07, 05:16 PM

on the ocean, no schnorckel, and did i told you that I hate you? :rotfl:

GoldenRivet · 05-11-07, 05:31 PM

Johan D...

As far as the air power keeping the U-boats submerged for a majority of their late war life goes thats pretty accurate, i mean the allies figured if they got lucky and cought a U-boat on the surface and could sink her thats great but the main purpose of the air strategy thinking is as follows

1. the allies knew that the underwater speed of the U-boats was greatly reduced

2. the allies knew that the underwater range of the U-boats was greatly reduced

3. the allies knew that there was currently no known u-boat that could stay submerged forever

4. the strategy of using ships to hunt u-boats wouldnt work because the u-boat almost always had the advantage and could either sneak in to attack or sneak away etc.

the only answer at the time for the allies was using airplanes. they were fast, they had long range, early on the only way for a u-boat to detect an airplane was to see or hear it. seeing an airplane is difficult because until it is on you it is a speck in the sky... also looking in the direction of the sound to spot an airplane doesnt always work because it takes time for the sound to reach you... planes could hide in overcast layers or even glide down onto their victims without ever being detected.

Because of airplanes, from 1943 onward U-boats rarely traveled on the surface... for the u-boats this meant it would take much much longer to reach the shipping lanes... for the allies this meant that more convoys could get through the danger zones before u-boats had a chance to arrive on station.

according to several books i have read or have seen quoted after 1943 it was virtually impossible to even leave port and cross the bay of biscay without facing several air attacks. anyone attempting to run on the surface after 1943 would literally be crash diving every few hours - an exhausting thing to have to go through - either that or they would quite simply be bombed and killed.

early in the war night time air patrols were a non existant thing, a U-boat commander could just about guarantee safe passage by cruising on the surface at night. since there were no radar equipped aircraft the pilots and gunners and bombardiers were the only source for detecting a U-boat... unless you are a flyer over the ocean at night looking for a brightly lit up party barge shooting off fireworks you wouldnt have a hoot in hell of finding anything with your naked eyes - least of all an unlighted u-boat sitting low in the water.

but two specific advances in technology made night searches possible for airplanes. Radar, which could pinpoint the exact location of even something as small as a periscope mast in a calm sea... and the leigh light which was a powerful 20+ million candel power spot light. basically the aircraft would set up an attack on the "radar blip" and when they got to within a specific range of the "blip" on goes the spot light usually shining right on a surprised U-boat crew. the fortunate thing for the U-boats as small as a fortune as it might have been was that not all airplanes were equipped with the combination radar and leigh light therfore the night searches though still lethal did not occur nearly as often as the day searches.

to get a sense of what GWX is trying to do, i think you should take a look at these estimates i borrowed from U-boats.net...

1939 - 9 u-boats lost
1940 - 24 u-boats lost
1941 - 35 u-boats lost
1942 - 86 u-boats lost
1943 - and here is where it gets rough on the u-boats ... 242 u-boats lost
1944 -250 u-boats lost
1945 - 120 u-boats lost by the first 5 months of '45

so as you can see the odds stack up against the u-boats severely after the winter of 1942 spring of 1943. and if one consideres the number of men on each boat - you could consider yourself a VAST minority to be a survivor of ww2 as a U-boat sailor.

05-11-07, 07:53 AM	#1
johan_d Samurai Navy Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 556 Downloads: 113 Uploads: 1	[GWX] planes.. aarghhh Now in 1943, and lets say, destroyers are peanuts when you are been hunted with the bloody RAF planes.. They got me more than once, and there are a lot of them, now finally after more going submerged than on the surface, reaching northern Spain. I wonder how far they can fly from England, and if anyone know their range ? And, any surving suggestions.. I mean its about time now to fire a torpedo in stead of cat and mouse games with those buzzing flees. Oh, the creators of this.. damn you!! :rotfl:

05-11-07, 08:39 AM	#4
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,525 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	Sounds like the in game realism is just about right __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

05-11-07, 09:27 AM	#6
GoldenRivet Subsim Aviator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 8,726 Downloads: 146 Uploads: 0	The best strategy i have used is to submerge through most of the biscay crossing... the shallow waters preclude crash dives. secondly, when your in deeper waters stay submerged to about 40 meters just long enough to use up about 25% of your battery... only surfacing to recharge that 25%. get the snorkel as soon as you can and stay submerged using the snorkel in short 10 minute bursts to recharge. The allies knew that the U-boats covered a lot of ground on the surface and that by using airplanes to keep them submerged the range and attack capability of the U-boats was greatly impacted. any look at U-bot fates in U-boats.net will reveal that most U-boats were victims of air attacks. U-Flak is good too but only if you are faced with something like a swordfish bomber. on the other hand if you try and use the U-flak against a couple of mosquitoes you will be woefully dissapointed in how quickly your U-boat sinks after a rocket attack. __________________

