Would you pay more for a greener PC?

[SUBMAN1]

Some data to help clarify:

The benefits of high PF for the user comes from the reduced AC current drawn by high PF PSUs, not in any savings from electricity bills, except in the case of commercial utility users who do pay for V(oltage) x A(mperes). There are two broad consequences:

Less stress on the AC electrical wiring: The lower current drawn by a high PF power supply means that there is less stress on the electrical wiring of the building. This can be a big plus in the case of older building with lower capacity AC wiring. It is certainly easy to see the benefits in a enterprise setting where dozens or hundreds of PCs are drawing power. If the total current load from the IT department could be reduced by 30% or more, this would be very signficant in direct electricity savings, reduced airconditioning cost, and possible avoidance of building AC re-wiring.


Lower UPS costs: Lower current draw also means that smaller capacity Uninterruptible Power Supply (UPS) units can be used. As UPS units are priced in direct proportion to their current capacity (VA), a PF of 0.98 versus one of 0.6 can traslate into a 40% reduction in purchase cost. Again, in an enterprise setting with hundreds or thousands of PCs, the savings can be very significant.

Originally Posted by SUBMAN1

More expensive cars? Last time I checked, a BMW 7 series still costs what it costs back in the late 80's. Cars my friend are getting much cheaper made in my book and trim - is a joke! It is even OK now to show the seam on a leather seat. Things like that. Best cars I think were early to mid 90's. Cars went downlhill from there and tried to compensate by adding electronic gadgets.

-S

Car engines last a lot longer now, they also need a lot less maintainance...and you are joking. Cars now are much more refined (suspension, noise suppression etc) and engines infinitely more powerful and less thirsty.

Have you driven a new car lately?

edit: I forgot SAFER too. Airbags, belt pre-tensioners, NCAP ratings, ABS, EDB, traction control etc etc...

[scandium]

Originally Posted by SUBMAN1

Some of you may already be running a 'Greener PC' without knowing it. I am talking about PSU's that have an Active PFC (Ever seen 99% efficient Active PFC written on the side of a PSU?). Its all great and all in that it uses way less power. Bad news is, most of us here are billed by the kilowatt per hour scale, so even though you are using less power, you are still getting billed the same. Nice huh?

Hmm not really sure about that one. Let's take a couple hypotheticals (with nice round numbers):

#1 PSU is 500W with 80% efficiency and we'll say the average draw from the PC components is 400W so to provide that the PSU needs to draw 500W from the AC mains and therefore each hour it runs the system consumes .5 KWh (20% of which, or 100W is lost due the PSU's inefficiency);

#2 PSU is 500W with 100% efficiency and average draw is again 400W but this time only 400W needs to be drawn from the AC mains and the average consumption is .4 KWh with no loss.

From both examples if you're billed per KWh then #1 PSU is costing you .1 KWh more of electricity for every hour you run it. These examples are a little inflated though as you would need a very high end gaming rig to have that kind of power requirement, and then the high load would only be seen during gaming... plus no PSU is 100% efficient.

[STEED]

Originally Posted by 2019

Only if these machines would be cheaper, more people will become interested.

Good point, if they were cheaper I may buy one.

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by Kurushio

Car engines last a lot longer now, they also need a lot less maintainance...and you are joking. Cars now are much more refined (suspension, noise suppression etc) and engines infinitely more powerful and less thirsty.

Have you driven a new car lately?

edit: I forgot SAFER too. Airbags, belt pre-tensioners, NCAP ratings, ABS, EDB, traction control etc etc...

I am talking build quality and attention to detail. Friend of mine recently left Mercedes because he was disgusted with their build quality of late. I should get him on this forum to really stir things up.

-S

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by scandium

Hmm not really sure about that one. Let's take a couple hypotheticals (with nice round numbers):

#1 PSU is 500W with 80% efficiency and we'll say the average draw from the PC components is 400W so to provide that the PSU needs to draw 500W from the AC mains and therefore each hour it runs the system consumes .5 KWh (20% of which, or 100W is lost due the PSU's inefficiency);

#2 PSU is 500W with 100% efficiency and average draw is again 400W but this time only 400W needs to be drawn from the AC mains and the average consumption is .4 KWh with no loss.

From both examples if you're billed per KWh then #1 PSU is costing you .1 KWh more of electricity for every hour you run it. These examples are a little inflated though as you would need a very high end gaming rig to have that kind of power requirement, and then the high load would only be seen during gaming... plus no PSU is 100% efficient.

I should re-word that to read Power Factor Correction Efficiency, which is different than the Power Supplies overall efficiency.

So if you people don't do anything for nothing, i.e. you wouldn't buy a greener PC unless it cost less...I suppose none of you recycle?

Though you know...that's a selfish attitude. We should all do our part to try and clean up this earth.

selfish gits...

[STEED]

Originally Posted by Kurushio

I suppose none of you recycle?

I do because my council tells me to, a green bin for paper and card a black bin for non coloured glass. A blue bin for coloured glass and a red bin for cans, and there is talk for a bin for garden rubbish, what makes me angry is the cost of all of this.

Bloody Council.

Originally Posted by STEED

I do because my council tells me to, a green bin for paper and card a black bin for non coloured glass. A blue bin for coloured glass and a red bin for cans, and there is talk for a bin for garden rubbish, what makes me angry is the cost of all of this.

Bloody Council.

So is that the only reason you recycle? Not to save the planet? You don't mind flooding, melting polar caps and other general nasties?

...and don't tell me you get a whole BIN for cans and another BIN for bottles...a BOX maybe? How many bloody cans can you get through in a week??

[STEED]

Originally Posted by Kurushio

So is that the only reason you recycle? Not to save the planet? You don't mind flooding, melting polar caps and other general nasties?

...and don't tell me you get a whole BIN for cans and another BIN for bottles...a BOX maybe? How many bloody cans can you get through in a week??

I am not a President or a Prime Minister and so on, you got a problem about the mess of this planet take it up with the world leaders. And yes I got four big plastic bins thank too my council. :p

Originally Posted by STEED

I am not a President or a Prime Minister and so on, you got a problem about the mess of this planet take it up with the world leaders. And yes I got four big plastic bins thank too my council. :p

I bet your kids and your grandkids are happy you think that way. What sort of world are you leaving them?
The front of your drive must look like a dustbin depository. 4 bins is a bit much...

[STEED]

The world is a rubbish dump anyway, go with the flow. :p

Well, let's hope we colonise some other planet pretty soon...so we can start buggering up that one too.

[STEED]

Originally Posted by Kurushio

Well, let's hope we colonise some other planet pretty soon...so we can start buggering up that one too.

That's the spirit.

Face facts, this planet was screwed up by the industrial revolution.