Kilo class rudder design?

speed150mph · 05-21-20, 11:35 AM

Hey everybody, quick question for those of you in the know. I was on Quora today and saw this question asked and the more I think about it the more it makes me wonder. The searches I made came up with nothing.

What is the reasoning behind not having an upper rudder on the kilo class submarine. It has a T-shaped tail with only a lower rudder. I can't think of any performance advantages this could have, but maybe I'm not seeing something?

If anyone has an answer, I'd be interested to know! Thanks

Kapitan · 05-26-20, 05:46 PM

As far as im aware its just not required for manouvering, you have to appreciate that the Russian approach is keep it simple.

The rudder on the kilo are larger in surface area than the lower rudder on the follow on lada, also note the follow on lada operates a towed array system which the kilo does not and this is housed on the top rudder, its streamed through a tube much like the oscar and deltas.

ET2SN · 05-26-20, 07:47 PM

From what I've read, the Kilo and some other diesel boats were based off the basic design of the US Barbel class. I know quite a bit about the Barbel class

and one big issue was that the boat could snap roll at higher speeds, so you could assume that we had too much rudder for our own good.

The other issue also comes down to design. Diesel boats tend to spend most of their time either on or close to the surface (ie, on the snorkel) due to power requirements. So, if you're transiting to your op area while you're surfaced, why do you need that extra rudder?

05-21-20, 11:35 AM	#1
speed150mph Electrician's Mate Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 132 Downloads: 36 Uploads: 0	Kilo class rudder design? Hey everybody, quick question for those of you in the know. I was on Quora today and saw this question asked and the more I think about it the more it makes me wonder. The searches I made came up with nothing. What is the reasoning behind not having an upper rudder on the kilo class submarine. It has a T-shaped tail with only a lower rudder. I can't think of any performance advantages this could have, but maybe I'm not seeing something? If anyone has an answer, I'd be interested to know! Thanks __________________ Americans make better submarines? No my friend, Russia makes better submarines, Americans just make better computers

05-26-20, 05:46 PM	#2
Kapitan Sub Test Pilot Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK + Canada Posts: 7,130 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 7	As far as im aware its just not required for manouvering, you have to appreciate that the Russian approach is keep it simple. The rudder on the kilo are larger in surface area than the lower rudder on the follow on lada, also note the follow on lada operates a towed array system which the kilo does not and this is housed on the top rudder, its streamed through a tube much like the oscar and deltas. __________________ DONT FORGET if you like a post to nominate it by using the blue diamond Find out about Museum Ships here: https://www.museumships.us/ Flickr for all my pictures: https://www.flickr.com/photos/131313936@N03/ Navy general board articles: https://www.navygeneralboard.com/author/aegis/

05-26-20, 07:47 PM	#3
ET2SN Ocean Warrior Join Date: Oct 2017 Posts: 2,652 Downloads: 60 Uploads: 0	From what I've read, the Kilo and some other diesel boats were based off the basic design of the US Barbel class. I know quite a bit about the Barbel class and one big issue was that the boat could snap roll at higher speeds, so you could assume that we had too much rudder for our own good. The other issue also comes down to design. Diesel boats tend to spend most of their time either on or close to the surface (ie, on the snorkel) due to power requirements. So, if you're transiting to your op area while you're surfaced, why do you need that extra rudder?