05-11-07, 05:31 PM	#15
GoldenRivet Subsim Aviator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 8,726 Downloads: 146 Uploads: 0	Johan D... As far as the air power keeping the U-boats submerged for a majority of their late war life goes thats pretty accurate, i mean the allies figured if they got lucky and cought a U-boat on the surface and could sink her thats great but the main purpose of the air strategy thinking is as follows 1. the allies knew that the underwater speed of the U-boats was greatly reduced 2. the allies knew that the underwater range of the U-boats was greatly reduced 3. the allies knew that there was currently no known u-boat that could stay submerged forever 4. the strategy of using ships to hunt u-boats wouldnt work because the u-boat almost always had the advantage and could either sneak in to attack or sneak away etc. the only answer at the time for the allies was using airplanes. they were fast, they had long range, early on the only way for a u-boat to detect an airplane was to see or hear it. seeing an airplane is difficult because until it is on you it is a speck in the sky... also looking in the direction of the sound to spot an airplane doesnt always work because it takes time for the sound to reach you... planes could hide in overcast layers or even glide down onto their victims without ever being detected. Because of airplanes, from 1943 onward U-boats rarely traveled on the surface... for the u-boats this meant it would take much much longer to reach the shipping lanes... for the allies this meant that more convoys could get through the danger zones before u-boats had a chance to arrive on station. according to several books i have read or have seen quoted after 1943 it was virtually impossible to even leave port and cross the bay of biscay without facing several air attacks. anyone attempting to run on the surface after 1943 would literally be crash diving every few hours - an exhausting thing to have to go through - either that or they would quite simply be bombed and killed. early in the war night time air patrols were a non existant thing, a U-boat commander could just about guarantee safe passage by cruising on the surface at night. since there were no radar equipped aircraft the pilots and gunners and bombardiers were the only source for detecting a U-boat... unless you are a flyer over the ocean at night looking for a brightly lit up party barge shooting off fireworks you wouldnt have a hoot in hell of finding anything with your naked eyes - least of all an unlighted u-boat sitting low in the water. but two specific advances in technology made night searches possible for airplanes. Radar, which could pinpoint the exact location of even something as small as a periscope mast in a calm sea... and the leigh light which was a powerful 20+ million candel power spot light. basically the aircraft would set up an attack on the "radar blip" and when they got to within a specific range of the "blip" on goes the spot light usually shining right on a surprised U-boat crew. the fortunate thing for the U-boats as small as a fortune as it might have been was that not all airplanes were equipped with the combination radar and leigh light therfore the night searches though still lethal did not occur nearly as often as the day searches. to get a sense of what GWX is trying to do, i think you should take a look at these estimates i borrowed from U-boats.net... 1939 - 9 u-boats lost 1940 - 24 u-boats lost 1941 - 35 u-boats lost 1942 - 86 u-boats lost 1943 - and here is where it gets rough on the u-boats ... 242 u-boats lost 1944 -250 u-boats lost 1945 - 120 u-boats lost by the first 5 months of '45 so as you can see the odds stack up against the u-boats severely after the winter of 1942 spring of 1943. and if one consideres the number of men on each boat - you could consider yourself a VAST minority to be a survivor of ww2 as a U-boat sailor. __________________

05-11-07, 07:56 AM	#2
rb4door Machinist's Mate Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: St Naz Posts: 129 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	sounds like some U-Flak retribution is needed

05-11-07, 01:34 PM	#10
Avatar Commodore Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Way out there Posts: 603 Downloads: 24 Uploads: 0	I'm new to sh3 and have been on 3 patrols, I dont know if you know this, but the map that came with the game is in the upper left-hand corner of the chart table. You just have to click and drag it so that you can view the entire map. This was wonderful to discover as the convoy routes are listed and the a/c patrol ranges are listed.

05-11-07, 03:29 PM	#12
johan_d Samurai Navy Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 556 Downloads: 113 Uploads: 1	Great advise, but it still doesnt make them go away! lol.. Well, I do not wish to use the 25% rule, I stick to the 50% rule. Why? what if I encouter destroyers of targets? 25% is too less to survive. Keeping that extra 25% ready for emergencies is my tactic now. The problem is, with all those planes my batteries cannot recharge, every time they recharge to the point I was before, another plane comes in. dive, use battery power, plane goes away, surface, recharge, bang.. another plane. The flak.. well I learned my lesson, never use them, useless. I only want to use it when diving isnt an option due drained batteries.. otherwise, dive dive dive.. euh. TAUCHEN! Main issue, is that it is hard to travel a reasonable distance. Last night I was forced to give up a persued on some merchants due the bloody planes. Can I ever fire a torpedo? They DO fly at night, not as regulary, but they are plenty.. So, from now on its no more fun I guess! PS: Jimbuna, I hate you!, you spoiled my greed for tonnage!

05-11-07, 05:16 PM	#14
johan_d Samurai Navy Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 556 Downloads: 113 Uploads: 1	on the ocean, no schnorckel, and did i told you that I hate you? :rotfl: